Why? I asked my MIL, who is German, why you can't just say "my hand" and she told me that it would be okay to say "Sie drückt meine(r?) Hand," but that if you want to use mir, you always need the article. Is she wrong??
Ah. Of course you can say "Sie drückt meine Hand" instead of "die", that's perfectly fine.
(But you originally asked if "Sie drückt mir Hand" would be OK, and that isn't correct.)
The only way "Sie drückt mir die Hand" makes sense to me is it I translate it as, "She is giving* a shaking of the hand to me." Lol.
I guess the thing here is that in English you only describe parts of the body with a possessive pronoun (my head, my hands etc.). In my language (Portuguese) the usual say to say "I raise my hands" would be "I raise the hands".
I'm trying to understand this as well -- but I interpret this as "She shakes me at/in the hand." since mir = me and meine = my. That we could also change it to der Arm and it would mean "She shakes me at the arm."
We automatically understand this in English to be "She shakes hands" or "She shakes my hand." since not everything translates word for word.
Good! That's pretty much what it is: mir being "to/of/for me" and not "my". So, "she presses the hand of me." And that fits in nicely with the slang reference to hand-shaking of "press[ing] the flesh."
See, it has confused me because I thought you HAVE to use dative case here. You don't? You can choose when you want to use dative?
DL never explicitly taught me that you always have to keep the definite article when using dative pronouns. Because, in English, you wouldn't say, "She shook my THE hand." You would only say, "She shook my hand."
Do you understand why I am struggling with this?
She is shaking the hand of me. The hand is the object, me is the indirect object so it is dative. The more direct translation of she shakes my hand is "sie drückt meine Hand" which is accusative not dative.
It is simply an idiomatic construction that is a bit painful on the (at least) English-speaker's eye. Just one of those things you have to remember. Another example, I believe, would be "Ich wasche mir die Hände". My only guess, not being a complete expert on German linguistics, is that the dative "mir" is used because the accusative (die Hände) is already used, and "Ich wasche mich die Hände" just sounds incredibly bad. This may be total Quatsch but it is how I remember the construction! :)
This reaply is for 94BlueLane. Ich wasche mir die Hände has mir in dative because the speaker benefits from the washing of the hands. You can say Ich wasche dir die Hände in which case the person spoken to benefits from the washing. It has nothing to do with the fact that there is another word in accusative in the sentence although I don't remember a German verb that calls for two objects in accusative.
Do you mean to say that when we use dative pronouns before a noun we need the definite article in Deutsche?
It is an idiomatic construction: "jemandem die Hand drücken", meaning 'to shake hands with someone'. Look at 'jemandem': it is already dative, also 'with' is dative. So, 'to "press" the hand with someone' is automatically a dative expression.
"Mir" means "(to) me". "For me" is "für mich". "Of/from me" is "von mir". "With me" is "mit mir"
94's example of "Ich wasche mich die Hände" is reflexive: "Ich wasche mich...", 'I wash myself...' or 'I wash by myself...'. It sounds like the small child who said, "I can hold my own hand" while crossing the street.
I do hope this has muddied the waters a little more.
OK, it looks like drücken is requiring dative case here . . . If "mir" is required in "Sie drückt mir die Hand." then would not "meiner" be required in the sentence "Sie drückt meiner Hand." (She shakes/presses/squeezes my hand.)?
My understanding is
In the first example, the verb has both a direct and indirect object. "She pressed me the hand", would be a literal translation. ""the hand" is a direct object and "me" in the indirect object. As an indirect object, "me" gets the dative form "mir". The direct object is "the hand", which gets accusative.
In the second example it has only a direct object. No dative required.
An easier way to think of this (in translation) is maybe "she shakes me by the hand".
i guess cause "mir" means "to me", so mir needs a die in there, unlike "meine" which means "my". but the real question is why the app wouldn't introduce menine hand first as it's less confusing.
I think you are confused of "mir die Hand" and "meine Hand". Here, they use dative case "mir". So you'd better translate this sentence like "She shakes with me through the hand" (it's weird to translate this way thought). "die Hand" is the direct object, "mir" is indirect. But "Sie drückt meine Hand", there's no indirect object here, "meine Hand" is the direct object. So either she shakes "the hand", or she shakes "my hand". But if you want to stress the shake hands behavior affects/benefits "me", then "mir" as an indirect object.
OK, so . . . do these work?
Ich will deine Hand drücken. Ich möchte deine Hand halten. I will press/shake/squeeze your hand. I want to hold your hand. Because the first verb is "wollen," no dative case needed, right?
