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  5. "Gracias por haber venido."

"Gracias por haber venido."

Translation:Thank you for having come.

January 3, 2013

186 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CGiattino

"Thank you for coming" and "thank you for having come" have different meanings. One may be more common, but they are both used in their respective circumstances.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Skeenee

Please use "thank you for having come" in a sentence. I have never heard that in my life!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnnRon

"Thank you for having come" IS a sentence. Maybe you want a paragraph that puts that sentence in context.

"We had such a good time chatting with you at our party last night. Thank you for having come."

It's sounds a bit stilted, just as "I am taller than he" sounds stilted, but that doesn't make it incorrect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Winmar

It is a correct sentence, but I've never heard anyone say it!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/billyyo

Stop by. You would hear me say that. It is often used as a greeting for people at a party or similar gathering.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/UbeDaDube

Thanks for coming!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_smiles_

I imagine the "formal" sense of "thank you for having come" in scenarios like the host of a play, an orchestra, or any "stage" act.

Moreover, I think in any situation where a certain "etiquette" is expected (a la a formal party or someone simply wanting to be formal) this sort of phrase would be used.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dennis859795

Yeah, it definitely feels more formal. The situation that jumps into my head when I imagine someone saying that phrase is a person thanking people as they leave a funeral.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luke934966

Definitely the sort of thing that would be said at the start of a formal work conference or some other such event... "Thank you for having come here today to discuss..." blah blah blah here are some power point slides.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/clawedinvader

I really want to give you an answer, but this is a family-friendly site and I can't bring myself to write what I'm thinking of!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kai_Guy

Native of the western US here. It's uncommon and a bit formal, but I have lived long enough to have heard it spoken. It's probably not the way I would speak, however because I'm not stuffy.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/llibllens

It would not be "stuffy" in a formal thank you note.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jyseltz

Only because formality goes so well with stuffiness.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Formality often goes with courtesy.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xainie02

"Thank you for having come despite the awful weather" Although this form is grammatically correct, you are probably likely to hear it only in a very formal or organised scenario in today's world


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marianne.w4

How come mixing infinitive with present perfect


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vessiecakes

There are a lot of arguments about how this sounds "unnatural" (it doesn't to me; uncommon perhaps, but not unnatural) on this sentence and many others, but I think what everyone needs to remember is that the point of this style of learning is to present grammatical concepts and teach their uses without having to endure hours of repetitive conjugations, not necessarily to teach common phrases.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/awefulwaffle

Some common uses of the phrase:

  • Thank you for having come in such large numbers [to this event] or [to support us]
  • Thank you for having come to [specify the event]
  • I wish to thank you for having come to [specify country and event]
  • Thank you for having come out to vote in the elections
  • Thank you for having come to eat at [restaurant]. We are sorry that [you were unhappy with the service/the meal]

Examples with sources:

  • "I thank you for having gone away, and I thank you for having come back."

From p. 189 of the English translation of The Burgomaster's Family: Or, Weal and Woe in a Little World By E C W.van Walrée

  • "I wish you prosperity and thank you for having come here."

From p. 7 of the Appendix to the Journals of the House Representatives of New Zealand, 1886

  • "Thank you, Ernesto, thank you for having come into my life ..."

From The Illegal and the Refugee: An American Love Story, 2014, by Ian Tremblay

  • "I warmly thank you for having come to work with us. In the name of the Church, the Pope is counting a great deal upon you ..."

From The Holy Father's Addresses, 1983


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Brillante. ¡Gracias!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/whigamore1

Interesting examples above and below.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pannychis

i guess it needs a context. 4 days ago it struck me as odd but now i have come to accept it

"Thank you, for having come ... to hold this position"

"Beyond that, having come here ( on duolingo) helped us learn the basics of spanish"

"I thank you for having come to my humble abode"

and the best probably

"Thank you for having come ... so far with me. te amo"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mae_mart

The sentence is perfectly fine. I think people have an issue with it just because it's a bit more formal than we're used to in everyday speech. That doesn't make it incorrect or even outdated. I've heard it used and have used it myself from time to time.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GregAngeli

It's 'having' come because in Spanish the word 'haber' should be translated. The sentence and lesson is present perfect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

And it should be pointed out that "having" in the English sentence is a gerund. Spanish doesn't distinguish between the gerund and infinitive form, so without context "haber" can be translated as "to have" or "having". Trying to put "to have" in this sentence doesn't make any sense, so "having" is the right translation.

Additionally, the gerund functions as a verb within its phrase, but the whole phrase acts as a noun phrase within a sentence. In this case, the phrase "having come" is treated as a noun phrase. Try replacing it with a different noun phrase and notice that it does make sense: "Thank you for your attendance," or "Thank you for the apples."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Felicia78752

THANK YOU! So much drama and this whole time I was just trying to figure out why it was "haber" and not has.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eloiserealtor

just wondering why the use of "haber" instead of he, has, ha or han. Anyone?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

There are a few layers to this answer.

