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  5. "Это нож для сыра; это нож дл…

"Это нож для сыра; это нож для рыбы."

Translation:This is a cheese knife; this is a fish knife.

November 4, 2015

68 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shoelessjoek

Why would "This is a knife for cheese and this is a knife for fish" be an incorrect translation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Redko.

"This is a cheese knife; this knife is for fish." not accepted. (Oct. 15, 2020)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_____j1

Still not accepted (12. March 2021)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/titars

People not fluent in English trying to mark those who are!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NotTaliAtAll

That should be the right translation ://


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Matt.Lacrosse

It's accepted now (12 July 2020).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Matt240298

why is it not этот?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/olimo

Этот нож = this knife

Это нож = this is a knife


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/annika_a

"This knife is for [...]" was accepted, though. Should it not have been?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/olimo

Technically, it means the same, but you should remember that "this knife is for..." is "этот нож для...", and "this is a knife for..." is "это нож для...". These sentences answer different questions. The first is "What is this knife for?", and the second "What is this?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mantrid_Brizon

Strictly from the perspective of a native English speaker, "this X is for" and "this is an X for" are wholly interchangeable and often incomprehensible from each other; the answer is the same, with different phrasing, regardless the varying questions that we're answering. What, then, are the actual rules between "это" and "этот", and how do we know when to use which?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keinemeinung

@Mantrid_Brizon - "This" and "that" can be demonstrative pronouns or demonstrative adjectives and it changes the subject of the sentence.

In Russian, the pronoun is simply это (this) or то (that), but the adjectives are этот/эта/это/эти and то/та/те (plus they decline to match the gender, number and case of the noun they describe).

Here's a simple article about it, and I don't mean to insult anyone's intelligence but I also had a difficult time coming up with a simple answer as to the difference between them. https://7esl.com/demonstrative-pronouns-this-that-these-those/

I think one of the difficulties I had in answering was getting hung up on the rather specific example you gave, but these pronouns/adjectives are used in a variety of different contexts where they are not interchangeable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Mantrid_Brizon

Use the pronoun form both in English and Russian when literally or figuratively pointing to something so as to identify it.

Use the demonstrative adjective form when describing something that is already understood.

This (large object that looks exactly like a Ferrari) is actually a steam powered, high production, automatic knife. Don't get too close to it as it might activate automatically and suck you in.

This knife (which everybody understands you are talking about because it is clearly a knife and you are all looking at it) has poison in its wooden handle so always wear gloves in case you have a scratch or open wound. That knife (which is right beside the first knife) without the wooden handle is o.k.

It makes no difference which form you use when it makes no difference. But there are circumstances when it does make a difference.

There are periods in history when women routinely carried hand held fans to cool themselves. For fashion reasons, sometimes they were quite elaborate. Some Samurai women had sharp edges on their fans so that they could slash the jugular of an attacker.

If warning someone about an armed woman, you would not say.....grab the woman with that knife..... leaving everyone to ignore all the women with fans while looking for a belts or something that would hold a knife.

You yourself would say.....That is a knife (pointing at the fan) grab her and get that fan away from her.

First get clear about demonstrative pronouns and demonstrative adjectives in English whether you use them routinely or not. Then do the same with Russian which will be much easier when you have the English down pat. Then you are ready to learn the rules about how they are applied in Russian.

Conversely, you could just forget the grammar naming system for parts of speech and their rules. You could just think of co-locations. Some words just go together for some reason and some words never do for some reason.

In that system, you learn phrases instead of words, read short stories and repeat them out loud, watch movies etc and immerse yourself in the language as much as possible.

But Duo isn't the right platform for that. It is all about translation exercises. They expose you to the vocabulary and grammar at the same time and test you on it. That forces you to examine your understanding of the rules of your own language.

Duo is here, it is free and it is all laid out for you. Other approaches are less conventional and lack structure unless you pay for someone to build the structure for you like with a premium option.

Good ones are hard to find and success is hard to estimate.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/elsantodel90

I guess they accept it because the meaning is similar, but "This is a ..." is a more faithful translation because of the "это vs этот" thing that olimo explains.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rockall

Is для always followed by the genitive?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/R_Andersson

According to Wiktionary (https://goo.gl/twHFNQ), yes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fuckit69

Insisting on the semi colon when the rest of the translation is correct is complete bs


[deactivated user]

    Для seems to have different sounds dlia and dle. Is it right? Any rule?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grekhovki

    It's not right. The word "для" has the same sound always


    [deactivated user]

      Well, according to "The Phonetics of Russian" (Jones Ward, 2011), it depends on the context. If the я is followed by a palatalised (soft) consonant, it's probably going to be expressed as [jæ]. And in very rapid speech, the vowel could sound even higher (close to [jε]).

      Native speakers (of Russian) would be the last people to realise this – that's only natural! But just compare the /a/ sound in сядь (sit!) to the one in сад (garden).

      In this example, there is actually a slight difference in vowel quality, (probably due to the anticipation of the devoicing of the s in сыра, to be really pedantic). But I imagine Guido's question was more general, and the answer is yes, it does vary a little with the context.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Royal_Gopnik

      It should be "dlia", since the я is a "ya" sound.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ROFLChief

      This is my knife. There are many like it, but this one is for cheese!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Auto5k

      That's not a knife.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Chiffewar

      Why do you need для? What does 'нож сыра' translate to?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/elsantodel90

      Knife of cheese. Yum!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Aninka789

      Or cheese's knife, I think. As if the knife belonged to cheese.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kawanotori

      Ok, I give up. When does the o sound like an a? Why does dlia sound like dle? Aaaaaaaahhh!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keinemeinung

      Unstressed Os become A sounds. Also, unstressed Яs sound a little more like И. Don't know why you're hearing "dle" though . Maybe it's the TTS. EDIT: Just listened to it, they do kinda glide over it (but that is pretty authentic).