Ich drücke deiner Hand. I shake your hand. (with "drücken" as the only verb, now dative case is needed?)
To the best of my understanding, your last example is incorrect. The fact that you need dative is not tied to the verb drucken in the way you're thinking.
Let's look at the original sentence again. It literally translates as, "she presses me the hand.". It doesn't specify whose hand. We add the possessive in English because otherwise the sentence sounds strange.
The me in the sentence above is, in German and English, and indirect object. It's the same me as in "she gave me the book". Sie gibt mir das Buch.
If you are thinking of mir as meaning my, it's going to confuse you. You have to realize that the German idiom for shaking hands is not Word for Word what the English one is.
It also gets confusing because although English has the idea of indirect object, and sometimes we get sentence diagrams explaining it in high school, we don't change the word. We use "me" for both direct object and indirect object. German has two different words, mich und mir.
I'll get back to your example, I think your first two sentences are just fine. However, you could also use the dativ as follows: "Ich will dir die Hand drücken."
Literally, I want to press you the hand. "You" is the indirect object and in German that is "dir" (assuming we are informal).
If I'm not being clear about the idea of indirect object, there are many more well written articles about it on the Internet. A quick review of that might help you more than my long-winded response. :)
How i remembee it is that mir means me and you cant say "she shake me hand" unless youre a pirate. So, when using mir, you have to use the definite article "die hand". "Mir die Hand" translates better into "the hand of me" . You could use meiner, which sound better to me.
I thought of it as She shakes [the] hands (with) me, but in German you don't need a preposition when using a dative verb. Observe that the verb (drücken) receives two objects, the direct object (die Hand) is what is being shaked and the indirect object (mir) which is whose hands are being shaked.
I am no native, though
Because "She pushes to me the hand" doesn't make any sense in English, and "She shakes me by the hand" means that she is shaking your entire body by holding on to your hand, and shaking.
Right! Sie schüttelt mir die Hand. Sie gibt mir die Hand. Sie reicht mir die Hand. Aber nicht: sie drückt mir die Hand!
I am wondering about "drücken" (to squeeze, push, press) being used as "to shake" one's hand instead of "schütteln", which means "to shake":
Hände schütteln = to shake hands
Hände drücken = to squeeze hands
Hände waschen = to wash hands
Hände halten = to hold hands
Hände abhacken = to chop off hands (Okay, that one went a little too far...)
Jazz Hände = Jazz hands! (Oh, that's better...)
I think squeeze is a great word. Except in English we don’t use it for squeezing a hand. It is used for the whole body. Tight squeeze. You can squeeze an arm also, but not so much a hand. The wonder of languages
That is a great reference! I've heard that saying long ago, but have long forgotten it. That does make sense to use "squeeze" or "push" to state "press the flesh". But, that would be an idiom, wouldn't it?
What if, instead of "shaking hands" it was "drive fast" or "accelerate fast" but the German phrase was "Step on it"? Yes, it means to accelerate fast, but "accelerate " is a more accurate verb to than, "step". This would also be an idiom.
"Stepping" to accelerate fast is right up there with "Squeezing" to shake hands...but, really only as idioms.
Yeah, "squeeze" is a great word, but just not when meaning "shaking". "Shaking" is the best work for "shaking". I wouldn't ever make you a "Milksqueeze", but I'd make you a "Milkshake"! And, I'd squeeze some oranges to make juice, but I wouldn't be too successful by shaking oranges, would I?
The gesture of shaking hands is to grab hands and shaking them in agreement or friendship. Although one might also squeeze as a way to indicate strength, determination or dominance while shaking another's hand, it is generally just enough to hold on while shaking, not to squeeze TOO TIGHT like some over zealous guys do.
I think the translation is wrong.
Sie drückt mir die Hand = she squeezes my hand
Sie gibt/schüttelt mir die Hand = she shakes my hand.
I think the confusion comes from Händedrück, which means handshake.
What part of England? I've never head "shake by the hand" as a phrase for the handshake greeting before, although it does appear in some phrase dictionaries. I'm always curious about local idioms, and enjoy those maps of the USA or Britain or Germany that show which regions tend to use which phrases.
Hi, SandyBridge! You want to know where I am from. I was born in Birmingham in the centre of England. As to "She shakes me by the hand", this suggests to me that she has initiated the handshake. I may even be surprised by her actions. This is not a greeting handshake but more of one offered in thanks or of congratulation.
We say this sentence the same way in my country but I understand why it sounds so confusing to English speakers. I can try to exlplain it like this: sentence: She shakes the hand of me.
infinitive: to shake the hand of someone
question: Whom does she shake the hand of?