In the equivalent English sentence, the word 'haber' translates to is 'having'. 'Having' is the gerund form of 'to have'. (Duolingo also uses the term 'gerund' to refer to the -ando/-iendo form of a verb in Spanish, which also translates as -ing, but that is the present participle and it is used differently.) The gerund in Spanish has the same form as the infinitive, 'haber', and the function of the gerund (in either language) is to lead a verb phrase that behaves like a noun phrase in the sentence.

Let's look at the gerund phrase: "having come". 'Having', as I said, is a gerund. 'Come' is actually not an infinitive, it's a past participle that happens to be irregular in English. By substituting in a different verb, this is more obvious. "Having written" or "having walked" are equivalent. The second verb is in past participle form because that is how the perfect aspect (of the present perfect, past perfect, etc. tenses) is formed: 'to have'/'haber' followed by a past participle. Think of the sentence "I have written a letter every day this week."/"Yo he escrito una carta cada día esta semana." Usually this construction is the main verb phrase of a sentence, but in "haber venido" it performs a different role.

Therefore, "Thank you for having come" is grammatically equivalent to "Thank you for the cookies" because the gerund phrase "having come" has the same function as the noun phrase "the cookies".

Now look at it in Spanish: "Gracias por haber venido" is equivalent to "Gracias por las galletas" for the same reason.

Now why isn't 'haber' conjugated? Well, how could it be? A gerund is used essentially because the verb isn't acting like a verb. You can't say "yo he", "tú has", "él ha" etc. because the sentence wouldn't make any sense with a subject and verb in that position. "Thank you for you have come"? That could be grammatical, but only if you change the meaning of 'for' to the archaic sense of 'because'. There are a few rules which dictate why 'haber' can't be conjugated here, but the simplest one is that in Spanish, a conjugated verb can never follow a preposition. Prepositions act on noun phrases, not verb phrases, so the verb phrase 'haber venido' has to act like a noun. Solution: gerund.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leighfy7

In this entire mess of "natural/unnatural" English usage blahblahblah, THIS is what I was looking for. Thank you, ErikBoyle.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shirlgirl007

Yes, I had to slog through all those Usage comments, to get to the same question. Seems very few people even noticed the differentiation. So is this sentence actually in the Present Perfect, with the auxiliary forms of haber not evident?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PontusKihl

Thank you Erik for this explanation! It was the most valuable contribution in all the comments.

I was still left wondering though, if this excercise and sentence at all belongs in this section, as Gerundium seems to be something other than the tense we are trying to learn about here (the use of he, has, ha, hemos, han...+ verb /-ido, -ado...).

But I am learning all the same, thanks to people like you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

I think it belongs. This lesson is about learning to use haber in its auxiliary role, and this is one potential way it can be used. As I said, it is a different role than being used as the main verb, but it is one you could encounter, and there's not a much better place to put it in the tree.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Would any native speaker ever say, "Thank you for having come?"

Well, there are these examples:

  • "I just wanted to take the opportunity to say Thank you again for the beautiful rose, but even more for having come in on your day off to do my surgery. – Letter from 'Heidi' to the Northwest Women’s Health Care Center

  • "Thank you so so much for having come to our home, we will never forget it and we recommend this company to absolutely anyone! Thank you again and we will never forget this experience!" -Mercedes, to Fairytale Events, LLC

  • "It would simply provide that there are consequences for having come illegally, for not having followed the legal rules, for not having waited in line...]" Re: Gang of Eight bill, 2013 .

  • "He said it gave him an entirely new feeling of confidence and he thanked me for having come to the [Potsdam] Conference and being present to help him in this way." Sec. of War Henry Stimson, July 21, 1945

  • "I went through security and became very emotional among the souvenirs, berating myself for having come through early when I could have spent another half an hour in the car with you. Mary McDonagh, who lives in the UK . . ., The Irish Times

  • "It's a pleasure to be here today and I thank all of you for having come and your interest in issues of equity in universities." -- Constance Backhouse, a university professor and university research chair at the University of Ottawa, CBC News.

  • "I hope I managed to make a good impression for you all and I thank you for having come at this last paragraph and thus take advantage to wish you all wise choices in any of your future decisions!" – Beatrice Manole, University of Essex

  • "I will wait a moment so that everyone has time to put on their headset. " Thank you for having come. "– Ms. Madeleine Dalphond-Guiral (Laval Centre, BQ) : Hearing, Parliament of Canada

  • "I think I should quickly say goodnight to our CBC audience, and then thank you for having come to the studio tonight." – Music from the Films": A CBC Broadcast

  • “Thank you for coming tonight, thank you for having come for 10 years and thank you for coming, hopefully, 10 more years,” he said. – San Diego Uptown News, Taking the stage for 10 years, April 26th, 2013


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/whigamore1

Yeah, well, I'm sure all these parliamentarians, journalists and politicians have no clue as to what a native English speaker would say. Right?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Thrillwaters

