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  5. "This boy does not have milk."

"This boy does not have milk."

Translation:У этого мальчика нет молока.

November 7, 2015

71 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mattttw

jesus christ this language is hard


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/websmasha

It is a Category 4 language in the FSI, so it makes sense (If you don't know, the FSI has 5 categories of the time it takes to learn. Russian takes 44 weeks, so if you make a resolution and keep it, you might be fluent at the end of the year) .


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IlianaBill

That's actually really awesome, thank you for pointing that out


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/daddylongleggs

I started doing it this year as a new years resolution, and im still going strong 4 months later. I have to say i never expected to do it this long, but Russian is just such an interesting language to learn!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ArthurKock1

44 weeks to become fluent?! Yeah right!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jouzudesudesu

it would take a hell've a lot of devotion but it is possible


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Luke256180

They say 1100 hours, which is 25 hours per week


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveIn207

A year...on Jupitor!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mrmcfeffers

Hopefully I'll be fluent before high school and can mess with people!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/websmasha

I believe you got Этого, мальчика or молока wrong? I got Этого wrong


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sergius672054

Hahaha. I was so worried about the етаО, малчикА, and молокА right, that i forgot the 'у'! Sigh.


[deactivated user]

    That's just the tip of the iceberg.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TanjaElina

    Why is the form for "this boy" этого мальчика and not этот мальчик?


    [deactivated user]

      Э́того ма́льчика is the genitive case, этот ма́льчик is the nominative. After the preposition у, genitive case is used.

      Note that the structure of the English sentence is different from the Russian one. In English, you say: ‘This boy does not have milk’. ‘This boy’ is the subject, it does (or, rather, doesn’t do) the action of ‘having’. If Russian followed the same structure, you’d use э́тот ма́льчик because we use nominative for the subject. But Russian sentence is different.

      The Russian sentence is closer to ‘At this boy’s [possession], there_is_no milk'. So, the boy doesn’t do any action in Russian. The boy is an adverbial modifier, not a subject, so we don’t use nominative case. (Techincally, milk is the subject, but it’s also in genitive case because нет requires genitive.)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TanjaElina

      Thanks! Makes sense after breaking down the sentence in that way :)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pavloskl

      Amazing answer. Thanks.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rdzevedo

      Great comment, thanks a lot


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DrHellsing

      Boy duolingo does love milk


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Adam82-

      у этого мальчика есть нет молоко is wrong? and why?


      [deactivated user]

        «Нет» is antonymous to «есть», «есть нет» would mean "there is there is not".


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Theron126

        Isn't "нет" in this context a contraction of "не есть"? Another course told me it is.


        [deactivated user]

          According to Vasmer, it's a contraction of «не е ту» (не ѥ ту), where «е» is an older alternative form of «есть», and «ту» is an older adverb 'here' related to «тут».


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Adam82-

          Спaсибо Сзеража :)


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anthony316537

          нет is the opposite of есть


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FKg05

          I gess... only put нет. У этого Мальяика нет молоко


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vibesofsasha

          Why is it молока instead of молоко?


          [deactivated user]

            Молоко́ is the nominative-case form, молока́ is the genitive-case form.

            Russian nouns (words naming things, people and phenomena) have several forms called cases.

            Молоко́ (moloko) is the nominative case. It's used in "X is Y" sentences (Молоко́ вку́сное 'The milk is tasty'), or when the milk is 'doing' some action (Молоко́ ски́сло 'The milk went sour'; the 'milk' is the 'doer' of the action 'going sour').

            However, when you use «нет», you need to use a different form: genitive case. It's also the case used after «у», so both «ма́льчика» and «молока́» are genitive-case forms.

            (I've copy-pasted this comment from a discussion of a similar sentence.)


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RLShahan

            Do you have to have the "У" at the beginning of the sentence? I thought этого meant "this" - so why do you need the У before it?


            [deactivated user]

              They way Russian indicates possesstion is different from English. In English, we have the verb 'to have'. In Russian, the closest verb we have, «име́ть», is not usually used except when talking about abstract things.

              Instead, we say something like 'At this boy['s possession], [there] is milk'. The preposition «у» introduces the possessor in this sentence.


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RLShahan

              OK - that helps so much. Thanks!


              https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wizwisdom

              Could this work: этого мальчишку нет молока... I'm guessing the sentence would sound like "it boy is absent milk".


              [deactivated user]

                You can use «мальчи́шка» instead of «ма́льчик» (they mean roughly the same), but keep in mind that it's declined like feminine nouns: genitive is «мальчи́шки» (not «мальчи́шку»; «мальчи́шку» is accusative).

                Also, you do need to use «у»: «У э́того мальчи́шки нет молока́». This is correct too. If it's not accepted, please report it.


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wizwisdom

                Thanks, and have a lingot! :)


                https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Russguy04

                does "у мальчика этого нет молока" work or does "этого" have to come before "мальчика"?