Do you see now why the "the" is needed?
Would it be okay to translate this as "She shakes me by the hand", or would "shakes me by the hand" be expressed differently in German?
Nein. The German phrase "drückt mir die Hand" means "shake my hand" as in a handshake: a manner of greeting in which one person extends his right hand, the other takes the offered hand with his own right hand, the two hands press (thus "drücken", meaning "to press", similar to "drucken", meaning "to print" which is accomplished by
pressing an inked plate to paper) together, palm to palm, fingers wrapped with a light squeeze (although some people try to demonstrate or test dominance by crushing the other's hand), and then moved up and down once or twice (the "shake").
"Drücken" (oder die konjugierte Form, "drückt") does not mean "shake". No way, no how. But as an idiom, "drückt mir die Hand"--much like "shake my hand"--means "greet someone by [performing the action described above]". Both are idioms. In English, we are not really "shaking" hands in the primary sense of "move rapidly in opposite directions alternatingly".
For a literary reference, see Krebs. Und alles ist anders, by Vera Sandberg and the entry for 7 Juni 2008:
Mein Name wird aufgerufen, wie in Trance steige ich auf die Bühne. Der Professor
drückt mir die Hand, ich nehme die rote Mappe entgegen, trete aus der Reihe, noch ehe die Gratulation beendet ist.
According to Dict.cc (great English<>German dictionary):
to squeeze down
to push down [in childbirth][med.]
It can also mean "to hug" (or at least imply that someone is giving a hugging squeeze to someone else).
The actual verb used for "to hug" is:
umarmen - which is 'um' (around) and Arme (arms) - "arms around" (to hug).
knuddeln - to hug, to cuddle
liebkosen - to caress, to hug, to fondle, to snuggle, to pet (okay, time to get a room.)
Yes, it can, as said in other comments above. Next time, however, I would recommend you read the other comments before posting a question: sometimes the question has already been answered and you can avoid adding clutter to the discussion :)
Why is this in the dative form? Must it be in the dative? ie if I say "sie druckt meine Hand," is that wrong?
Also, I understand the genitive is dying and honestly have no intention of learning it, but would using that case be correct? If I'm correct in understanding this as basically "she shakes the hand of me," isn't that basically what the genitive covers/used to cover?
I think you may be analysing this the wrong way: the dative here is not telling you whose hand it is, it's indicating who is receiving the action of ‘shaking the hand’, who you're shaking hands with. Think of an English sentence like ‘He's offering me a Hand’: it doesn't matter whose hand it is, ‘me’ is telling me that ‘I’ am on the receiving end of the offering. Same thing in this sentence: ‘She is shaking hands to me’, that's what the sentence is saying (of course you wouldn't say that in English, but that's the ‘spirit’ of the sentence). Now, of course the hand is ‘mine’, but that's not what ‘mir’ is covering.
The genitive covers exactly what you pointed out, i.e.: whose thing something is. However, like in English, you don't use the genitive when the possessor is indicated by a Personal pronoun, because you have possessive adjectives (my, your, his, etc.) and pronouns (mine, yours, his, etc.). The genitive of personal pronouns does exist, but its only use is after prepositions requiring the genitive, and even there it's all but disappeared.
you ever considered inadvertently learning the dative case? that's how i learned to type.
Think it would be very useful if Duolingo started putting the exact English translations back on some of these discussion pages at the top again. Most of them seem to be missing recently. Preferably with some context on some of the more ambiguous ones. Doesn't really help otherwise. You certainly don't want to be relying in google translate for it... comes up with all kinds...
It doesn't in the application which is where you would most likely look when you want clarification. Either it disappeared on the latest round of question updates or on a recent Android app update. Either way it's now missing from the app. Not sure if it's doing it on Apple version as well, but certainly missing on Android. It's too much hassle to go and find this same thread on a desktop everyone you just want to check something. Also noticed recently that with most questions/answers the speech bubble has a count of Zero posts yet when you click on it there are posts although not always from the same phrase. Very odd!! Also some context on some stranger phrases would take out the guess work!
I can't see how this can't be translated to "She shakes me by the hand"; wouldn't "she shakes my hand" more accurately be translated to "Sie drückt meine Hand"?
If translating between German and English were simply a matter of substituting one word for another, then that would be correct. However, like all languages, both English and German have their own idiosyncrasies (i.e., idioms), which include, in this case, using ". . . mir die Hand" instead of " . . . meine Hand".
