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https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7

Tips for using the Sentence Discussion forums

Usagiboy7
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Sentence discussion forum

  • When using the sentence discussion forums, only discuss the sentence. Your comments are most helpful if they are questions or answers regarding the grammar, conjugation, and pronunciation. (Please do not leave comments about audio-quality in those forums unless you are a course builder who is informing people about the TTS.)

  • Before asking a question, read the questions and answers others have already posted to avoid repeating a question.

  • If someone has already said thank you, upvote that comment instead of making a new thank you comment.

  • Do not report errors, technical difficulties, or answers in the Sentence discussion forum. Report errors using the Report button.

  • Please remember to be respectful when interacting with others in the Sentence discussion forums.

  • In a sentence discussion forum, only use down votes for spam or comments not respecting the above points, never for relevant questions, even if they seem obvious to you. (If you see someone rapid spamming-filling a discussion with tons of spam, please report them.

Some of these can be altered slightly. But please keep in mind that if we multiple one person's impulse to post a joke or non-viable comment by 250,000,000 users, a lot of clutter can build up. So be considerate when using the Sentence discussion forums. The idea is for people to post their relevant questions and receive relevant answers in a timely fashion, without a lot of extra scrolling through duplicate and off topic comments.

Have I missed anything?

2 years ago

62 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Luis_Domingos
Luis_Domingos
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Great job as always, Usagi! :) I'd stress people shouldn't engage a troll directly if they find someone spamming (just downvote to hide the post and call a mod if you feel some action needs to be taken about it), and make sure you're polite and respectful in your comments towards other users.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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Thanks! I've added a note about that. :)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flint72
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I disagree with your suggestion to "only use down-votes for spam". We should also use downvotes for incorrect answers. That is, if person A asks a question, and person B gives an incorrect answer, said answer of B should be downvoted, to prevent other students from learning something incorrect by mistake.

I have seen this happen many many times, that non-native speakers, or new-learners of a given language give incorrect answers to new-learners questions.

Granted only a native speaker of person who has already studied the language to a high level can make such judgements correctly, but they are very valuable judgements when they are made.

Another instance when downvotes should be used is if the same question is asked repeatedly, which you allude to, so that all but one copy of said question will be deleted, de-cluttering the sentence discussions.

Also, I completely disagree with your suggestion to avoid tangential topics in sentence discussions (though perhaps I misunderstand what you mean by 'tangential'?). When I did the Irish course (which I already speak to a high level), I added in many examples of extra related vocabulary, cultural context etc., so that keen students could learn even more than the vocabulary offered. Most of these comments are quite highly upvoted, and I would like to think appreciated.

On the other hand, currently learning a brand new language, Russian, I am incredibly grateful to the number of native speakers populating the sentence discussions who are giving us addition vocabulary and cultural insight. I think these add enormously to the learning experience, and it would be a terrible shame to see them go.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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Ah, that is a good point I didn't address up above. I was focusing on the problem of questions being down voted, which is sinking some very good explanations.

As for multiple copies of the same question, yes extras are most often deleted, with a few left if very good, separate advice has been divided among them.

By tangential I mean off topic or leading further and further away from the main point as to lose contact with the topic. At a certain point too, these can become so overgrown as to take up the discussion and make for a lot of scrolling to get beyond the one question that sparked it all. These, while at times being severely amazing, can also cause a bottle neck in which people start asking the same questions over and over again because they would rather receive a notification of someone answering them rather than scroll through the nutrient rich jungles of a massive discussion. This is the hardest thing for which I am the least confident about in my advice. So, I appreciate your feedback.

As someone who is tasked with keeping the forums tidy and having to navigate them in order to do so (and not the only person), I feel that my suggestions make some sense. Without moderators to clean them, the sentence discussions would long since be useless by now. Making those forums viable relies on a partnership between general users and moderators to find a comfortable medium that make the forums cleanable without being too burdensome, and usable enough so as to still be informative. I hope my tips have made this medium ground possible.

I'm sure that your cultural insights have been a boon to the community. I am mainly hoping to instill good habits and awareness for people using those forums that the actions of one person multiplied by 100,000,000 users or however many actually active accounts there are makes keeping the forums viable quite the task.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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I disagree with your suggestion to "only use down-votes for spam".

I agree with you, flint72!

@usagiboy7, I'd put the paragraph about downvotes at the bottom of the list and formulate it something like

In a sentence discussion forum, {@style=color:blue;}use down votes for example for {@style=color:red;}comments failing to respect one of the above points or those being {@style=color:red;}spam, never for {@style=color:green;}relevant questions ({@style=color:red;}except, again, if they {@style=color:red;}don't respect one of the above points).

