"Duo stiehlt dem Pinguin seinen Anzug."

Translation:Duo is stealing the penguin's suit.

November 5, 2015

18 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mashavinoku

First Duo wanted to be a penguin, but since it didn't work out, he settled for less

June 2, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JenniferNarzt

Duo wanted to be a penguin so bad he skinned one for a meat suit. :(

March 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/grihau

"Duo stiehlt dem Pinguin seinen Anzug." sound odd to me. I prefer the genitive: "Duo stiehlt den Anzug des Pinguins."

November 5, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Both sound fine to me, though colloquially, I'd turn the second one into von+dative myself: "Duo stiehlt den Anzug vom Pinguin".

It's useful to at least recognise this use of dative with "stehlen", though, e.g. "Der Mann hat mir die Handtasche gestohlen" / "Der Mann hat mir meine Handtasche gestohlen".

November 5, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sarefo
Mod
  • 1089

Just to clarify: There are two possible readings of this sentence. But they mean the same.

A) (Duo) (stiehlt) (dem Pinguin) (seinen Anzug).

"Dem Pinguin" is the dative object, "seinen Anzug" is the accusative object. An equivalent sentence would be: "Der Mann gibt dem Hund einen Keks."

This is the intended reading of the sentence.

You could try to translate it as "Duo steals his suit from the penguin", but that is not a valid interpretation. The problem is that due to German sentence structure, the "seinen" appears after the penguin. This, together with the meaning (why would he steal his own suit?), makes the meaning clear. So the only "good" translation is "Duo is stealing the penguin's suit."

B) (Duo) (stiehlt) (dem Pinguin seinen Anzug).

This is very colloquial German, not a structure used in standard German. Literally, it means "Duo steals (the penguin his suit)". Or, in better English, "Duo is stealing the penguin's suit".

So yeah, both readings have the same meaning.

The real question is, why do you complain about the grammar, but find it OK that Duo is stealing the poor penguin's suit? ;)

March 20, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DTipps

I think I understand better. Have a lingot!

I read it as "Duo steals the penguin his suit", which is nonsense. But because "dem Penguin" is dative the sentence implies "from the" rather than just "the". So it's literally "Duo steals FROM the penguin his suit", or more naturally "Duo steals the suit from the penguin".

If I've got any of that wrong you can give my lingot back.

August 9, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/markbooth

I think I understand worse now. It's not clear to me at all what the difference is between these 'readings' since they mean the same thing.

August 19, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SydneyBlak4

Dem does not mean "from the" but "to the" . Best explanation I have to understand this ununderstandable sentence is: Deutsch ist verrückt! My wifes explanation is : Just because!

February 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Dem does not mean "from the" but "to the" .

Not always.

Sometimes it means "for the" or "from the" -- this is the (anti)benefactive dative (dativus commodi vel incommodi in Latin), used to indicate for whose benefit (or to whose detriment) an action happens.

For example, Ich kaufe dem Mann ein Buch "I am buying the man a book" - the indirect object shows that the purchase is for the benefit of the man: you're not buying the book "to the man" but "for the man".

On the other hand, Ich nehme dem Mann das Buch weg "I am taking the book away from the man" also has dative dem Mann as the person affected, but negatively this time.

February 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pattipl

I thought it meant "Duo steals his suit from the penguin" (steals back the suit). How do you know that the 'seinen' belongs to the Penguin and not Duo? Thanks!

September 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

The use of the benefactive dative implies to me that the suit belongs to the penguin.

Also, pragmatics: generally, "stealing" implies depriving someone of their (own) property.

If I am taking care of your book for you, and a thief comes and steals the book, then they didn't really "steal the book from me", did they? It wasn't my book.

I might say, Er hat dein Buch aus meinem Haus gestohlen "He stole your book (from) out of my house" instead.

September 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aaronheiss

Actually I would say that "Someone stole the book from you", if someone stole a book from your house that I had lent you. They would also have stolen it from me, as the book's owner, but since you were in temporary possession of the book, it was you from whom they took it. Of course, you could also put a possessive pronoun in there ("Someone stole my book from you") to clarify things. But (as a native English speaker), I find "He stole the book from out of my house" to be a rather awkward sentence on its own (e.g., not in answering a question about where the book was).

March 27, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JenniferNarzt

Wouldn't a more correct translation be"Duo stiehlt den Anzug des Pinguins"? Why is the dative case used here, instead of genitive?

March 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

I would translate both Duo stiehlt dem Pinguin seinen Anzug and Duo stiehlt den Anzug des Pinguins into "Duo steals the penguin's suit", but that's more a shortcoming of English -- both sentences are possible in German but English has no good way, I think, to render the nuance of Duo stiehlt dem Pinguin seinen Anzug well.

It uses the dative dem Penguin as a benefactive/antibenefactive (dativus commodi vel incommodi), signifying the person for whose benefit or to whose harm something happened; in this case, that the stealing of the suit affected the penguin negatively.

On the other hand, Duo stiehlt den Anzug des Pinguins is neutral and just says that the suit gets stolen, without the nuance of the penguin being affected negatively by the act.

In English, you can say "I will buy you a book" but you can't say "I will steal you your suit" (well, if you tried, that kind of indirect object can only indicate benefit, not harm, as in "I will steal you your suit back" = I will steal your suit from someone else for your benefit).

March 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Markqz
  • 1419

If you were translating the other way, would it be wrong to drop "seinen" ? It's just odd that it completely disappears from the english translation. How would you know to put in "seinen" ... penguins come in other genders.

August 13, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

How would you know to put in "seinen"

Because the word Pinguin is grammatically masculine.

August 13, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Markqz
  • 1419

What does grammatically masculine have to do with choice of pronoun? Couldn't it be "ihren anzug" ? Or are you saying that the "seinen" refers to Duo, not the penguin? In which case a confusing sentence just got confusier.

August 13, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

What does grammatically masculine have to do with choice of pronoun?

The fact that you refer to masculine words with masculine pronouns.

For example, der Löffel ist seinen Preis wert but die Gabel ist ihren Preis wert for "The spoon/fork is worth its price", using seinen (literally, "his") for the masculine Löffel but ihren (literally, "her") for the feminine Gabel. Even Das Mädchen hat seinen Stift verloren "The girl has lost her pen" with neuter seinen (literally, "its") for the neuter Mädchen.

Hence also seinen Anzug with masculine sein- to agree with masculine Pinguin.

Couldn't it be "ihren anzug" ?

No, because (a) Anzug has to be capitalised and (b) ihren would refer to a feminine owner, while the noun Pinguin is masculine.

August 13, 2019
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