Would a native speaker mind discussing the nuances of kommer att vs ska in this sentence? My understanding is that generally "ska" means "will" or "shall" with a fair degree of certainty as to the outcome, whereas "kommer att" means something closer to "going to" but that kommer att holds more uncertainty somehow... is there also a subtle difference in the use in terms of abstract vs concrete concepts?
Am I right in thinking that "ska" is perhaps used for more concrete things that will happen whereas "kommer att" is used in this instance because it is not really a specific or concrete event? Or could either be used and I am just overthinking this a bit?!!
As a learner, my understanding of the subject lesson notes is that ska is used when you wish to convey intention. Kommer att is used to predict events over which you have little or no control.
Thanks! I have obviously already read the lesson notes. I am looking for a slightly more in depth and nuanced discussion around the subtlety of the usage of these phrases from fluent and/or native speakers.
I'll give it a shot, but this is a really difficult area where it's often more a question of tendencies than hard and firm rules.
The first thing that must be pointed out is that ska vs kommer (att) don't correspond well with will/shall vs is going to. That is, in many cases, it's a good idea to translate kommer att as 'is going to' and ska as 'will'. But not always, and the rules underlying the choice are not the same. For instance, English teachers often say that will is for prediction of the future in general, but is going to for predictions based on 'evidence in the present situation'. (this from https://www.englishgrammarsecrets.com/goingtoorwill/menu.php but I've seen similar statements in many places) As far as I can tell, this distinction has no counterpart in Swedish whatsoever.
The main distinction in Swedish is rather that kommer att is neutrally predictive, whereas ska refers to something someone intends or controls, much as Ezra746950 said. It doesn't really matter whether we're talking about abstract or concrete concepts. In one way, it also doesn't really matter whether we can exert control or not: yes, in order to use ska, someone needs to be able to want or control something. But it's perfectly possible to use kommer att about events that I can certainly control too. It just changes the way the action is depicted.
In principle, if someone says Jag ska aldrig glömma dig, 'ska' refers to the intention of the speaker. This means that it can be perceived as a promise.
On the other hand, if I say Jag kommer aldrig (att) glömma dig, that is a prediction of how things are going to turn out. In a way, this can give more certainty, because it's only a prediction and is neutral as to my intention. You can take your pick: is it more reliable if I say that I intend never to forget you, or if I predict I will never forget you? Either choice is actually reasonable, and this makes the choice here all the more moot.
I should add that there's also a special use of ska that isn't taught in this course because we thought it was complex enough anyway: ska can signal hearsay, like 'supposedly', 'they say', 'is supposed to':
Han ska vara lärare 'He is supposedly a teacher'
It's often unclear which sense is meant and in real life usage can be very blurry. However this last sense is probably unlikely for this sentence (the version with ska).
Tack så mycket! I realise it is not an easy thing to put into words but you have actually done a great job of teasing this out - at least for this context. I really appreciate your effort! The lesson notes here are certainly helpful and a good start but I hear everywhere that these words take a while to get your head around and I was keen to hear some different perspectives.
I am sure (hoping?!) I will become a lot more comfortable with the use of these words once I am living in Sweden and immersed in the language!
Great to be aware of the alternative use of ska as well - I have a number of Swedish speaking friends on social media and sometimes see words used in ways that I am not familiar with which gets confusing and can lower my confidence (I think I am starting to understand a usage but then see something completely new and it throws me!) so I am glad that I have at least seen that there are alternate uses of this before I come across it in "the wild"!
Yes, really, thanks a lot for this! Just upvoting didn’t do it justice:)
I’m having quite a struggle with ska and kommer att, especially since my native language doesn’t have this nuance at all when it comes to expressing the future. Even having both will and going to in English still seems awfully redundant to me, after all these years, so you can only imagine...
I put "im going to never forget you" and got it wrong, i wouldn't think twice about this in english despite being a native speaker. Woops !
It is because you separated the infinitive 'to forget'. Although many native speakers do this a lot, it is grammatically incorrect to do so.