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"We go to this man."

Translation:Chodzimy do tego mężczyzny.

December 14, 2015

52 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/moella

How do you know which form of 'to go' to use?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gabe81
  • 2221

I think you have to take the sense from the sentence:

  • iść (idę/idziesz/idzie/idziemy/idziecie/idą) - means 'to go' in that very moment. 'We are going to this man [right now]' = 'Idziemy do tego mężczyzny'
  • chodzić (chodzę/chodzisz/chodzi/chodzimy/chodzicie/chodzą) - also means 'to go' but more in the habitual way. 'We go to this man each Saturday' = 'Chodzimy do tego mężczyzny w każdą sobotę'

Polish verbs of motion work that way: jechać/jeździć, lecieć/latać, płynąć/pływać, biec/biegać itd.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/moella

So, 'Idziemy do tego mężczyzny' (which is what I wrote) could be an acceptable version?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/inzenjer_Babic

In this English sentence, the present simple ("we go ...") is used, which means that the action "to go" is habitual. Thus, the verb "chodzić" has to be used here. If the present continuous was used in the English sentence ("we're going ..."), that would mean "to go" in that very moment, and in that case the verb "iść" should be used.

However, I'm not a native speaker (neither Polish nor English), so I might be wrong. :) It would be good if some native speaker could check this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gabe81
  • 2221

I think it should. The difference is quite flat (in English), and if the lesson, where it appears doesn't learn the difference, or give more context, both should be accepted IMO.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zagadka314

Why doesn't "Idziemy" work? I though "Chodzimy" implied walking while "Idziemy" is a generic "we are going" kind of word. I understand the translation implies repeatedly doing that, but is "Chodzimy" still the best word for this?

Also, I thought "iść" implied habitual while "pójść" implies once. Is this wrong? I am starting to figure out these two aspects, but they still confuse me


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

"Chodzimy" implies habitual, "Idziemy" implies 'right now', so generally 'chodzić' is translated using Simple tense: we go, we walk; while 'iść' using Continous: we are going, we are walking. Also Continous 'walking' with no purpose and direction is 'chodzić'.

"Pójść" is the perfective counterpart of "iść", so it is impossible to use it in the Present tense. And yes, it does imply 'once'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zagadka314

That is so confusing. So I have another quesiton. Are all verbs either perfective or imperfective? Isn't "zjeść" perfective? And isn't "jeść" imperfective?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Well, not literally 'all' but mostly they do come in such a pair, yes.

Yes, you got them right. It's good to remember that Polish words for them are "dokonany/niedokonany", so literally "accomplished/not accomplished".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zagadka314

I really wish I had my two reference grammar books for Polish but they are in boxes right now because we are in the middle of moving. But since I don't have that, I will just have to pester you with another question! If you say something like, "You can upload pictures to this site." Would you say, "Możesz ładować zdjęcia do tego portalu" or would you say załadować?

I used this site to look up the word "to upload." At first, I was going to use "to add" (dodać). Which I assume would work in either language, but technically speaking upload is probably a better word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zagadka314

So why might one say "Zjeść!" if they want to make someone eat?

So the imperfective doesn't always mean "habitually" or something like that?

If the perfective can't be present, what does it mean if you say "zjeść" or another word in this form?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Emwue

Well, first of all I would use „wgrywać” in this context, always – all other verbs sound weirdly 'wrong', as if you were forced to translate 'upload' and couldn't use „wgrywać” or „uploadować”… But that might be just my idiolect.

As for the actual question, I would use „wgrać” or if forced „załadować” – otherwise it sounds like you can attempt it, but you will certainly fail, either because „portal” is too slow or it won't allow it in the end or something like that. ;)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/inakims

Ok, as a native Polish speaker I would never translate this sentence like that. In Polish there is only one present tense. By using different verbs we distinguish which action is done usually and is finished and which action is currently happening. "Chodzimy" (chodzić) means we go, but in the sense that we go somewhere usually, like we go to school. "Idziemy" (iść) means also we go, but the action is current, may be one time thing.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mihxal

So if we go somewhere usually, "We go". And if we are going currently, "We are going".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Saulius.M

No it is not clear from the sentence that it is habitual. It even might be an affirmative statement, like "..oh yes we go to this man. Right now.."; and so "iść" form should be accepted; Submitting a report..


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

In general, "We go" is habitual. Even if we could find some counterexample contexts, we cannot really take them into consideration - that would mean we don't have any means of teaching the difference between "chodzić" and "iść".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

We could add more lexical tense/aspect markers such as right now, usually, etc.

There are languages, such as German that don't have this distinction at all, so theoretically there must be another way to teach it.

