"We go to this man."

Translation:Chodzimy do tego mężczyzny.

December 14, 2015

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Ok, as a native Polish speaker I would never translate this sentence like that. In Polish there is only one present tense. By using different verbs we distinguish which action is done usually and is finished and which action is currently happening. "Chodzimy" (chodzić) means we go, but in the sense that we go somewhere usually, like we go to school. "Idziemy" (iść) means also we go, but the action is current, may be one time thing.


So if we go somewhere usually, "We go". And if we are going currently, "We are going".


Polish is my first language and there are many ways to say this sentence in polish, so more than just one should be accepted.


Well, right now there are 9 variants accepted. What are you suggesting?


change the sentence in the English so it is easier to tell which form of ·"to go" to use. For example, 'we go to this man after school' - it is easier to tell that you need to use "chodzimy" instead of "idziemy".


I put going instead of walking and was wrong. That is what she is implying.


How do you know which form of 'to go' to use?

  • 2888

I think you have to take the sense from the sentence:

  • iść (idę/idziesz/idzie/idziemy/idziecie/idą) - means 'to go' in that very moment. 'We are going to this man [right now]' = 'Idziemy do tego mężczyzny'
  • chodzić (chodzę/chodzisz/chodzi/chodzimy/chodzicie/chodzą) - also means 'to go' but more in the habitual way. 'We go to this man each Saturday' = 'Chodzimy do tego mężczyzny w każdą sobotę'

Polish verbs of motion work that way: jechać/jeździć, lecieć/latać, płynąć/pływać, biec/biegać itd.


So, 'Idziemy do tego mężczyzny' (which is what I wrote) could be an acceptable version?


In this English sentence, the present simple ("we go ...") is used, which means that the action "to go" is habitual. Thus, the verb "chodzić" has to be used here. If the present continuous was used in the English sentence ("we're going ..."), that would mean "to go" in that very moment, and in that case the verb "iść" should be used.

However, I'm not a native speaker (neither Polish nor English), so I might be wrong. :) It would be good if some native speaker could check this.

  • 2888

I think it should. The difference is quite flat (in English), and if the lesson, where it appears doesn't learn the difference, or give more context, both should be accepted IMO.


Why doesn't "Idziemy" work? I though "Chodzimy" implied walking while "Idziemy" is a generic "we are going" kind of word. I understand the translation implies repeatedly doing that, but is "Chodzimy" still the best word for this?

Also, I thought "iść" implied habitual while "pójść" implies once. Is this wrong? I am starting to figure out these two aspects, but they still confuse me


"Chodzimy" implies habitual, "Idziemy" implies 'right now', so generally 'chodzić' is translated using Simple tense: we go, we walk; while 'iść' using Continous: we are going, we are walking. Also Continous 'walking' with no purpose and direction is 'chodzić'.

"Pójść" is the perfective counterpart of "iść", so it is impossible to use it in the Present tense. And yes, it does imply 'once'.


That is so confusing. So I have another quesiton. Are all verbs either perfective or imperfective? Isn't "zjeść" perfective? And isn't "jeść" imperfective?


Well, not literally 'all' but mostly they do come in such a pair, yes.

Yes, you got them right. It's good to remember that Polish words for them are "dokonany/niedokonany", so literally "accomplished/not accomplished".


I really wish I had my two reference grammar books for Polish but they are in boxes right now because we are in the middle of moving. But since I don't have that, I will just have to pester you with another question! If you say something like, "You can upload pictures to this site." Would you say, "Możesz ładować zdjęcia do tego portalu" or would you say załadować?

I used this site to look up the word "to upload." At first, I was going to use "to add" (dodać). Which I assume would work in either language, but technically speaking upload is probably a better word.


No it is not clear from the sentence that it is habitual. It even might be an affirmative statement, like "..oh yes we go to this man. Right now.."; and so "iść" form should be accepted; Submitting a report..


In general, "We go" is habitual. Even if we could find some counterexample contexts, we cannot really take them into consideration - that would mean we don't have any means of teaching the difference between "chodzić" and "iść".


We could add more lexical tense/aspect markers such as right now, usually, etc.

There are languages, such as German that don't have this distinction at all, so theoretically there must be another way to teach it.

