"Nie widzę tej dziewczynki."

Translation:I do not see this girl.

December 13, 2015

25 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/pomber94

Quick Question: What's the difference between "ta" and "tej" in the correct use of the word? shouldn't "Nie widzę ta dziewczynki" be correct too? coming from a Spanish speaker this has only one case, so I'm somewhat confused.

December 19, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/Duan
  • 115

The difference is that "ta" is in the nominative, while "tej" is the genitive form.

December 19, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/Argimak

What does that mean?

May 20, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/kjsoda

Nouns have different forms depending on how they are used. I think the clearest example in English is the he/she versus him/her distinction. In the sentence "I do not see this girl", the word "girl" is the object in a negated sentence (that is, it states what the subject is not doing). As a result, in Polish the noun "girl" is in the genitive form ("dziewczynki"). Since "this" is associated with the girl, it too is placed in the genitive ("tej"). If the sentence were instead "The girl does not see me", "girl" would be the subject, requiring the nominative form ("dziewczynka"), and "this" would follow suit ("ta").

May 20, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/Duan
  • 115

kjsoda gives an excellent summary. Basically, we categorize words into serving different functions in a sentence. In English, we usually put them in the same order (subject, verb, object). That is, "the man rides the horse" means something different than "the horse rides the man". In the first sentence, the man is the subject of the sentence, while in the second he is the object (and vice versa for the horse).

In some languages, a word is modified depending on which function it is serving. You can see this in English with the personal pronouns.

She has a dog. ("She" is the subject of this sentence.) The dog saw her. (Her is the object of this sentence.) You see the same with him and her, I and me and who and whom. But note that these (and possibly a handful of others I'm forgetting right now) are exceptions. Notice that in the above sentences, "the dog" is in the same form in both subject and object.

In Polish, this is much more regular. Every polish noun has 7 forms depending on the function it serves.

I hope that between the answers, you have a better understanding now :)

May 20, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/Argimak

Thanks a lot, and thanks to kjsoda too. That's a good summary.

I know a lot of people like learning using the linguistic terms for things but I find it much easier to understand without the jargon, you know?

May 21, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/Duan
  • 115

I completely understand, everyone learns in their own way :).

May 21, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/DinoRaptor76

It's easier to learn something without having to learn the words that are being used to teach you what initially intended to learn, especially when the definition of said words are being skipped over 99.9% of the time.

November 2, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JoJonders

As far as I'm concerned, you have to use the genitive form in negations, in sentences with nie, while otherwise you use the accusative. This would mean, that both "nie widzę ta dziewczynkę" and "widzę tej dziewczynki" were wrong. Only "widzę dziewczynkę" and "nie widzę tej dziewczynki" are right. If I've got a mistake, please correct me, but it should be right.

April 26, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/immery

You are correct. Widzę tę dziewczynkę. Nie widzę tej dziewczynki.

All the other versions are wrong. Of course you may be understood, in the way saying "I sees she" may be understood.

April 26, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/JacobKrebs

Isn't "dziewczynki" plural though?

December 13, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/Viersch

No because it is inflected singular here.

December 13, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/PaulStone17

Dzieki

April 10, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/Kevin154451

Very helpful info guys, much appreciated.

February 21, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/IamJustintime

Would a native always use the SVO (Subject Verb Object) format or do you sometimes modify to your liking? For instance, would it be nateral to say, //Tej dziewczynki nie widzę.//

August 3, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Jellei

Well, it's understandable, it's not technically wrong, but there's no reason for anyone to say that, unless it's like "You - I see, her - I see, this girl - I don't see"... It's just very unusual.

August 5, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/kjsoda

Follow up question: My observation is that sometimes the use of pronouns as objects changes the conventional sentence order; I believe I have seen SOV order in some preferred translations. Am I remembering correctly? If so, is there a good guideline for when to do so (e.g., do you always use SOV order in this context)?

August 5, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Jellei

The only thing that I'm able to say that generally pronouns shouldn't go at the end of the sentence, if this can be avoided.

So: "Nienawidzę jej" - no real alternative, it's ok. "Nie lubię jej" - still no alternative, as "Nie jej lubię" wouldn't make any sense. But if you start the sentence with "Ja", it turns into "Ja jej nienawidzę" and "Ja jej nie lubię". Because you CAN avoid putting the pronoun at the end, and putting it there would be like writing "HER" in capital letters, with a lot more emphasis.

August 6, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/knnida

If I were using the accusative form for "this girl " , it would be wrong?

November 2, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/Jellei

Yup, wrong. Accusative would be used in a positive sentence. The negation of it needs Genitive.

November 3, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/PeterBeenke

I don't see these girls

June 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Jellei

"dziewczynki" is plural "girls", true.

But you also have to take cases into consideration. "widzieć" takes Accusative. A verb that needs Accusative, takes Genitive instead when negated. And just like for most feminine nouns, Genitive singular and Nominative plural are identical. And this is Genitive singular here.

June 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Rorke175

My question is, how can I not see THIS girl. If we are designating this particular girl, wouldn't I already be seeing her?

January 30, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Jellei

'this girl that we are talking about'. Or maybe she's actually invisible.

Yes, I know that this is problematic, because what is perfectly natural in Polish (tej) may be kinda weird in English (this), but well, we have to keep to the direct translation here or otherwise it will be even more confusing.

You may answer with "that" any time you see a form of "tej". It's more of an interpretation, but it's correct.

February 2, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Rorke175

ok, dziękuję

February 5, 2019
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