Thank you for having come is definitely correct English usage, but just very uncommon and very formal. I've heard it in court rooms and churches.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/maxinedev

After having been a lawyer in California for 21 years, I remember being late to Court a few times. Not unfrequently, the judge would sarcastically say "thank you for having come today counsel". For that reason, I would never say it like that. I would just say "thank you for coming". The other way brings bad memories.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ElimGarak

The issue is that English doesn't value the present perfect tense, when we morph "having come" into "comming" it ceases to be present perfect. http://www.englishpage.com/verbpage/presentperfect.html this page shows it's proper use in English and it was new to me. We also tend to see it as have or has, not having. "He has come a long way from a freshman, but I'm so proud to watch him graduate college." "We have come for the package." "Thank you for having come over on such short notice, it means a lot to me that you are here."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

I completely disagree. The present perfect is everywhere. I was in a Spanish class with a person from Italy and she once asked why we use the present perfect so often in English and when exactly it should be used.

The "having" intead of "have"/"has" is just because it's a gerund, which makes the verb phrase act like a noun phrase in the sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Chogas

'having come' is a little ackward. I think 'coming' is better translation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dr.Manhattan95

Agreed. Sounds too unnatural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesBlask

Possibly, but we're here to learn Spanish, not English. In Spanish you can say either "Gracias por haber venido" or "Gracias por venir" (thankyou for coming). Both are perfectly fine and sound natural to native speakers.

Everyone needs to stop trying to translate word for word into English and worrying about how natural it sounds. Learn the words, learn how they fit together, and move on to the next lesson!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/s-partridge

If an unnatural English sentence appears, it makes finding the Spanish translation that much more difficult because we first have to decipher the incorrect English. The sentences we are given must make sense in both English and Spanish.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

"Thank you for having come" makes perfect sense in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnnaDunste

Depending on the context it absolutely would. You wouldn't say it at the door greeting your guests, or even saying goodbye to them most likely , but the next day discussing their visit you sure might.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/s-partridge

Who do you know that would say that before "Thank you for coming"? The phrasing in the original sentence sentence is very uncommon, and makes it more complicated than it needs to be.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grace780329

Hola vanw39! Gracias por haber venido o gracias por venir, son correctas las dos frases. Se le dice a un invitado cuando lo recibes y también cuando lo despides, si quieres. Greetings


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gina127652

Yes, it makes sense to me ...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/trashcat4

By Anna's logic it appears to fill a space as past perfect, though


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jessica169003

Exactly. Its not about word for word it's about understanding how to say it appropriately in English in order for us to translate the Spanish version. Both have to make sense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

There is no incorrect English here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/s-partridge

Being grammatically correct doesn't necessarily equate to having a reasonable sentence. The translation provided here can be understood, but it takes more thought than simply saying "Thank you for coming", which is a far, far more common turn of phrase.

"having come" may be used in other contexts, but it is still rather uncommon in this one.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BethF1.

Really I would have never have thought that that was the answer as I have never jeard it used and so I got that wrong on a testout


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikRed1

It is only unnatural sounding because it may be uncommon in your circles, but there are plenty who will commonly use this phrasing in formal situations.

It is an important phrase for people learning english to be aware of.

I'm sure the english for spanish speakers have the exact same questions but in reverse.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ross_Kramer

I think Chogar got the point - As I have understood him he meant the translation itself is awkward, not the Spanish sentence. And totally agree with him that in English "for having come" sounds very awkward. By saying that, I just want to accentuate that those who contributed have just to correct themselves. As to Spanish, nobody pretends to change the rules of that language


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

The translation "Thank you for having come" sounds awkward only to those who didn't have the opportunity to learn the use of present perfect tense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

@Jessica169003 No, that's a straw man argument. Do you think talk to is awkward? Probably not. So does that mean that you always say talk to instead of speak to? Not necessarily. Two constructions can exist in equilibrium, both correct and each used some of the time. That's how language works.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

@Ross_Kramer: By whose edict is it that "in English all turns of speech must look 'English like,' or that "Duolingo is all about contemporary language learning?" And who is to set the bar for that criteria?

You, simply because you have never heard anyone utter a perfectly normal English sentence like this? You see, even if you haven't heard it, I have heard it throughout my life as have others on this thread. It is not "dead language."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EntourageEffect

I feel as though it's more effective having both translations be as natural and correct as possible. And actually we are kind of here to learn English because if you don't have a firm grasp of English you won't be able to transate effectively. Duo has taught me a lot about Spanish as well as English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gina127652

I think also those who speak British English may actually phrase it this way ...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tachpro92

I agree, to say this or that doesn't sound right in english is a moot point....because.....you wouldn't say that in english. Most of what you are learning would not sound right in english. "Me duele la cabeza".....I wouldn't say .."to me hurts the head" in english either, but thats how you say it in SPANISH.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bdbarber

But the point is that you would not translate that as " to me hurts the head"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dee811953

