"Мы съели только макароны."

Translation:We only ate pasta.

2 years ago

37 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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With the perfective form съели the Russian sentence answers the question "Which of the food available have you eaten/did you eat (on the particular ocasion discussed earlier)?". So the answer should be translated as "We only ate /We have only eaten the pasta". The definite article is necessary here because the perfective form always refer to a particular ocasion and we are talking about the pasta served on that ocasion, trying to emphasize that the pasta was the only food all of which was/has been eaten. The perfective also emphasizes that the pasta was finished and none of were left. If the imperfective form "ели" were used, the sentence would mean "Pasta was all we ate during the period of time in question (which is all in the past)" or "Pasta was all we were eating during that meal". The sentence would not make it clear (and it wouldn't be important) whether the pasta was finished or not. I hope I've explained clearly the difference between the Russian perfective and imperfective verbs here. It should not be confused with the difference betwen English Present Perfect Tense and Past Simple Tense. Either of these tenses can translate into both perfective and imperfective, depending on the context. Past continuous always translate into imperfective.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Afus
Afus
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Most of the valuable content of Duolingo is right here, in the comments section. Thanks a lot for such well detailed information!

8 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Oinophilos
Oinophilos
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Not to muddy the waters, but we could also say, "We just ate the pasta" or "We ate just the pasta." Not accepted, though. I recognize that out of context "just" is ambiguous; still, it's a softer way of excluding what was not eaten and probably more common.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dinnernugget
dinnernugget
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Хочешь макарон? Я готовлю макароны.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Reena_March

"We ate pasta only" Is it incorrect or unnatural?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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We ate only pasta. Or, we ate only the pasta.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PolyJack
PolyJack
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It's correct, but not entirely natural. People would only really say that if they wanted to stress "only".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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I see nothing unnatural in the sentence. How esle would you say, "(Of all the food on the plate) we olny ate the pasta (and didn't even touch the salad)"?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PolyJack
PolyJack
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Hmm, I'm not sure what you mean. "We only ate the pasta" is probably the most common way of saying it. "We ate pasta only" does make sense, but it's less common and natural than the former.

Granted, this is just from my experience.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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It is the Russian sentence Мы съели только макароны that I was talking about.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PolyJack
PolyJack
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Ah! No issue with that. I think RogueOh3 was talking about the English translation, rather than the Russian sentence. :)

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/airelibre
airelibre
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Why the ъ after the с? Does it make it [sjelʲi] instead of [sʲelʲi] ("sat" plural)? That is, [s] followed by [j] rather than simply a palatalised [s]?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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Yes, that's exactly the point. The С is not palatalized. So the "s" is not followed by "j" but rather followed by "jɛ" without palatalization. Otherwise the word for "they sat," сели has a palatalized Сь ("Sʲ") inside the "sʲɛ" sound.

It's less about palatalization per sé and more about separation between the prefix and the root word. The root word is ели, which is the imperfective verb meaning "they were eating," and the prefix с converts it to the perfective verb "they ate [and finished {макароны}]," but the е would palatalize the с without adding a ъ to separate the с and e

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/airelibre
airelibre
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Thanks for confirming, I guessed it was related to the prefix :-)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/patfinegan
patfinegan
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Hooray! There is a second word in this course with the letter ъ! Until now, the only word was объяснить. I was beginning to wonder if there were any.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dmitry.tsarev
dmitry.tsarev
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Если я правильно понимаю, то "we only ate" (как в "основном" правильном ответе) переводится как "мы ели"? А "мы съели" - "we have eaten"?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Есть is imperfective, съесть perfective, so "мы ели" is "we were eating", " мы съели" - "we ate". "Мы съели только макароны" - "we ate only pasta", but the word order above is more common in English.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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Мы ели would be "we ate." Что вы там делали? -Мы ели. Мы съели [что-то] would be "we ate it." Как вам еда понравилось? -Мы её съели!, meaning we finished it.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dmitry.tsarev
dmitry.tsarev
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Как тогда будет "мы ели", когда имеется в виду не процесс, а констатация события, например "мы ели суп, макароны, салат и бутерброды"? Тут же "we were eating ..." не подойдёт?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Я не носитель русского языка, может быть, я не понимаю... Если я правильно понимаю, "мы съели" - мы ели а потом закончили? По-английски, "We ate (we were eating and we finished)". "Мы ели" - мы тогда ещё не закончили, да? "We were eating (but we hadn't finished yet)".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dmitry.tsarev
dmitry.tsarev
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"мы съели макароны" - да, это просто констатация факта, что когда-то (время не указано) мы съели макароны (упор на свершившемся факте, что макароны были съедены). Время не упоминается. В моём понимании тут правильнее использовать Present Perfect - "we have eaten pasta", а не Past Simple - "we ate pasta". Нет?

