"There are guests in the palace."

Translation:Во дворце гости.

November 9, 2015

44 Comments
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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DonCarlote

Why is it во дворце not в дворце? Thanks!


[deactivated user]

    Во is used instead of в before certain consonant clusters. The same pairs exist for к/ко, с/со.

    «Во» (also «со», «ко») is required before some words (во всём 'in all, in everything', во мне 'in me', со мной 'with me', во сне 'in [a] dream'); before others it's optional.

    Historically, «о» appeared if the next syllable had a vowel that got deleted (for example, «со мной» originally had a short vowel between м and н), but in modern Russian in is used even when the consonant cluster never had a vowel.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/H.Yang

    Is there anyway to know which clusters in particular?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Serge_N.Cali.

    A read of the history of the language, here might enlighten things a bit. Short version. There used to be other letters in the russian alphabet. Look at 'Church Slvonic' to see an earlier version of the language. Letters got dropped throught history. But one letter in particular represented the cross over the world. After 1917 the soviets were trying to wipe religion out of society, so they removed that letter from the alphabet.
    This is where the missing letters happen. The soviets may have a different slant to it, but that's what basically happened. (For transparency I'll add, I'm an English speaking Russian Orthodox Monk tired of only being able to read and chant the church slavonic. So im learning modern Russian.)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HillaBecher

    Which letter was it?


    [deactivated user]

      There's no real rule. Actually, there's quite some variation, and «в дворце́» should also be acceptable.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ann55075

      No it should not. Nobody says so. It sounds like "A Alphabet" :)


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EdvntL

      Please do not mislead learners with incorrect information. It may sound awful to your ears, but it's not true that "nobody" says «в дворце́». A quick Google search showed many many web sites where the phrase occurs, some of which look quite "respectable," i.e. where you would expect a decent level of Russian. https://spb.kassir.ru/teatry/dvorets-beloselskih-belozerskih


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Morgana139

      nope, was incorrect for me


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AmosOnn

      Seems similar to the English a/an.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SallySomers

      In English, use 'an' before words starting with a vowel SOUND (long or short) (a, e, i, o, u), and use 'a' before words starting with a consonant SOUND. eg. 'an umbrella', but a university (yoo-niversity); 'a house', but 'an honourable person' (on-erable person).


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesCorbe20

      Thank you for shedding light on the issue


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Peatsickle

      The "вдв" together would create an undesirable consonant cluster, so Russian throws the "о" in as a filler. Other examples include (but are by no means limited to) "во Франции" (in France) and "во вторник" (on Tuesday).


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IbMs14

      Во дворце гости = гости во дворце!!!


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jangovaert

      госты во дворце - what's the difference?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kokoro_kaiju

      Common Russian word order with sentences describing the location of something is usually structured as [Preposition] (the) [Place], there is (a) [Noun]. An example is in the sentence, На столе мяч. (Literally: "On (the) table (a) ball". "Есть" (there is) is usually left out unless it's absolutely necessary to describe that the object exists.

      When you say Госты во дворце, it may sound unnatural to a Russian speaker unless you are asking if the guests are in the palace. I'm not sure, but I believe it is also to emphasize the fact that the guests are in the palace (and not somewhere else).


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stephenpeckhover

      Why do е and ц switch places? Why not just add an extra "е" to make "двореце"?


      [deactivated user]

        «Е» in «дворец» is a fill vowel. It disappears once an ending is added.

        Of course, it would be simpler if we could just add an ending. But language doesn't work like this. It's related to the language history.

        Fill vowels appeared when extra-short vowels Ь and Ъ disappeared. (Modern Russian uses Ь and Ъ for different purposes now, but in the past they used to signify extra-short e and o.) They disappeared everywhere, except one case: when they were followed by another extra-short vowel.

        So, дворьць became дворец because the last Ь disappeared, and this forced the previous Ь to remain. But in «дворьцѣ», on the other hand, because it wasn't followed by a disappeared vowels.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ezequiel724903

        I understood nothing... except that I have to type дворце


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JustLearnen

        I dont remember learning what "Bo" was.


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ann55075

        It is В - but it is inconvenient to say в дворце - so we add a vowel making it ВО, like in english one can add a consonant to A making it AN - an englishman, an owl. And here we will have в и во, с и со, etc


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/emononen

        "гости - в дворце" would this be ok?


        https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vronick

        I think it should be. There is no set word order requirements in Russian in my experience. I reported that that should also be an accepted answer.


        [deactivated user]

          I believe it shouldn't: «Гости во дворце» corresponds to "The guests are in the palace" (unless you emphasise гости with intonation, and create a sentence with emphatic inverted word order; but Duolingo doesn't accept inverted word order).


          https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FelixGV1

          Why is "На дворце гости" refused? What is the nuance between "На" and "Во"?


          [deactivated user]

            «На дворце» would mean 'on the palace'. This could only work if the guests are on the palace's roof.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FelixGV1

            Ah I see! Thanks a lot (: !


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dinnernugget

            Shouldn't "Есть гости во дворце" also be accepted?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lassi492061

            I also wonder when we should use есть and when not. I have several times got wrong when есть has been lacking in my sentence. Again, when I would like to add this word, this option does not exist in Duolingo.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ann55075

            The difference between во дворце гости и во дворце ЕСТЬ гости is like the difference between "I understand Russian" and "I DO understand Russian" You can use DO here, bit it chanes the meaning, you see? The same story with Russian ЕСТЬ :)


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/somelauw

            The palace is getting a divorce (дворце)


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ffPS4
            • 1225

            In russian doesn't matter how to use "гости во дворце" or "во дворце гости" why not accept?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yasmine_y

            The position of the words slightly changes the shades of meaning of the sentence. Usually the "focus" of the sentence in Russian is the last word: "гости во дворце" would be more like "The guests are in the palace".


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QurtQurt

            Гости находятся в этом дворце. - This should be accepted.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zirkul
            Mod
            Plus
            • 2558

            Not really. Your sentence answers a different question: where are the guests, not who's in the palace. Your sentence corresponds to "The guests are in the palace"


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fer._.dmz

            It shouldn't be В гости дворца instead of В дворце гости?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Noidremained

            so, there is a palace in the guests?


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nidhoeggr

            My native russian speaking girlfriend says "Гости во дворце" and "Во дворце гости" are identical.


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ann55075

            Actually they are not (i am a native russian speaker too)

            • Where are the guests? - The guests are in the palace = Гости во дворце
            • What's going on in the palace? - There are guests in the palace = Во дворце гости.

            It also depends on the intonation though:)


            https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eduardohvb

            Thanks a lot. Now i understand the difference. :)


            [deactivated user]

              Hi! Again I suggest you to insert new info in the TIPS, so we know what's coming up in the lesson. Until now it has always been "в", suddenly a sentence with "во"...do you really think it's pedagogical? Thanks! All the best! :)

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