For the cases not being one of the red one nor the green one, then up-/down-voting it up to the user discernment. (Here falls the "incorrect answers" case. ;))

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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I thought I fixed that one. Thanks for the follow up and the additional suggestions!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/egazaky1

asu

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GabiDemartino

thanks!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mizinamo
mizinamo
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Don't leave comments saying "Yeah, I got this wrong as well" or responding to questions with "I don't know".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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Thank you for your feedback! I think both of those kinds of comments are covered in what's already on list.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MarthaLoda
MarthaLoda
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How can I contribute to discussions that are not from my courses? My basic language here is English, I learn German and Italian, but I'm a native Ukrainian speaker. I would really love to help those learning Ukrainian. It would be helpful if I could see and contribute to English-Ukrainian sentences discussions.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mizinamo
mizinamo
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Bookmark https://www.duolingo.com/topic/913 - that's the "Ukrainian for English speakers" forum.

Or https://www.duolingo.com/topic/913/sent , which is specifically the sentence discussions.

It's difficult to scroll very far back, so you probably won't be able to contribute much to older discussions because you can't discover them, but if you check for newly-created sentences discussions every day or so, you can be of help.

Depending on how much time you want to spend, you might wish to subscribe to every single new discussion you find, so that you will be notified of questions that come in the future. Because the sentence discussions feed only lists newly-created sentence discussions, not new comments on old sentence discussions -- and if someone has a new question on a 3-month-old discussion, you would never find it if you did not get a notification.

Alternatively to bookmarking, you can start the Ukrainian course (perhaps go up to level 2 or so) and then you should also be able to select to subscribe to the Ukrainian forum - then it will appear in the right-hand sidebar of the "Discussion" area in the website for you all the time and you won't have to remember the URL.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MarthaLoda
MarthaLoda
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Thank you, I'll try to help when I have time.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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To setup a fast access to any forum where you want to help, do the following:

  1. Switch to the course you want to help other with (for example "Ukrainian from English" course).
    Here about how to switch quickly. See method 2. in the link. (for example go to URL "www.duolingo.com/course/uk/en" for "Ukrainian from English" course)
  2. Go the the forum page here.
  3. Subscribe to the forum where you want to help ("Ukrainian from English" in our example).
  4. Switch back to the course you're taking yourself on Duolingo.

The forum where you want to help ("Ukrainian from English" in our example) will now be listed on the right when you are on the forums page.
Repeat the process for any forum you'd like to follow. The interest of this method is that you don't need to know what is the URL of this or that forum.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TracyS221
TracyS221
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I have wondered - some sentence discussions start with someone saying effectively Duo has got this wrong, these can get a lot of upvotes and therefore appear at the top of the list. Sometimes you have to scroll quite a way down before you find someone who really knows the language giving a decent explanation of why, in many cases, the original text is correct. Is it possible to use a sticky (in the sentence discussion) in a case like this to put a proper explanation at the top of the list to stop people being misled?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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It'd indeed be great and has been suggested long ago by course volunteer contributors. We have to be patient... We've been said it's planned but Duo staff has a lot of things to implement/fix/etc. everywhere so we have no date nor even estimation of potential date. ;)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TracyS221
TracyS221
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Thanks - good to know it's being considered.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lrtward
Lrtward
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This is excellent, and much needed.

You have already said to only discuss the sentence, but it might be worth explicitly saying that if you want to talk about Duolingo, ask for friends/conversation practice, or engage in language related conversation NOT relevant to the sentence at hand, the place to do that is in the forums.

I see this is already in the Wiki and FAQ stickied post. Good job :)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lrtward
Lrtward
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I thought of something else.

What about discussing the audio/pronunciation of a word? On one hand a ton of "it's hard to understand" and "the audio sucks" are not helpful. On the other hand, discussing how a single word might be pronounced differently in various regions is helpful.

So, um, yeah, you might want to throw something in there about appropriate ways to discuss the audio. I'll leave the exact phrasing as an exercise for the author ;-)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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Suggestions added. Thank you so much for your feedback!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/A_User
A_User
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What about questions about "Would this translation be accurate?" and "Why does the audio sound like this in this specific case?"

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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Would this translation be accurate?

Yes, that's fine.

Why does the audio sound like this in this specific case?

No, that would be an issue regarding the technology, not the sentence.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/A_User
A_User
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OK, thanks!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/68dustin

Big hugs!!! :)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/UneJamKuqEZi

You should sticky this so more people see it. And there's no other comment saying thank you, so...