Esto es buen consejo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AwezomePozzum

I just don't see how we're supposed to get that answer :/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/moreamore

That's exactly what I'm trying to do; accept the language for what it is instead of making sense of it through an English filter. But boy is it hard


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hamid306611

Yes and No. It is good to learn a language carefully but not through errors. besides, Duolingo has been based on bilingual teaching ever since the beginning and your correct translation into english is part of your learning spanish. Having come is simply incorrect. It is correct to understand and feel the mechjanism of spanish grammar, but incorrect to expect the same thing to happen in english.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

"Having come" is NOT incorrect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DavidMoore622957

There is a difference between saying "coming" and "having come." The two are not interchangeable, in a general sense, nor is one more grammatically correct than the other. It is clear from the Spanish that the speaker/writer is using the perfect aspect (i.e., using the helper verb "have" - ha). An accurate translation, in my opinion, should maintain that aspect. If you omit "having," you are indeed changing the structure and meaning of the original sentence.

Most of us, most of the time, don't pay attention to such nuances when speaking or writing. That doesn't make such differences irrelevant. If you truly want Duo to encourage proper Spanish and English usage, you should not be so quick to discard these language distinctions.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

Thank you for having made such a cogent and calm explanation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DavidMoore622957

De nada, Kid Shelleen!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

@ mazdee: "Thanks for coming" may be an acceptable, loose translation, but if Duo agrees that it is a good translation, that is to say, an accurate translation, then Duo is wrong. As David Moore points out, there is a nuanced difference between the two, and it exists in both languages. After all, if you want to say "Thanks for coming" there is "Gracias por venir." The "languages are different" argument just doesn't apply here.

Secondly, if you find the thread is tiresome, please feel free to unfollow the discussion, but recognize that it may not be tiresome to those new to the exercise and compelled to express their outrage at a time-honored and perfectly legitimate English expression – one which, by the way, will have no one laughing at you who matters.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DodoJarmann

Tienes razon. Aquí es un lingot para ti.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fritssg

I have to agree with mangledmatt. Present prefect is used for past actions that still affect the present. Therefore, 'thank you for having come' means that the people have already left but are thanked nonetheless in the present.

I would use 'thank you for coming' when people are still there, either at arrival or when they are about to leave.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/james.ray1

"Thank you for having come" doesn't necessarily mean that they have come and gone, it just means that they have already come. "Thank you for coming" and "Thank you for having come" mean the same thing in my understanding, and the former is a more natural expression. (Generally, if two meanings mean the same thing, the more concise expression is preferred.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Actually, no, they don't mean exactly the same thing. Although there is some overlap, there is a nuance to the present perfective version that is not conveyed by the simple past tense (or, as here, a gerund, which has no tense at all).

To oversimply: consider the possible implication of a sentence like (simple past), "He worked all his life to improve the condition of his people," and compare it to "He has worked all his life to improve the condition of his people." ( I leave you and others to mull on the implication of the former.)

:You are correct about one thing, though: generally, if two forms mean almost the same thing, the "more concise" expression is preferred — by those who don't know the difference. Overtime, the more nuanced language likely does fall into relative disuse, and when it has begun to sound "weird" to a following generation or two, people begin to say things like "No native speaker of ... would ever say that!" And so a language begins to lose just a bit of its ability to express things in fine gradations of meaning.

Is that good for the language? Be the judge, but in three years on Duolingo, I have been (and still am) astonished at the number of people who apparently think so.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnnaDunste

The English language has been losing a lot of nuances in the general population in recent generations. Double plus ungood.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Yes. Double plus ungood.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/james.ray1

Thanks for the grammar lesson. I agree that it it is useful to be able to convey the intended meaning. Present perfective tense is an action that started in the past and has continued to be performed through to the present (without interruption). Another example is: it has been raining today. Simple past tense is an action that began and finished in the past. For example, it rained today.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Ah, I suppose you meant, "Thanks for the response to my grammar lesson:;" but that's alright.

One small point, though: present perfect tense describes an action that started in the past and which continues to be performed – or the effects of which continue – through to the present. But while "It rained today"implies the rain has ceased, and "It has been raining today" suggests it is STILL raining, that distinction really doesn't apply to the choices here. "Thank you for having come" introduces a present perfect aspect, but "Thank you for coming" is neither PP nor simple past: it has no tense at all. ;-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/skepticalways

Tejano, you are absolutely correct, and the person above who said it does not mean the people have already left is correct, as well. They merely already had arrived, probably had a valet park their car, a doorman take their coats (in cold weather), and been shown to the receiving line before entering the ballroom. So they "have come" to the big soiree, an elegant nighttime party, at which they will dine and dance for hours in formalwear. (Think DIPLOMATS!) These kinds of things still happen today, just "way above my pay grade"! ;-)

It would be commonly said in more formal and polite society. I was told when first introduced to Spanish that Hispanic culture was very polite, so to be sure to say "please" and "thank you" so as not to be considered rude. (One can be polite and casual, but formal politeness should at least be known, even if not used often - might help on a job interview one day.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Khristafer