                [deactivated user]

                  It's not ungrammatical, but it does sound much less natural than «у этого мальчика». You usually find such word order either in unprepared oral speech or instant messaging (when people make sentences on-the-fly and don't spend much time refining them), or in poetry (where you juggle words to follow the rhythm and rhyme).

                  Unless you're writing poetry or otherwise know what you're doing, I'd suggest you avoid placing adjectival pronouns and adjectives before the nouns they modify.


                  https://www.duolingo.com/profile/quantum07

                  Why is этого placed like that?


                  [deactivated user]

                    Этот behaves like an adjective: it's usually placed before the noun it modifies, and changes its form to show case of the noun (nominative этот мальчик, genitive этого мальчика) and the number of the noun (singular этот мальчик, plural эти мальчики).


                    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/redbluerat

                    why in the genitive? Is it because the boy has no milk.


                    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeffrey855877

                    boy is genitive because of the preposition "by" = у; milk is genitive because of нет.

                    you have to be careful about this. From the discussion above (and elsewhere),

                    у [genitive] нет [genitie]
                    у [genitive] есть [nominative]

                    Probably just idiomatic, i.e., you have to remember it, even though there might be a good explanation for the difference.


                    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flila2

                    I have no clue how language works, I have dyslexia and only went to school for a few years... no idea what things mean like genitive, nominative and the other 20 things I keep reading and when I look them up I can't even make sense of it... Russia два вока пожалуйста


                    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LaraMMag

                    Why do I have to use "этого"? Is it for "THIS boy"? If I use only "у мальчика" the translation changes to "THE boy"? Is this it?


                    [deactivated user]

                      Yes. But this is complicated. This course has chosen a simplistic approach:

                      • «этот» (and its forms, like «этого») is translated as 'this', and
                      • 'the' is not translated.

                      So, in this course your explanation is correct.

                      While 'this' = «этот» is correct, the articles are complicated. Often, we just don't translate them. But sometimes, we might translate 'the' = 'этот'.

                      The problem is: articles refer to things that are larger than one sentence. They show what parts of the sentence were known before (the), and what parts are introduced just now (a). Since these paterns are larger than sentence, they can't be explained well in Duolingo. Duolingo just shows one sentence. We have no way of knowing what is known, and what is new.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LaraMMag

                      Got it! Thank you. I wish this course could be from Portuguese to Russian... English has so many "shortcuts" :)

                      I see you are learning Portuguese, if you need some help let me know!


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/websmasha

                      Finally, Genitive gives me a 'thumbs-up' to show that the lesson is over and I'll have a 4day streak!


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thuongagri1

                      Why у этого мальчика молока нет wrong?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      Word order is flexible but you can't put нет after the thing it's negating.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cry5tina

                      Why not "у мальчика нет молока".


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      That should be accepted.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fer_qledicen

                      Think I have a little genitive takeaway: 'есть' (to have) requires genitive form just to the noun/pronoun on the left. 'нет' (no) requires all nouns/pronouns in the sentence to be in genitive. Did someone figure out the same?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      No it's much simpler than that. Words after у or нет are genitive. Words after есть are just normal (nominative), just like after "there is" in English.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rachel805302

                      The boy does not have an apple = у мальчика нет яблока. The boy does not have milk = у этого мальуика нет молока. Why add зтого? And why have the apples and the milk have an a at the end?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      The а at the end is because they are genitive. Words after нет are always genitive. этого is because Russian doesn't have words for "a" or "the". This makes things tricky so instead they tend to uses their words for "this" and "these" (это/эти) a lot more than we do in English to compensate, including some situations where we would use "the" instead.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eric0213

                      Can you also say, У мальчик не ест молоко?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stephany_S_E

                      How do i know when to use "молоко" and "молока"


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      They are the nominative and genitive forms, respectively. Most of the time you will only ever have to use the genitive form when the word in front of it forces the genitive (e.g. у or нет) or when the word is possessing something else.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QurtQurt

                      Этот мальчик не имеет молоко. - This is a literal translation of the phrase that sounds odd to Russian ears but they will get you.


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rollydb

                      why not Это мальчика нет молока. i don't even want an answer this is hs


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/abietams

                      sо этого is the genetive form that applied to masculine things and words? what about the feminine and the neuter?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/aQaG8hz8

                      Why is there a этого in front of "boy"?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      It's the translation of "this".


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bek180

                      What is the relevance of "етого" here?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BenYoung84

                      этого is the translation of "this"


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ayoub360

                      у этот мальчика нет молока anyone explains why is that wrong??


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kornellier

                      What's wrong with у этого мальчика молока нет?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rugimantas

                      I have the same question! Why the thumbs down?! Did word order suddenly got strict in russian language?


                      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EthanHarri765995

                      i keep messing up the этого part

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