С "мы ели" существуют, как минимум, 2 варианта, в зависимости от контекста: 1) "мы ели макароны" (подразумевается точка времени в процессе поедания). "Что вы делали вчера в 6 часов вечера? Мы ели макароны". Тут я согласен с "we were eating", всё понятно. 2) "мы ели макароны" (просто информирование о том, какой именно продукт ели). Например, "мы ели макароны" (а не рис или картошку). Вот тут, как я понимаю, нужно использовать Past Simple - "we ate pasta".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/alex_tv80
alex_tv80
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"Что вы съели сегодня на завтрак" - не могу сказать, что это неправильно, но для меня это звучит немного странно. Примерно, так: Я знаю, что вчера у нас были макароны, картошка и борщ. На завтрак вы что-то из этого съели - что именно? )))

"Что вы ели сегодня на завтрак" - звучит более обычно ))

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Спасибо за объяснение. Мы когда-то съели макароны, время не упоминается, да, "we have eaten pasta". Но в других случае, может быть "we ate pasta" тоже правильно. "Что вы съели сегодня на завтрак" - съели, не ели, да? Или я неправильно научилься.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dmitry.tsarev
dmitry.tsarev
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Да, Вам тоже спасибо за объяснение.

Объясню, откуда изначально взялся мой вопрос. По-русски "съели" однозначно гарантирует, что макароны съедены, поэтому я в первом вопросе и написал про "we have eaten", т.к. в английском, как я понимаю, Present Perfect тоже гарантирует, что действие завершилось. Что касается Past simple ("we ate pasta")... Если я не ошибаюсь, то такая форма не гарантирует, что макароны съели? Их могли есть, но не доесть?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Спасибо. Может быть, в этом случае (мы съели только макароны) ваш пример не неточный (звучит странно?). Если "мы съели" здесь значит, что мы когда-то съели, время не упоминается, "мы только съели" - мы никогда ничего не съели, кроме макарон?

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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Съели может соответствовать как форме Present Perfect "have eaten", так и форме Past Simple "ate". Выбор зависит от того, указано ли время действия и закончился ли описываемый период. Так, при наличии слов yesterday, last night, last week, last year etc. слову "съели" будет соответствовать "ate". При этом "съели" означает однократное действие, после которого макарон не осталось. Многократное действие передаётся глаголом неслвершенного вида "ели". Если же мы просто констатируем полное уничтожение макарон без указания времени, то "съели" по-английски будет "have eaten". "Ели" также используется и для перевода форм "were eating", "had been eating", "would eat" (обычно ели) и "used to eat" ("раньше ели", "когда-то ели").

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Может быть я понимаю вас. Если мы ели макароны, не только один раз, но завтра, послезавтра, и так далее, "мы ели" правильно, хотя мы закончили? Но по-англииски, "we ate", не "we were eating".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dmitry.tsarev
dmitry.tsarev
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Имелось в виду "....не только один раз, но и вчера, позавчера и так далее"? Да, тут тоже вопросов нет, всё понятно - "we ate".

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Да, вчера, позавчера... я думал задом наперёд.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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I see this is a very common discussion in the Russian course on Duolingo, the proper translation of Russian perfective/imperfective verb aspect and English past tense/present perfect/past perfect. The confusion seems to be with the words "perfect" and "perfective." They are entirely different concepts. There are no perfective/imperfective verbs in English, and there is no present perfect or past perfect tense in Russian.

Therefore, as a result, there is no direct translation "formula." English verb aspect is determined by context, so in many cases both perfective and imperfective Russian verbs can translate into the same past tense, present perfect, or past perfect, conjugation, for example.

Мы ели and мы съели can both translate as "we ate," based on what additional context is contained in the sentence. Conversely, "we ate," "we have eaten," and "we had eaten," can all translate as мы ели, again based on what additional context is contained in the complete sentence.

Both Russian speakers and English speakers make the mistake of trying to create a direct a=a and b=b translation when it can only be determined by context.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/R_Andersson

Despite my native language being Swedish and pasta being called ‘makaroner’ in Swedish, this gets me thinking of macaroons...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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Macaroons or macarons are cookies. The latter are merengue-based cookies similar to what we call безе ( a "kiss" in old French, by not in modern French where the word refers to making love).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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but безе and macarons are totally different, from my experience. Macarons are soft and creamy, but безе has the texture of wall plaster. LOL

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/dusics95
dusics95Plus
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So the translation macaroni is incorrect? :D incredible. So how do you say macaroni in Russian?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Dmitry_Arch
Dmitry_Arch
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Macaroni is correct. Just like the Russian макароны, the word refers to rather thick (unlike spaghetti) tubular-shaped pieces of pasta. Вермишель (originally derived from the Italian vermicelli - "little worms") is a different kind of pasta; it's roughly what you get if you cut spaghetti into short pieces. Вемишель used to be very popular in Soviet Russia before spaghetti became known and gained popularity. These days the word макароны is sometimes used by the older generation to refer to any pasta. The younger generation of Russians say "паста", but for most Russians the word "паста" is mostly associated with tooth paste or tomato paste, rather than "pasta".

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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It makes me laugh if I hear the word паста in Russian referring to Italian "pasta." It's instantly "toothpaste" hahahaha

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/va-diim
va-diim
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макароны! Growing up in my household, my parents called pasta "вермишель," named after another type of Italian pasta, "vermicelli"! :-)

1 year ago
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