A language doesn't lose its ability to to express things in "fine gradations of meanings". But rather, it expresses them in other ways. Relatedly, the previous comment said that in his understanding, the meanings were the same-- which can be true. Meaning is always a negotiation within communication.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

I'm inclined to think that languages don't have the ability to express things in fine gradations of meaning, but rather people have (or don't) the inclination to express things in fine gradations of meaning. If enough people find it easier to forego nuance, the structures or words associated with nuance fall out of common use and eventually are considered awkward or unnatural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BritaJ

I thought the whole purpose of this lesson is to learn the Present Perfect tense. There are lots of times when native English speakers would use the past tense interchangeably with the present perfect. That doesn't mean we shouldn't take the opportunity to learn this tense properly, even if the phrase is not one that is used very often.

You might say "Elvis left the building", but don't tell me that it is the same as the famous "Elvis has left the building".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mathchoo

Hear! Hear!

Too many people forget that they are here to learn.
In this case the present perfect tense.

Natural sounding sentences have always taken a distant second place. You would think someone this far into the tree would be used to awkward sentences by now.

(I actually do not think this sentence is awkward, just that there is no reason to complain if it was.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mangledmatt

I think this sentence is fine. If a party happened last week and you wanted to thank them for coming, this is how you would say it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/blooperboy

I think in that situation "Thanks for coming to the party last week" is more common


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JessicaYu4

the sentence is fine in spanish, but this is directly translated and totally unnatural in english. "thank you for coming" is what it should be properly translated to or else you'll receive odd looks


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/llibllens

Come on it's not "totally unnatural". As was stated above it would be very appropriate in speaking of last weeks party. (Please people, fewer misleading broad brush judgements)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikRed1

It is still unnatural. No one would say that for last weeks party. They would say 'thanks for coming last week' or 'thanks for having been there' or even 'thanks that you came last week'.

At least in america, if you say for having come, people will understand, but will consider it an odd way to say it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/espanola_amanda

I disagree with those who think it's unnatural. It depends on the vernacular of the people you usually talk to, but I would not think anything strange about someone saying "Thanks for having come to my party last week".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

Don't speak for everyone who speaks English, or even everyone in America. I don't think it's unnatural, and neither do many of the people I know. That already invalidates your premise.

Secondly, you're willing to use exactly the same construction as this sentence with your example "Thanks for having been there," but you still regard "having come" as unnatural? There's no basis for saying that other than your personal taste.

And thirdly, you claim that "Thanks for having been there" or "Thanks that you came last week" are better options. (I don't think the second one is even grammatical) I have to dispute this, because according to Google, no one ever says those. "Thank you for having come", while not common, is used, which also invalidates that claim.

https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=thanks+for+having+been+there%2Cthanks+that+you+came%2Cthank+you+for+having+come

And if you want to downvote me, I think I at least deserve an explanation of why. All I've done is point out the statistical untruths and logical contradictions in a problematic argument.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bermygreen

But if you're in England, where English is from, its fine. I say it myself. Thanks for coming is merely an abbreviated version.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/linburnlane

Doesn't "Thanks for having been there" follow the same grammatical line as "Thanks for having come"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

You're quite right. I'm gobsmacked by people who profess to be so knowledgeable about all forms of spoken English that they can with assurance declare something "totally unnatural."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

I don't think Duolingo has many sentences with the infinitive + participle, as is used here. More examples would be helpful to reinforce the Spanish grammar lesson here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/blue.skies

Agreed, the sentence is perfectly fine. Maybe not something a teenager would say, but absolutely correct and acceptable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thefluent1

Yes this sentence is totally fine in english its just extremely formal sounding and sounds like something that high society type people would say


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlanHill00

Agreed, I recall having said something similar not long ago. "I appreciate them having come, but..." In most cases I'd use a less correct formulation like, "I appreciate their coming" but that just doesn't mean the same thing here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

"I appreciate their coming" is actually more correct grammatically because gerunds should always take possessive determiners, not object pronouns. "Them coming" is incorrect despite being incredibly widespread, and I struggle to say "their coming" even though I know it's correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/skepticalways

Eric, you are correct about using a possessive pronoun with a gerund, a verb used as a noun. (The "action" is the object of the preposition in your example, with a defining pronoun modifier, "their.")

But talking "about their coming" is a gerund that could be set in the future, different from about their having come." If talking directly to them, "Thank you for (your) having come tonight," the pronoun is both possessive and "understood" (not there), and the person has come, and is still present.

Or, after the party, the host might say, "I don't know what happened to Joe Brown; he had been coming (not a gerund in English, but a past continuing verb) to our party six years in a row, until last night."

Example of future: "Honey, I'm not sure about their coming (gerund) to the party tomorrow, when we know that the Smiths are coming -- they hate each other.!"