Thank you! :D

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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We have to use the Sticky very sparingly, but a few of these public service announcement posts will be bumped from time to time to bring them back around. :) Also, yvw.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mmazzoli8
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I do agree with you. We should be very grateful to Duolingo and try to learn as many languages as we possible can. It's amazing how we can learn multiple languages at such a speedy rate. A big hug to all of you.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/abhishekshchinu
abhishekshchinu
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i agree . duolingo is a great medium to learn multiple languages

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lemarzetta

Is this the sentence discussion forum or Just a permanent post of the rules? Thank you.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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This is one discussion, in the General (English) forum, and is a permanent post giving Tips.

A sentence discussion is a discussion having as original post (the one above the field "Leave a new comment") an exercise of a specific course: see screenshot as the very beginning of the original post of this discussion.
Sentence discussions can be accessed (on web version, not apps) either during a lesson or in the "sentences" tab of any course forum.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wochenweise

It would be nice to have a little How-To about how to post something on the activity stream of someone, and a link to that in every post that suggests it.

Posting on someone's activity stream is suggested as an alternative to several sorts of things considered spamming, and it's pretty straightforward if you know what to look for and where to look. Though when I was new to Duolingo, I'd have been completely nonplussed if someone had told me to do that. So maybe it would make sense to tell people how to do it, if you want them to do it.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Anneduol1ngo

When learning I find that I often think DL may be wrong, but at least more likely I may be wrong in such things as audio or translation. If I report it I do not get teaching or feedback and can persist in my uncertainty or, worse my false belief that I am right and DL is wrong on a point.

Prior to reporting or as well as reporting I often would like confirmation from other users of the correct answer or audio.

Recently I posted about not hearing a liaison in a French exercise, and, having tried to say the words with a liaison and found it difficult with the liaison I decided to post to say I hadn't heard the liaison to see if people would tell me that this was an exception.

I have had very little, and always very delayed feedback from reporting, and only when DL has considered me correct. Never have I had anything back to tell me DL was correct and I was wrong and why, which I do get in the Discuss this Sentence.

Also I do think it helpful to find that others have considered a sentence wrong and then I will report it. I realise that many others may have made the same mistake and we all may be wrong, but if several have reported the same thing as wrong perhaps it makes it more likely that it is truly wrong, but not necessarily. However, the absence of correction of the comments does give added confidence.

I did see some graffiti on a toilet door many, many years ago that still helps me. Being graffiti, I cannot write it here as it is so there are some *s, but you will see the meaning. 'Eat st, 1000,000 flies can't be wrong.'

So, in summary, there is some value in my opinion to repeating some comments (but remove the repetitions once a valid answer has been given) as well as posting things on the 'discuss this sentence' to say that there may be a mistake rather than reporting immediately one thinks something is wrong.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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There are millions of erroneous error reports being sent in. (Meaning people who sent the reports were wrong, not the sentence.) For example, in the beginning This Sentence was flooded with assertions that "行くis go, not come" (In fact that is also the top comment and it has been up voted 85 times as of now.) The people leaving such comments and up voting them are not native speakers and have simply not encountered this usage before. The usage itself is correct. Those giving that feedback are wrong.

So, I wouldn't rely on people saying they reported it as an indicator that something is wrong. Language and poop (re: your analogy) are not the same. In this case, the analogy is not consistently reliable. As someone who has cleaned sentence discussions for years, I've encountered a ton of newer language users confidently making assertions of errors were there aren't any.

Many repeated comments also make the forums less attractive to people who would come in and give an explanation of why it was wrong or right. Digging through so much clutter to find people's questions is more time consuming than not digging through clutter to find questions. Additionally, multiple reports on the same sentence clogs the reporting system and slows things down. So, if one person has commented "buggy/error", I hope that people will stop filing duplicate reports and commenting about it. It is a double whammy of not helpful on many levels.

Like everything else on Duolingo, there is a bit of a learning curve, and that includes the Sentence Discussion forums. I hope that people will realize that the list of tips I compiled up top is a very informed one. :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Anneduol1ngo

I do appreciate all you have said, and thanks for your time and patience, but what to do when we learners don't know if something is wrong or not and so don't know if to report it? I appreciate that most of what is on DL is good and correct, but there are errors and I don't want to learn something that I suspect may be wrong.

What about some kind of searchable database of reported errors that have been shown not to be errors? I don't know. That would run into the millions probably and so not feasible.

I do agree repeated reports of errors time and time again also gives problems. Perhaps if one person makes the comment that there is a bug or error they should also state that it has been reported and then, when I see this I know I don't need to report it.