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tmladd

      Why cant you say "this is a knife for cheese; this is a knife for fish"? Isn't that the literal translation?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JeffCat6

      The male voice is killing me. Then killing me slowly on slow.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kocmohabt99

      I put "this is cheese knife; this is a knife for the fish" and the correct solutions were: "This is the knife for cheese; it's a knife for the fish." and " This is a cheese knife; this is a fish knife." Shouldn't mine also be accepted since it's basically a mix of the two?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/annika_a

      The problem with your answer was the lack of an "a" between "this is" and "cheese knife".


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/diogogomez

      This site http://starling.rinet.ru/morph.htm has two variants for the genitive singular of the word сыр, which are сыра and сыру. Does someone know why?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grekhovki

      Both «сыра» and «сыру» variants are right.

      «Сыру» is a colloquialism.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mrslemken

      Это нож для сыра ; это нож для рыбы.

      In duolingo I wrote This is the knife for the cheese; this knife is for the fish.

      Duolingo did not accept this answer. Instead it said. This is a knife for the cheese. It is a knife for the fish.

      I feel that both should be acceptable.

      .


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keinemeinung

      Technically both are wrong. Well, yours is changing это's part of speech in the translation, DuoLingo's is just weird because you typically wouldn't use "the" if describing something's general function.

      "This knife" would be этот нож, but here it just says "это нож", meaning "it is" or "this is" a knife.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andras-Budapest

      The way Dou tellsthe word "for cheese" is incorrectly stessed.

      They say: dla syrA. The correct way: dla sYra.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MiledRizk

      It's fixed now


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Connor960

      Shouldn't it be: "this is a cheese knife and this is a fish knife" because there os no comma in the choices so that would be grammatically incorrect


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RashelleCB

      Only two "knife", no way to write the sentence


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NonPotableWater

      What in the world is a cheese knife and a fish knife


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

      A cheese knife is knife designed specifically for cutting cheese.

      A fish knife is designed specifically for dealing with fish.

      Look them up on Google.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/intoTheOven

      Hard to understand what they're saying sometimes


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/welmoedhettema

      The answer has not enough words for a correct sentence


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/redbluerat

      "this a knife for cheese; this a knife for fish"

      This was marked incorrect. Isn't this really the best translation?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keinemeinung

      You're missing a very key part in both halves of your translation, which is the verb (is).


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ely951473

      Most of the words get letter -a,I'm really confused about it,can someone tell me why please?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NickF20

      Simply stupid that it wont accept an answer with end. It is more logical and liflike. Still if doulingo would try to teach you usable sentences with actual meaning then it won't be free.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/keinemeinung

      Can you please explain what you mean by "an answer with end"?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/st0870

      Only one choice for the word knife. There are not two options that are "knife"


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MagentaSarah

      Lol, I put this knife is a cheese, this knife is a fish. Never been so happy to be wrong.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DJHarris8

      What is the difference between за and дла?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vlazech

      the translation is stupid. change my mind.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

      How can we change your mind? You haven't said what's on your mind.

      Maybe you think the font Duo uses doesn't show up well on your display. How can I change your mind about that? I can't even see what you are talking about. (If that is what your point is)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pablopublico

      ры́ба (rýba)

      IPA: [ˈrɨba]

      f anim or f inan (genitive ры́бы, nominative plural ры́бы, genitive plural рыб) "fish" From Proto-Slavic *ryba, akin to Latin rīpārius (“of a riverbank”) inhabiting the river.

      Source: Wiktionary


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bring_joy

      Why is there a male voice on some words & a female voice on other words (when clicked)?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/welmoedhettema

      There is a word missing. You can not give the right answer


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndrewMehr3

      Why can't the translator understand для anymore? It used to understand me, now it doesn't 8/11/2020


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IM-sama

      Knife is knife


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Diman2007

      Не сыра́ а сы́ра


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jake603777

      "Это нож для сыра; это нож для рыбы." Literal translation: This knife for cheese; this knife for fish. Out of ALL the ways you could have translated it, you went with "This is a cheese knife, this is a fish knife"? Why make it more complicated than it has to be?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MyronGasio

      "This is the cheese knife and this is the fish knife." Was not accepted; should be.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

      There is no and in the Russian example.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/WilliamFaz1

      Given that there is no punctuation in this app, it seems ridiculous the amount of sentenced that require hyphens or semicolons. This sentence doesn't even make sense to use a semicolon - the word 'and' is especially designed for sentences like this, maybe the duolingo developers could look this up in a dictionary.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

      .......This sentence doesn't even make sense to use a semicolon - the word 'and' is especially designed for sentences like this,.........

      Sometimes people use different phrasing and sentence construction than you do. Using and in this sentence leads to a connection of some kind between the two items. But if the speakers point is that they are not connected but completely separate and unrelated items, he may want to avoid using and.

      The developers of Duo often want to get across the point that there are many different ways of speaking and writing in English. This example shows one method of communicating a particular point.

      I may choose to avoid using and when holding up a picture of two seemingly identical apples. I might well say......this one is a bomb; this one is an apple..... That is because I want to emphasize the difference. They are identical in every way except for one key aspect. That key aspect makes them entirely different for my purposes.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Donald135335

      So why is сыра being pronounced суда?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andras-Budapest

      Because Dou is wrong.

      Learn Russian in just 5 minutes a day. For free.