But, of course, I agree, the current choice of accepted tenses should remain unchanged.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Olivia639620

Polish is my first language and there are many ways to say this sentence in polish, so more than just one should be accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Well, right now there are 9 variants accepted. What are you suggesting?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Olivia639620

change the sentence in the English so it is easier to tell which form of ·"to go" to use. For example, 'we go to this man after school' - it is easier to tell that you need to use "chodzimy" instead of "idziemy".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

"We go" samo w sobie już implikuje "chodzimy". Do "idziemy" (w tej chwili) potrzebne byłoby "we are going".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Olivia639620

nawet nie znałam różnicy między nimi w angielskim haha dziękuje


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Zasadniczo uczymy naszych obcojęzycznych uczniów:

We go, We walk = Chodzimy

We are going, We are walking = Idziemy

I czasami "We are walking" jeśli w zdaniu nie ma nic o celu i kierunku, także może być "chodzimy".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JaniceSchl1

I put going instead of walking and was wrong. That is what she is implying.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ShaulYahil

Jeździć in Polish is more typically used in reference to motion by vehicles. Jeździć samochodem, (riding a car), for example. I don't think you would use it in place of chodzić or iść in this sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/OwenOSulli1

In English, the sentence could mean on foot, by car or bus, etc. It's not clear - how? - but it doesn't matter.

In Polish, speakers are more accurate.

They would say: chodzić, iść or pójść, if they went on foot.

They would say: jechać, jeździć, if they went by car, bus or train.

Native English, Polish resident. ☺


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IanIanIanIan_

so mezczyzna is masculine right? so shouldnt it be mezczyanu in the genitive form, why does it have a y


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mihxal

Yes, "mężczyzna" is a masculine noun and Genitive form of "mężczyzna" is "mężczyzny". It ends with "a" so you can think about it that it is declined as if it were a feminine noun. Besides, the form "mężczyanu" doesn't sound natural in Polish. You can check table of declension:

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/m%C4%99%C5%BCczyzna

Besides, you can check that Genitive for masculine nouns is formed otherwise: https://i.imgur.com/NjFhVJV.jpg


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sean00913

What is wrong with "Idziemy" in this sentence? All of the practice sentences are differentiating "to go = iść" and "to walk = chodzić" but this sentence breaks that teaching.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

I mean, I could explain it yet another time, but I'll rather have you read the comments.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sean00913

I have read them, and none address what I have. The sentences and lessons leading up to this teach the student that "to go = iść" and "to walk = chodzić" but then this sentence comes along and throws what you have been taught away, leaving the student dumbfounded. There needs to be a consistency. You need to either have previous lessons and sentences shows in what cases these Polish words become switched or are interchangeable, not just drop it on the student like a brick and expect them to understand.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

Strange... I've just taken another look at the comments and everything's right there.

Polish doesn't distinguish between we go (on foot) and we walk. Both translate to chodzimy.

Polish verbs of motion have a determinate form (happening progressively) and an indeterminate form (happens habitually). Iść is the determinate version of chodzić, which is indeterminate. So, we go, which is present simple (habitual, not progressive), can't be translated to idziemy, only chodzimy. Exceptions to this rule are very rare.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anubis72

Isn't a form "Chadzamy" also correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Yes. In a way, it's even better, but it's outside the scope of this course.

"chadzamy" (from the habitual verb "chadzać") does indeed show the habitual (what a surprise) aspect of the verb. We do not teach it (although probably we will in Tree 2.0, but near the end of the tree), we accept it here and then, so added here as well :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anubis72

I sometimes try the strangest options whether they fit or not. PS I am a native speaker of Polish, so: pozdrawiam


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KivHanna

Why "Chodzimy do tego pana" is not correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

It's fine, added.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Iva52893

Why is "My chodzimy do tego mężczyzny" not accepted?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

It should be, it's an accepted answer.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JonGornick

The answer I got used "jezdzimy". That's ridiculouse, since this section has been using isc and chodzic.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

It is also a correct answer, but it's surprising that you received it. It may be a bug (this is old behaviour that was changed months ago - nowadays you should only get corrected to the best answer). Can you tell us what platform you are using (Web, Android, iOS) and what type of exercise was that?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Will127979

Why can this not be iść I'm apparently still missing what makes it chodzić instead of iść


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Josephus_

I put "do tego mężczyzny chodzimy" and got marked wrong. What's the problem? Can the sentence not begin with "do" or something?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

It's basically the same as "To this man we go". It's not wrong but it's hard to find a reason to say it this way...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Josephus_

This is the same kind of situation you helped me with in the other thread, but I'm confused again. Look at this sentence: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/13024545 The verb is at the end, the object is not. What's different about that sentence? Is it different emphasis?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

We could say that it puts an additional emphasis on 'listening', but mostly it's because it has a pronoun as its object, and we avoid putting pronouns at the end if only we can avoid it (even if some examples in the course did not care about it).

The most natural option in my opinion would be "Nie słuchamy ich" (no subject pronoun, no other place to put 'ich'), but when we put the subject explicitly, it turns into "My ich nie słuchamy".

If it was "We do not listen to this man", again the most natural would be "Nie słuchamy tego mężczyzny", but even with the subject I'd stay with "My nie słuchamy tego mężczyzny".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Josephus_

Ok. This is hard. Thanks again for your help.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TAJPRU

'Idziemy'is....we go. 'chodzimy' is....we attend


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

"idziemy" is definitely not "we go" but "we are going" or "we are walking".

"chodzimy" could potentially be "we attend" in some contexts, but generally it's "we go" or "we walk".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Surora5

Why doesn't "chodzimy tego mężczyzny" work?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

For the same reason as "We go this man" doesn't, you didn't put any preposition.

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