Re the graffiti, actually my point is that, yes, 1,000,000 flies CAN (emphasis, not shouting) be wrong. And that is how the graffiti helps me. I remember that truth remains truth no matter how many people say the opposite.

I don't have the confidence to say anything in French is an error, but sometimes I do know that something in English is an error and have argued my point on a forum and it has been changed. I'm not talking about something obscure or a special usage of a word, but something ordinary and everyday when in England we have totally adopted a particular French phrase into the language and the translation into English would mean nothing to anyone I know.

Please feel free to delete any of my posts here as most of this is now a conversation between yourself and me and I don't know how helpful it is to anyone else.

You really are appreciated! I am not trying to contradict your wisdom and experience, just trying to find a way forward for myself. Thanks again. :-)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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No prob. It's what I'm here for. Also, I don't feel that you are trying to be confrontational at all. So, don't worry about that. From my perspective, you are trying to get a solid understanding of how to navigate Duolingo. That's part of the purpose of the discussion forums. :)

If someone isn't sure, they shouldn't report it. And if someone is sure, they should first read through the sentence discussion forum comments, just as a secondary precaution. If they are still sure after doing that, they should report it (unless they know that someone else already has. If it's a sentence with debate happening, chances are very high that several people have already hit the report button.)

Duolingo definitely isn't the whole package for language learning. Outside of total immersive exposure, I don't think there is a total package.) Questions won't always get answered, uncertainty will exist, even for adult native speakers! (I did not realize this so much until exposure to the Duolingo sentence discussions. And quite a bit of it is to do with regionalisms.)

Language proficiency comes with familiarity. If you learn something that isn't quite right, you'll adjust to how the people or sources around you are using the language in various situations. It can be frustrating, when learners are building a theory of language, especially if the learning is expected to be short term, or if there is a test waiting to be taken. If someone has a long term learning goal, hopefully, they will remember to breath and know that the course will correct as they go.

As a secondary option to the sentence discussion forum, there are the language specific forums if someone is just not getting the answers they need.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Anneduol1ngo

Thanks. I think it is clear to me (for now!)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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You are welcome to ask follow up questions, if need be. There is always the chance for me to learn something I hadn't considered too, of course. :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/oldestguru
oldestguru
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If the jokes get forbidden, then learning gets boring and duolingo loses both customers and money. Let the jokes stay and don't transform this awesome learning platform into some politically correct fascist place. Thank you in advance.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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There are plenty of strange sentences for people to enjoy. Too politically correct is another way of saying "too respectful". What we are discussing here is keeping the forums useful. If they become useless, Duolingo will remove them. If they are removed, there are not only no jokes, but also none of the helpful comments that people place there...

Some jokes remain here and there. There are some things that take priority over clearing 100% of the jokes. Hopefully, people won't abuse this.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/oldestguru
oldestguru
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I have lived in a former dictatorship where freedom of speech was non-existent and people could get deported to the forced labor camps or killed by the secret police for telling jokes (Communist Romania). I just hoped that here in the free world of internet it will be different and we could tell a joke without disappearing overnight.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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If you go to someone's house and they ask you to remove your shoes before stepping onto the carpet, are they a fascist? If they ask you to leave their house when you refuse, do you equate their actions to murder? These are rhetorical questions.

If you have concerns about the philosophies governing Duolingo, you are welcome to contact staff.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/oldestguru
oldestguru
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I like how you think. You put reason before everything. That's awesome.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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I don't like how you were treated. It sounds like you went through scary things. I am now reading about Romania's history. Sadly, I can't converse more, because it is off topic. But, I at least wanted to say, I wish you had been treated better.

2 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Brendan06

Cool!!!!

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dizzychem

Thank you so much for such a great site! I am finding it so much easier to learn a language than I did at school! (And that was over 40 years ago) dizzychem

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CSA_GW
CSA_GW
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May I suggest that duo auto-sorts the discussions in some defined orders, such as

  • per time,

  • per alphabetic,

  • per voting rates,

  • etc

11 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
Mod
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Hi CSA_GW, I recommend making that discussion in the main forum, not in this discussion. I'm not staff. So, me seeing it won't boost the suggestion. ^_^

11 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesJomiz

I have a great idea for them. They have a chatty comment section, and then another that pertains to the sentence, so we can all get what we want.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/COULIB1

je voudrais l audio vissuel

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pesasynutr

i learned english with duolingo but not much someone has the same problem?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pesasynutr

this is a good medium to learn a new lenguage but i want there to be interactives videos to learn

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pesasynutr

you should practice english every day if you really want to learn english

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pesasynutr

you have already learned

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Iluvreading

?

1 year ago