https://www.duolingo.com/AzureJames

Old-fashioned speech

I read a little about how asking for a cup of tea is one of the old-fashioned phrases still in use, and I am wondering which other ones people use, and which things used to be popularly said that changed a lot in the twentieth century. Has У меня есть changed? has the pronunciation of 'е' changed? Большое спасибо дорогое товарищи!

December 14, 2015

15 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Norrius

For example, calling people товарищи is old-fashioned (or rather Soviet-fashioned) and you might end up getting odd looks for that.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/grey236

There is a little section about things that have changed. It's not a lot but it's something. http://www.omniglot.com/writing/russian.htm

December 14, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/lavendeltee

Большое спасибо дорогое товарищи! (c)
for example this one is totally obsolete ;)

It comes to a time period which you are considering. We've had a writing reform for about 100 years and since that the whole alphabet and some spelling rules have changed. And concerning the lexic... well, since the Soviet time is over, there are also words which existed then and hardly exist now, like some nomenclature posts or plenty of abbreviations. But the language is still the language and all the basic structures are still there, and we are still able to read Pushkin only with a rare glance to the dictionary ;)

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/kosmozhuk

The whole alphabet? Has changed? You may want to choose your words more carefully.

And, certainly, the word товарищ isn't obsolete per se.

Plenty of abbreviations hardly exist just because objects they refer to hardly exist now. Not because the language has changed. If one would want to speak about ГОЭЛРО or Торгсин he would still have to fall back to those words.

On the other hand, certain speech templates (for lack of a better word) has changed. We don't say "милостивый государь, не соблаговолите ли вы", we say something completely else instead, for the same meaning, same notion, same concept. I didn't quite understand what the OP meant in his post, but somehow I believe he meant exactly that.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/lavendeltee

Yes, I consider it as the whole alphabet as the letters have received other names (аз, буки, веди and so on have given place to the common а, б, в...) and lost the numerical connotation (in the old Cyrillic alphabet the letters had this meaning as well) :)

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/kosmozhuk

Oh, I see. You're confusing the alphabet used now for церковно-славянский and normal Russian alphabet.

"В Письмовнике Курганова (СПб., 1793 год) говорится, что: по повелению императрицы Екатерины II при учреждении народных училищ в изданном «Российском букваре» 1788 года для «легчайшего изречения» показаны следующие названия букв: а, бе, ве, ге, де, е, же, зе, и, и, ка, эль, эм, эн, о, пе, ер, эс, те, у, эф, ха, це, че, ша, ща, эр, ы, ерь, е, ю, я, фе (буквы ер и эр так названы в тексте (перепутаны в источнике). Из текста Письмовника видно, что названия букв, оканчивающихся на е, произносились мягко, поскольку о знаке, поставленном вместо избегаемой э, особо говорится, что он произносится, как немецкое или латинское e, — значит, русское е (де, зе, те…) произносится как русское е, то есть мягко."

1788 is hardly a "hundred years ago".

"В 1880-х в своем словаре Даль приводит названия а, бе, ве…; об аз, буки, веди… он рассказывает уже как о старинных буквах."

It was way earlier than the writing reform you talk about.

The writing reform had nothing to do with the names of the letters: http://stcreserv.narod.ru/Tutorial/decret18.html

Three letter were thrown out. But that's about all that happened to the alphabet.

And yes, Church Slavonic still utilizes the numerical meaning of Cyrillic letters.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/lavendeltee

Ah now I see the mistake, thanks for the hint!

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/AzureJames

I like Church Slavonic but it does have some identical-sounding letters. I particularly like their "H" and "И" and consider them superior to the modern Russian ones. Probably because English is my native language.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/2E3S

Russian alphabet is mostly a reduced version of Church Slavonic alphabet.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/AzureJames

Thanks everyone!

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/mosfet07

дорогие товарищи :)

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/PolvandenBleek

I would also consider the entire alphabet to have changed, because initially slavic languages used to be written in the glagolitic alphabet, which looks nothing like cyrillic.

January 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/Shady_arc

Initially , languages were spoken.^_^

Some Slavic languages used Glagolitic alphabet. Others had no writing at that point. For example, by the time literacy spread into the territory of modern Ukraine and central Russia, Cyrillic was an established scipt (it had been created shortly after the Glagolitic one). It is safe to say that for languages spoken in these territories there was no period when glagolitsa was the only or even the primary script.

January 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/NFlynt

My university library happened to have some old Russian-for-English-speakers teaching books, which can maybe give a small idea. One is "Brush up your Russian" from the 30s, and the Berlitz Self-Teacher for Russian was written in the early 50s. Lots of standard phrases seem to have not changed much, although some examples I noticed (native speakers can correct me, of course):

"Барышня" was once more popular for usage than "девушка", now, it seems.

The borrowed words are slightly different in some cases (aerodrome seems to have been used all the time rather than aeroport.).

Terms like "нежели" are sometimes used instead of "чем" (коли instead of если is another example).

But these are just examples I noticed from multiple uses in those old books for learners that differ from books from the 70s up until now. If wiktionary is to be believed, this can give you a list of now-dated terms, and you can explore further from there. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Category:Russian_dated_terms

December 17, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/AzureJames

спасибо

December 18, 2015
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