Hope some of that helps show there are reasons that show nuances of meaning, although we don't use all of them casually. At a "kegger," guys might just say, "Hey! Glad ya came!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/athacliath

Especially in England.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BezJones

In England it's not common use in this context but maybe another one. Ie. watching match of the day (football highlights show) "After having come second in the championship last season, newly promoted Watford were looking to... "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Limbo63

This is actually a really strong example of how you would hear 'having come' in spoken English and much more common than the above.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cboehm42

Its grammatically correct as is, but it's antiquated and rarely used anymore


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Probably because no one has receiving lines at weddings or funerals anymore. In all seriousness, this phrase is not antiquated. When you arrive at a job interview, someone may say, "Thank you for having come today."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ignant

"Thank you for coming" SOUNDS LIKE a better translation to a lot of native english speakers, but it is not a translation of what is on the screen. Are we here to translate the words, or to change them into a sentence that we would prefer to say?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NYY24

Awkward, but not any less correct. Both are accepted and correct translations.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Youmeanthatguy

Yes, but they don't accept "Thank you for coming" even though that's what most people would say. That's the issue.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malkeynz

There'd be no need for "haber" in that case, it would just be "gracias por venir". Present perfect in Spanish kinda expects you'll use present perfect in English.

Though judging by other people's comments this may now be accepted anyway.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Clari64

Thank you for coming accepted 3/12/15 ☺


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

More's the pity. (Although no native English speaker would say that.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Telisa7

Perhaps it sounds awkward but it is proper English. Though not as common, there are those of us who use it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cheryl1

Thanks for coming is accepted as well. The translations that DL chooses to display as correct can and do vary. Next time you may see your preferred answer.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anthea831295

It is having come. This is the translation. However the spanish like to use this tense much more than we use it in english, thats what you need to know. They use this tense when it is past but very recently in the past.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Craig877964

Hello Chogas: As of 1/1/2018 I have read all 444 comments to date. I think most people that complain that the sentence is awkward or "no one ever says this in the history of the world etc", are totally missing the point. This is a lesson on usage of the Present Perfect. "Thank you for coming" is NOT Present Perfect. "Thank you for having come" IS Present Perfect. I have used and will continue to use "Thank you for having come" and you will also if you truly want to learn and understand the lesson on Present Perfect. I am here to learn Spanish. As I do, Duolingo is helping me with correct English. Thank you for having come to this discussion thread. Please try the veal. Oh... and actually reading the thread before posting would be super helpful to others who are trying to help us. This would give one some time to consider what has already been answered repeatedly, and also lessen the burnout factor of those who are trying to help us. "Gracias por haber venido. "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

Gracias por haber dicho eso.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pianoician

I think putting an "hoy" at the end would make the sentence sound more natural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SFranks18

Awkward or not, eso es que ella dijo. (Did I say that right?)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hanaru

In some sentence is acceptable translation for VENIR both arrive and come , not in this case, is there any difference in meaning?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SusannaEDavis420

Do we use the infinitive "haber" because it is after "por"? It seems like I have a vague memory from years ago when I took Spanish that you always use the infinitive after "por", but I can't remember for sure or why. Would someone explain this?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Elagui

http://www.studyspanish.com/lessons/porpara.htm
"Gracias por" is just how you say "Thank you for".
According to a reference grammar of Spanish By R. E. Batchelor, Miguel Ángel San José, certain verbs lead logically to the use of the perfect infinitive - among them: Gracias por haber venido. Which is translated as: Thanks for coming.
I think the problem lies is that we're being tested in a concept that wasn't clearly explained and we are coming from a culture that has a different logic to how we choose which words when and don't understand the Spanish logic of why the infinitive is supposed to be there. (section 13.1.2 Page 108)
It would be a little redundant to say: Gracias por has venido. or Gracias por ha venido because they would mean: Thank you for you have coming. In this case - it'll be added to my exceptions to the rule section - to always be aware of the logical infinitive here on out.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SusannaEDavis420

¡Gracias por su explicación! I've been relying more on the podcasts of "Coffee Break Spanish" for learning grammar and conversational skills. We haven't covered this subject yet. I use Duolingo mostly for practice. It's difficult to learn grammar here, but kind people like you really help!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/newmilwaukeee

can you say "gracias por venir?" and if so, which is more common?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesBlask

In all of these hundreds of comments, this is what I want to know! Whether it sounds natural or not in English really doesn't matter, since we're here to learn SPANISH! Would your typical Spanish speaker be more inclined to say this?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chronosparks

Relax people. Technically the sentence is correct, but it's just extremely formal and rare. I would never say it and most people I know don't talk like that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rooseveltnut2

Truly!! I can't believe this thread is just going on and on. I'm outta here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mujer134

Why is “haber”, an infinitive form, translated as “having”. Can someone explain the concept? I don’t remember seeing this before.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/malkeynz

Infinitives in Spanish can be used in some contexts where we would use the English gerund, so it gets translated appropriately.

