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  5. "В группе сорок человек."

"В группе сорок человек."

Translation:There are forty people in the group.

November 29, 2015

38 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/simon.kinsella

"In the group there are 40 people" should be accepted as it's more literal and yet perfectly acceptable English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alexroseajr

yeah this is insane that "there are forty people in the group" is the right answer but "in the group there are 40 people" still isn't accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QurtQurt

DL teaches its students to always put "There is/are" at the beginning of a sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Brian586326

Isn't the pronunciation of сорок incorrect? Stress on the first о?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

It is only now that I understand you can read the sentence the second way O_o. If you mean "In a group of magpies, there is a human", you should use сорОк.

But it is wrong if you mean "forty" :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rumata_

BTW, сорОк means magpies in Genitive plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tina_in_Bristol

I can only hear the 'в' in the normal speed audio, but not in the slowed-down version. I was able to tell it was meant to be there, because I could hear the 'е' at the end of 'группе', but this seems to be a rare case of the slow version being less distinct than normal speed. Can everyone else hear the 'в' at the beginning, in the slow version, or has it got cut off?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

It's got cut off. I pinged the staff but I think we will have to just disable the audio exercise for this one.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tina_in_Bristol

Thanks for the confirming I'm not deaf/insane/whatever - at least, not on the basis of this. ;)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sohlt

Could that be due to the devoicing of the v > f and the f is just difficult to hear? Maybe it's worth keeping this way since devoicing consonants is a standard phonological process in Russian. Lessons should isolate and contrast phonemes just as grammatical morphemes.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/peterviuz

So the genitive plural of человек is the same as the nominative? My dictionary is not clear on this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

More precisely, the count Genitive plural used with numbers is человек. The form людей is used in other contexts (the Nominative plural is "люди"). It is also recommended with words много and мало (but not сколько and несколько), though not every speaker follows this last norm in actual speech.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/R_Andersson

That seems weird. So, the conversation would go like this:

  • «Сколько там человек, на корабле?» спросил у лейтенанта генералиссимус .
  • «Там много, много людей!», пьяный воин ответил. «Вы не представляете!»
  • «Ну, давайте! Скажите мне, пожалуйста, сколько там человек?» спросил нетерпеливо разгневанный офицер
  • «Там сорок человек! Это очень много людей, даже больше, чем у Вас рублей на банке!»

После только одного часа, его голова упала.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/el-montunero

Whenever I use the microphone for reading exercises, it never recognizes the word сорок (or some other numbers for that matter), even if I pronounce it perfectly. I wanted to report it but I didn't get the option for it. Anyone else has this problem? It's a constant problem for me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BrigiP11

yup, same problem here


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernalberta

It does that for me, not for сорок but for среда and now apparently группе. I think it’s a problem with the mobile device. It automatically tries to abbreviate certain words.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernalberta

Dumb question but why wouldn’t one say «В группе сорок людей»?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

You probably can but we normally use человек with numerals. It is the same for some units of measurement (e.g., 1 вольт / 2 вольта / 5 вольт)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernalberta

So людей must be like “folks” where you could say “a lot of folks came to the party” but you wouldn’t say “this car fits four folks”. Interesting that человек is the same in plural as singular...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/QurtQurt

"Люди" sounds like a "humanity".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MikhailZin

I wrote "the group has 40 people", which the system marked wrong. Sometimes the answer demands literal translations, sometimes no. Tips on proceeding?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tina_in_Bristol

As a rule of thumb, I would say the literal translation is to be preferred, unless it would result in something no native speaker would ever say. "There are 40 people in the group" is just as natural in English as it is in Russian, so I see no reason to arbitrarily change it to: "The group has 40 people." After all, the Russian didn't use: "У группа (есть)...", which (please pardon any mistake) would be the Russian way of saying: "The group has...". So why replace what it actually says with something it doesn't, unless not doing so would result in a phrase that is unused or really weird in English?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobertDenver

I agree. 'Has' doesn't appear in the Russian so why invent it for the English?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

Actually, we do concider these wordings equivalent—precisely because there is hardly any other way to say that in Russian. We do not use sentences like "У класса есть двадцать учеников" and rarely say something like "У моей комнаты белые стены". With enclosed spaces that have something inside and some other things that you'd use "in" with, it is almost always "В моей клмнате", "в группе".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sohlt

I think English handles this sentence in the passive voice since this sentence has no active agent. A third person/impersonal construction is the most appropriate way to translate this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chris_rennick

why can it not be 'there are 40 people in a group' ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yasmine_y

That sounds weird, it's almost like saying "a group (in general) is formed only by 40 people". Or at least that's how it sounds to me...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JanetGidle

To add to what Yasmine said, a group is any group. If its a particular group it would translate to "the group".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/marcialori

I didn't lost to study one day. Simple the time in my city is one hour more than in Brasilia. I study generally at 5 pm; today I studied at 11pm.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Inge445646

"The group has 40 peoples." What is wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tina_in_Bristol

"People" is already plural, it doesn't need an extra 's'.

You can have "peoples" plural, but that would be when you are talking about multiple nations or races, e.g. to say a country was home to many different peoples, or was conquered by many peoples. But in a group of 40 individuals, they're people, not peoples.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Avialy18

Why shouldn't "in a group there are forty people" be accepted?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmmaRoshan

Hi! Why doesn't люди work here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kundoo

While "люди" is usually treated as a plural form of "человек", it's technically is a different word. And as such it's an uncountable noun (i.e. a mass noun), so you can't use it to, well, count people. You can say "много людей", but you can't say "сорок людей" because the latter doesn't make sense grammatically. Therefore "человек", even if normally it doesn't have the plural form, have to step up and fill the gap.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shady_arc

That does not make a lot of sense—after all, you can easily say сорок детей or even сорок суток and сорок ворот; finally, you can say десять молодых людей (but clearly not десять молодых человек).

Some nouns just have a different count form, like with год or many units (e.g., вольт).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmemonD1

the slow sounds like she is saying "вы"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernalberta

When Russians sound out their letters, as English do in the “A,B,C song”.... the Russian В sounds out like “Vweh”. Вы sounds more like “Vwee”. It’s subtle but there is a difference.

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