"много собак"

Translation:a lot of dogs

December 4, 2015

24 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tultag

It seems that feminine nouns ending in -a lose their endings in the Genitive-Plural case

собака (Nom.) ---- собак


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/R_Andersson

Exactly! The same goes with nouns ending in -я, but in order to keep the last consonant palatalised, the -я gets replaces by the soft sign: тётя --> тёть.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anon2334634

So basically after we say 'много' the noun after it must be in the genitive form?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/olimo

Right, genitive plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IwantToLea20884

Or genitive singular for mass nouns


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/0rangeFluff

Why is that, is there a reason that might help us remember it? It's not very intuitive...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erin191214

I think this is actually the MOST intuitive way to use the genitive. Translating the cases to English often benefits from the use of additional "helping words."

A good rule of thumb is that (aside from certain specific constructions) a genitive is often best translated as "of ____." So много = a lot, собак (gen. pl.) = of dogs. много собак = a lot of dogs.

It also works when the genitive is used to show possession if you think of it in terms of "Peter's dog" being "the dog of Peter."

Similarly, translating the dative frequently uses "to" or "for," and the instrumental can use "by" or "with."

Even in instances where the helping word isn't strictly needed or may not be the BEST translation, I find it helps me remember how to use and identify the cases.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/p0int_of_view

THOSE CASES MAKE ME WANT TO CRY SO MUCH


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Victor4587

Patience is the key.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tommy296671

Its about progress, not perfection :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iOfg2

What ending is "-ек" and "-ак" exactly?


[deactivated user]

    It's not an ending. «Собак» has zero ending; zero ending shows it's a genitive plural form in this case.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Superuncia

    And what is a "genitive plural form"?


    [deactivated user]

      I think you know what plural is, English nouns also can be plural and singular (dogs vs. dog), so only 'genitive' is left to explain.

      Russian nouns have several case forms (6 of them, according to the most common classification). Each form is used to convey some grammatical meaning.

      Nominative is the most basic form, it's used for the grammatical subject of the sentence (соба́ка сиди́т 'the dog is sitting') and for the predicate in «X is Y» sentences (in «соба́ка зла́я» 'dog is angry', both собака and злая are nominative).

      Genitive is often translated with the 'of' proposition, or it's sometimes translated with the English possessive case: соба́ка сестры́ sister's dog (сестры is genitive). However, it has a number of other uses: notably, after «нет» is is used to express absence.

      Dative corresponds to the English preposition 'for': соба́ке 'to dog'.

      Listing all the cases and their functions here might not be useful, as you'll learn all of them as you progress through the course. To get a list of all the case forms, you could use Wiktionary: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%B1%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%B0#Declension


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/slogger

      And what is a "genitive plural form"?

      Here's an outline:

      :) It's from an old Russian grammar.

      Actually, it's not quite so bad as it appears at first sight.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KiefAtheros

      To add, any noun that would go after of in the following use cases "Dog of mom (mom's dog)" "5 of cats (5 cats)" "None of mice (no mice)"

      So if you can fit "of" before a noun it is usually genitive.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/iOfg2

      Oooooh ok thank you, I don't know a lot of plural endings yet so that's why I didn't see it.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bry.paz

      I said "many dogs." How is that wrong?


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/U90AzMVv

      You are supposed to write the russian


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlanLutsky

      Why not много собаки


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IamJustintime

      Много (+ countable noun) must take the Genitive Plural.

      Собака --> Собак for Genitive (and accusative) Plural Собака --> Собаки for Nominative Plural and Genitive Singular

      If you think of много as "a lot" rather than "many", then using the Genitive case feels more intuitive as an English speaker.


      https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Donny848941

      many dogs is a much better translation.

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