So depending on context, "comer" could be translated as one of:

  • "to eat"
  • "eating"
  • "eat"

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mujer134

Thank you! Context would be everything I guess.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/imdwightbrah

Can someone please give a lowdown for "haber"? Is it like "have" in english and conjugate it as such? Is there only one conjugation: he, has, ha, hemos, han?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

1) Generally, it is used as an auxiliary verb. 2) It exists in all tenses and in all three moods (indicative, subjunctive and imperative). 3) It does a funky backstroke in the third person single present tense and morphs into hay when used impersonally. For example: Hay un gato en la silla. (There's a cat on the chair.) You have probably seen that verb hay everywhere and not recognized it as a conjugation of HABER. 4) yes, it is used like the English have.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EduardoJdCIII

Just because this isn't used often does not mean it's incorrect. "Thank you for having come" is perfectly fine. I think it's even more suitable for bedtime talk.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/namayani

DL now accepts "thank you for coming" woot!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

Shoot! (An expletive, not a verb; I'm not proposing violence, just disappointment.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pannychis

isn't there a word for coming?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lisagnipura

Hola Pannychis: In Spanish the infinitive is used in place of the English gerund; therefore, coming would be "venir".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Supra__

If you wanted to say "I am coming" you would use the gerund which would be "Estoy viniendo."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

No. That is not a gerund. This is a present participle used to create the present (tense) progressive (aspect). Gerunds are a non-finite verb form, which means they aren't really part of any tense and they don't take subjects. Gerunds are used to form verb phrases that act as noun phrases. To check if a -ing verb is a gerund, replace the verb phrase with a noun and see if it makes sense. You can't do that here.

To make it more complicated, there are also verbal nouns, which can end in -ing but act completely like nouns and not at all like verbs.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Few people understand English grammar as clearer as you do. Thank you for having come to this commentary page.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/geneven

Here's another instance that makes its typical usage clearer: "We really needed people at that political rally we held yesterday. Thank you for having come!" The reason one uses it instead of saying "thanks for coming" is that it emphasizes action in the past, not current action.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Farhi

Thank for coming! is accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

More's the pity.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Justin122243

This sentence is perfectly acceptable and herd quite often in high society and among those with impeccable English. Just because English is your native language doesn't mean you've come across everything there is to come across, Especially if you're a first generation native English speaker. They looked for a translation and that was the closest translation that fit. Do a bit of research before you spit out opinions.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HephaestusX

People tend to forget THIS IS LITERALLY ITS OWN LANGUAGE, it's not coded english or anything, these trabslation are telling you at the best ability how its literally said IN ENGLISH. At some point you will have to stop thinking in english and ..."Learn" the culture of spanish, become it ...Instead of being too literally and critical all the time..This is just advice ^_^.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JudyK.Pearlstein

Actually, I would say it and probably have. I'm 73 so it might be because I'm older. However, it really doesn't matter if we don't say it in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/quemos

Lots of comments, uhh! I am not native English speaker. So that i can't judge you guys. What i can say is that Duo's translations give me the idea about the meaning of Spanish and what it implies. Duo helps me to learn Spanish and Comments make my English improve. Thanks for your all contributions


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnnaDunste

Is there some way to suggest this discussion to be locked? This topic has been done and redone so many times, we really don't need three times a week one more person to come say "it's wrong!" without being bothered to actually read the conversation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shirlgirl007

Anna, I concur, that is a great suggestion. I am going to put it to the managers, the other box... There is another one in French, that I have in mind also...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Garrett46357

Quite the discussion with having come and coming, having come is fine here in Montana. My question after this whole read though is is venido in the present perfect tense translate to came. Como se dice - He came to my party?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/amyhengst

Thank you for being the first person who uses this phrase in english to actually say where they are from!

So many people have commented, but I was left wondering where "having come" might be a phrase that is in common use. I'm from california and it sounds odd to me. But English is spoken in so many places, so I couldn't guess whether British, Scottish, Welsh, African or Aussie speakers might use this phrase -- or even other States! Truly we share an amazing language, but in many small ways we use it differently :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/amyhengst

To answer your question, "He came..." would be a simple past tense phrase. The simple third person singular past tense for venir would be "vino"-- I believe it would be, "el vino a mi fiesta" ... http://www.spanishdict.com/conjugate/(venir)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shawn637253

Hold a party where everyone brings something. The tell the guy who brungs the sour cream. Thank you for having come.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Talca

Especially if you baked a dozen Idaho potatoes and have run out of butter.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ignant

It is far more probable that YOU have a very poor understanding of spanish, and of the phrase "translate the following into english". It does not say "re-arrange the translation of these spanish words into a phrase that YOU would use when speaking with your friends". Just try to do what it asks you to do. If you get it wrong, don't blame your phone or your thumbs, just read the CORRECT answer and learn "sumpn". No-one is trying to trick you or lie to you, not even the demon that is duolingo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ignant