But, of course, I agree, the current choice of accepted tenses should remain unchanged.


In English, the sentence could mean on foot, by car or bus, etc. It's not clear - how? - but it doesn't matter.

In Polish, speakers are more accurate.

They would say: chodzić, iść or pójść, if they went on foot.

They would say: jechać, jeździć, if they went by car, bus or train.

Native English, Polish resident. ☺


What is wrong with "Idziemy" in this sentence? All of the practice sentences are differentiating "to go = iść" and "to walk = chodzić" but this sentence breaks that teaching.


I mean, I could explain it yet another time, but I'll rather have you read the comments.


I have read them, and none address what I have. The sentences and lessons leading up to this teach the student that "to go = iść" and "to walk = chodzić" but then this sentence comes along and throws what you have been taught away, leaving the student dumbfounded. There needs to be a consistency. You need to either have previous lessons and sentences shows in what cases these Polish words become switched or are interchangeable, not just drop it on the student like a brick and expect them to understand.


Strange... I've just taken another look at the comments and everything's right there.

Polish doesn't distinguish between we go (on foot) and we walk. Both translate to chodzimy.

Polish verbs of motion have a determinate form (happening progressively) and an indeterminate form (happens habitually). Iść is the determinate version of chodzić, which is indeterminate. So, we go, which is present simple (habitual, not progressive), can't be translated to idziemy, only chodzimy. Exceptions to this rule are very rare.


Isn't that how we learn? By encountering a new example this way, one tends to remember it.


Jeździć in Polish is more typically used in reference to motion by vehicles. Jeździć samochodem, (riding a car), for example. I don't think you would use it in place of chodzić or iść in this sentence.


so mezczyzna is masculine right? so shouldnt it be mezczyanu in the genitive form, why does it have a y


Yes, "mężczyzna" is a masculine noun and Genitive form of "mężczyzna" is "mężczyzny". It ends with "a" so you can think about it that it is declined as if it were a feminine noun. Besides, the form "mężczyanu" doesn't sound natural in Polish. You can check table of declension:


Besides, you can check that Genitive for masculine nouns is formed otherwise: https://i.imgur.com/NjFhVJV.jpg


Isn't a form "Chadzamy" also correct?


Yes. In a way, it's even better, but it's outside the scope of this course.

"chadzamy" (from the habitual verb "chadzać") does indeed show the habitual (what a surprise) aspect of the verb. We do not teach it (although probably we will in Tree 2.0, but near the end of the tree), we accept it here and then, so added here as well :)


I sometimes try the strangest options whether they fit or not. PS I am a native speaker of Polish, so: pozdrawiam


Why "Chodzimy do tego pana" is not correct?


It's fine, added.


Why is "My chodzimy do tego mężczyzny" not accepted?


It should be, it's an accepted answer.


Why doesn't "chodzimy tego mężczyzny" work?


For the same reason as "We go this man" doesn't, you didn't put any preposition.


Can we not use genitive to imply the word 'to'?


I'm unaware of any examples where the genitive case alone would indicate a direction.


Why -mężczyzny instead -mężczyzna?


The preposition "do" in every context needs Genitive case, which for "mężczyzna" is "mężczyzny".

  • 1193

man = człowiek


Yes, we accept "tego człowieka" as well.


Doesnt it end with an A? The word mezczyzny?


Its basic form, "mężczyzna", does. Why are you asking?

Is it because we used "tego"? Well, it's still a masculine noun (it means "a man", after all), even if it ends with -a, as normally feminine nouns do. E.g. "We go to this woman" would be "Chodzimy do tej kobiety".


Present Simple :Chodzić Present Continues:Isć "We go to this man" :present simple. "Chozimy do tego męźczyzny "


"chodzimy". But generally, that is correct.


we go to this man, dlaczego idziemy do tego człowieka to bład?


"we go" is not "idziemy", but "chodzimy".

"we are going" is "idziemy".


Please explain why my sentence , ie, the word order is incorrect. Thank you.


You didn't provide us with a sentence.


Idziemy do tego mężczyzny isn't accepted. Why can't that mean we go there sometimes (or often)?


Because iść is not habitual.

In the future, please read the sentence discussion prior to posting your own comment.

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