So, to effectively learn a new language, try to recognize and embrace those differences from your native tongue. In moving from English to German, because of their common ancestry, there is a lot of opportunity to translate word-for-word (with some basic rules which must be followed regarding the order of those words), so one can then add the idiosyncrasies as exceptions.
Genitiv applies to the noun which possesses the other noun. In this sentence, though, the noun which would be Genitiv is replaced by a possessive pronoun, and thus obviates the need for the case indicator (because the pronoun does not have an article).
An ad hoc example of
Genitiv in a similar sentence:
Sie drückt dem Vater
Jungen die Hand. (She shakes hands with the boy's father.) "Dem Vater" ist Dativ, just like mir in the given sentence. I find it helpful to thing of des as "of the". (And for Dativ, I usually think of dem as "to/by/with the".)
Just two insignificant notes on your comment:
It's ‘Genitiv’, with an ‘i’;
The genitive masculine and neuter is always marked on the noun too, generally with an -s (e.g. ‘des Vaters’), but ‘Junge’ is a weak noun, so the genitive takes just -n (‘Sie drückt dem Vater des Junge
Just thought it might be good to know. Otherwise, well explained :)
Thanks, Ly_Mar. I don't know why I habitually misspell Genitiv. Usually I catch myself and change it from wrong to right. (Although sometimes I start correctly . . . and then remember "no, dummy, you always get this one wrong: change it." Bah!)
And your very clear statement about the noun endings for Genitiv is the first time I recall seeing that rule stated succinctly. I never picked up that it was masculine and neuter nouns that were getting the suffixes; to me it appeared arbitrary. Now I think it's going to be something I can remember. Vielen dank.
[I've corrected my previous comments so those who won't read the whole thread don't come away with a bad example.]
[In reply to your comment below]
Exactly. Except for names that end in /s/ (pronunciation-wise), then (as in English) you just add an apostrophe (e.g.: ‘ich lese Klaus' Buch’). The ending is generally left out if the name is used with an article though (e.g.: ‘Jans Buch’, ‘das Buch des kleinen Jan’).
Another possibility is using ‘von’ (e.g.: ‘ich lese das Buch von Jan’).
Well, we're learning, misspelling is bound to happen a lot.
About the ending rule: proper nouns can actually take the -s ending no matter the gender (so that ‘Claudias Buch’ and ‘Jans Buch’ are both correct), this is necessary because the genitive is otherwise only indicated in the article for feminine nouns, and proper nouns don't take one.
So for showing possession with proper nouns, one puts things in "normal" (i.e., English) order and just forgets the apostrophe? Z.b., "Ich habe Jans Buch gelesen"?
Because in English one shakes hands with someone, or at most someone's hand. Your version captures well the German syntax, but the English is incorrect (or at least not idiomatic, it could mean something, just not what the original German sentence means).
Maxfield_Solar asked that about a year ago. SimoneBa answered him. She lived in Germany until age 20 or so. I think we can rely on her answer.
"she squeezes my hand or me the hand" is not a proper sentence.
I think "she squeezes my hand" would be "sie drückt meine Hand."
I simply don't know what to do with "or me the hand."
I think what they meant was ‘“she squeezes my hand” or “... me the hand”’. In which case, as you say, the first option is covered by ‘sie drückt meine Hand’, while the second is, in my opinion, simply not very good English. I can't imagine what ‘she squeezes me the hand’ could mean.
"Drücken" für "drückt", und "drucken" für "druckt". They are two different words, with two different meanings (although etymologically related), and the two little dots make all the difference.
And if you look at this article in the DuoLingo wiki you can learn several options for typing ä, ö, ü, ß, ñ, etc, which are MUCH less cumbersome than adding "(with umlaut over x)".
Nein. It's exactly, precisely, and unequivocally like "she shakes my hand."
Like, we are at a party, we are introduced, she says, "how do you do," sticks out her hand, and I grasp it, firmly--but not overly so--and then we move them up and down once or twice, and let go, the greeting being over.
"Sie drückt mir die Hand" means no more and no less.
What a precise explanation :D. Great :). I'm giving you a lingot for this, you made me laugh.
Thanks for the comments, fellows! I really thought that this sentence meant "she shakes me the hand" the first time I read it LOL
So, in a previous Duolingo example, it is "Ich drücke dich", yet here it receives the dative "mir".
Although it's technically not incorrect, this isn't really what we'd say in English. We would simply say 'she shakes my hand' or 'she shook my hand' etc.
I cannot think of an appropriate English translation for" sie druckt mir die Hand. she shakes my hand is not quite the same and slightly incorrect. she shakes my hand would be: sie gibt mir die Hand