I wrote this comment in reply to Nathanlanza, about 30 posts below. I don't know why it was put up here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vicki.kura

Actually duolingo rearranges the words in the translation quite often. We have to to make sense. It is not a word for word translation all of the time. Example: Look at the little dog. The words WILL be rearranged and need to be or it would be odd to say.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EdwardBail2

If you are talking to someone why isnt it "Gracias por has venido"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

For the same reason you wouldn't say "Thank you for you have come," in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/catherine.539406

I should have thought of this before I got this far, but am I learning European or South American Spanish?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikBoyle

Latin American, predominantly.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobertTudo2

As I understand it, the way duo works is that native speakers correct the errors in the use of their own language while they are learning another, and this assists those users learning their own language. Whilst this sentance will get the meaning across in English, and is perfectly correct and logical, it would sound very strange to a native speaker. The common usage would be 'thank you for coming', which is not logical, as the tense is 'wrong', but that's English for you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Esn024

What is the difference between "gracias POR" and "gracias PARA"? When would you use one or the other?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/whigamore1

Well, that;s a bit of a dilemma for everyone and there are tons of sites on the net addressing the question of "por vs. para." Here's one that has some rules for "por," and by deduction, it should help with "para"

https://studyspanish.com/grammar/lessons/porpara

But the first rule listed, you'll notice, is:

Rule: to express gratitude or apology

Model: Gracias por la ayuda. (Thanks for the help.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/youngbarb

I've used this phrase quite frequently. It's definitely no awkward. My mother was an English major and very particular about grammar. She also used it! My question was why haber wasn't conjugated and i believe it was Erik who answered it way back there in the comments. Thank you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/areyounuts.

Thank you for having come, is more like old English. Like the aristocrats of Merry Old England. In that context, it would be perfectamente logico. In our lazy modern day English filled with slang words and phrases it does seem a bit awkward, but I have no problem with that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Taghrid153

is" gracias por viniendo" correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grace780329

Hola Taghrid153! hablo Español y lo correcto es decir: "Gracias por haber venido" Ej: Recibes a un invitado a tu casa y le dices esta frase. También se la puedes decir al despedirse " Gracias por haber venido" (a mi casa, a visitarme,etc) The sentence "gracias por viniendo" it is like "I Tarzan" . Greetings


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/brandonchavis

I do agree this English translation needs to be revised. It "makes sense" according to the rules of the language, but it's utterly confusing and I don't think that anyone would use this naturally in spoken or written English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

It's confusing primarily to those who haven't yet learned what proper usage sounds like, which may be due to the lack of proper usage among the people they are most likely to encounter in their daily life.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/4R91031C3R70

We usually say "Thanks for having came" but still we usually don't say that, we say "Thanks for coming!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vanw39

I'm not sure I understand what you understand you think you said.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

Hello James, I think perhaps you have one too many instances of "usually" 'in there; but, I'm also wondering: "Who are the "we" you're talking about? ;-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EllieLemke

Why can't it be "Thank you for having called" (me on the phone)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErikRed1

That makes absolutely no sense, where did you even get that idea?

"Gracias para me haber llamado" I think would mean what thou suggesteth


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tejano

"Gracias por habeme llamado" is, I think, what you want there; but you are right;: "venido" has nothing to do with "called."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Victorcarrera0

My understanding of the Spanish present perfect tense is that it is formed by using the conjugated present tense of the auxiliary verb “haber” with the past participle of the main verb. Can anyone explain why the infinitive "haber" is used here and not conjugated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Amit220061

The fact that this sentence is technically correct doesn't make it a good choice for a translation. I've never heared something like that, and i believe it is very rare to hear it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dennis981342

If you type "haber venido" in the Duolingo Dictionary it gives the English translation as "to have come." Grammatically in both Spanish and English this is known as the perfect infinitive. If you type "habiendo venido" in the Duolingo Dictionary is gives "having come." Grammatically in both languages this is known as the perfect participle. "Habiendo" by itself is known as the present participle and "venido" by itself is known as the past participle, again in both languages. Duolingo is either wrong about the Spanish verbal phrase in the exercise (most likely), or wrong about the English translation they give, or both (perhaps). If you type "por haber venido" in the Duolingo Dictionary it gives "for having come" most likely because in English "for to have come" in ungrammatical! It would hot be surprising to me that you can say "for having come" in two different ways "por haber vendio" and "por habiendo venido" but strictly speaking grammatically from both a Spanish and English point of view because both languages have the perfect participle, this is the most correct way to express "for having come." Also, Spanish seems to have two different acceptable ways of saying "she is coming." One way is to used a form of estar plus the present participle, so "esta viniendo" or the other way which is to use context and simply say "ella viene." Both are understood or translated as "she is coming."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DavidMoore622957

I'd say you're mostly right. You wouldn't use "habiendo venido" here. It's the infinitive "haber" that you want in this context. Duo has it correctly.

Take a look at this article for more information.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Zrjco

That's what she said.

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