"To przez ciebie!"

Translation:It is because of you!

December 25, 2015

46 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/WilliamPil9

Przez is across, over or through in English. It is not 'because' in any Polish dictionary I have ever seen. It may, of course, have some kind of Polish idiomatic meaning in this sentence, but neither this course nor any other course I know about has ever taught this meaning.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

https://pl.pons.com/t%C5%82umaczenie/polski-angielski/przez

That's the very first dictionary I checked and, well, it's in there.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrtonPolgr

It's in there, as the sixth meaning... that doesn't really grant us a chance to get it right first, without any context. This is typically the kind of text you must get wrong once in order to move on.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

Or... you can look at the hint and get it right the first time.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrtonPolgr

Hints are never reliable and you know this as much as I do... It can only work if you really just cherrypick sentences for the sixth meaning and not for the first five, otherwise it's near useless again.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stewart288923

No? 'It is through you that I have come to appreciate this' There is no religion in that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

OK, wrong association. But your sentence is clearly positive. "To przez ciebie" is definitely negative.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anna678613

Just to illustrate the meaning and the negativity. A minute from "Harry Potter" in Polish:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2KIbN2UA58 "Straciłem przez ciebie sługę!" ("You lost me my servant!")

Pan Luciusz Malfoy is impressive enough to help to remember the word easier, I think :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Augustine2017

In english, "It is because of you" does not have to be negative. Good things can happen because of someone else. "Thanks to you" is an alternative way of expressing that idea. What makes this phrase so definitely negative in Polish?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

"przez". The positive thing will be "dzięki" (+ Dative).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Augustine2017

Ok, "przez" = negative. Tks.
We can look at "because of" both ways in English. In fact, "thanks to you" can also be used ironically as a negative.
That turned out badly, thanks to you !
We can also use "no thanks to you".
That turned out well, no thanks to you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Frecklebuster

Jellei - You state that 'To przez ciebie' is a negative expression. Can you tell me, please, how to express something like Stewart288923's thoughts, as in 'It's through you that I can buy the ticket' (because she gave me the extra money)? Dzięki!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

"To dzięki tobie", I guess. (It's thanks to you)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yola448704

Dzięki tobie zacząłem to doceniać - Thanks to you I've come to appreciate this

To przez ciebie (mam długi)! - It's because of you/It's your fault (I am in debt)!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stewart288923

I would say 'It is through you' rather than 'because ' of you and here the Polish is exactly the same word as in English. (But doubtless this is not a US expression...)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

In what context would you use it? Only religious ones come to my mind. And I really don't know if something like that would be said the same way in Polish... generally this is equivalent to "This is your fault!".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jeanette364461

You could say "it is through you that i got work", synonymous to because in this instance.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Arraknuse

I'm reminded of the old letter sent in to school by the parent of an absentee student: "Please excuse Timmy from school this week, he has been ill with diarrhoea through a hole in his wellingtons."

'Through' can definitely be used as a synonym for 'because' in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Augustine2017

Maybe not a common expression in the US but definitely is used.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tenkrissirknet

Not sure how to distinguish between this meaning 'because of' and 'for'. They are two very different things.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/schmidzy

I'm not a native Polish speaker, but I would guess that it could only mean 'for' in the sense of 'because', i.e. "Don't worry, for I shall slay this dragon!" Which is, of course, pretty old-fashioned in English. Hopefully a Polish native speaker can correct me if I am wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Latcarf

"for you" would be "dla ciebie"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JanKLinde

Would 'przez' be used to translate a sentence like "This damage has been caused by a storm"? (I don't know anything about Polish passive constructions yet.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Yes, it would work.

"Te uszkodzenia/szkody zostały spowodowane przez burzę" ('damage' is usually plural in Polish unless it's literally one damaged thing, and not very seriously).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JanKLinde

Dziękuję!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ehsan_Mehmed

accusative case?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteveLamb2

Is this sentence translated literally as "this is on you"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Djx234

'It's through you that I can buy a ticket' suggests rather that 'you' is the agent who can facilitate the buying of a ticket.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NieNieNieNie

What case does it take?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leodarelli

Jellei! Gdzie jesteś? Potrzebuję cię!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rylix

I'm happy i understood this exchange (i think) Jellei, where are you, i need you! Yes, I'm listening? Haha


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Exactly :) "Słucham?" or "Tak, słucham?" are also common thing to say right after you answer the phone. Especially when you don't know who's calling ;)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGz8dJ

why can't we say "to przez cię"? I thought cię and ciebie are basically the same thing....


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

Cię is a so-called unaccented and ciebie an accented form. After prepositions (e.g.: przez) the longer accented form is mandatory. There is only one exception I'm aware of, but this is basically just a fixed expression:

To rozumie się samo przez się. - This goes without saying. (where się is the unaccented form of the reflexive pronoun siebie)

Here I've listed the most important rules regarding the usage of accented pronouns:

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/43327702?comment_id=43362115


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGz8dJ

Gee, thanks!

So, cię is like "you" and ciebie is like "YOU"? As in the difference between "you did it" and "YOU did it"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

Exactly. However, in a sentence like this (where we have a preposition), only ciebie is an option, so this YOU/you analogy might not always apply.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGz8dJ

Right, right, I see. Wow, thanks for all your help! Polish is so challenging, but so rewarding!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SGz8dJ

I have one follow-up question: are there any situations where we must use cię?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

As far as the rulebook of this course is concerned, you must use cię whenever you don't have to use ciebie. There is never a situation when you can use either of them with no change in meaning.

However, as I mentioned in my linked comment, natives often don't apply this rule and sprinkle their emphatic pronouns all over the place, which is unfortunate for learners, because it makes the non-emphatic cię look redundant. Someone may then ask: Why do I need to learn these rules if I can safely use ciebie everywhere? Someone who's new to Polish would be very likely to choose the path of least resistance and use the 'safer' option (ciebie) excessively. More exessively, I predict, than any native speaker would do.

That's why we chose to make this rule stricter than it is in real life. I hope that makes sense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NelsonCanh3

Why is "thanks to you" not correct? It can also have a negative association e.g. "it's thanks to you that I lost my bus"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alik1989

That's when you use it ironically. We can't accept ironic interpretations, because otherwise we'd have translations which are exact opposites of each other, eg.: Good job! = You messed it up!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DelphineWa4

Wow, everyone losing their minds that two languages may not have exactly equivalent phrases... isn't this one of the cool aspects of learning a new language?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/monteirorogerio

Cool! “It's your fault” is accepted.

Learn Polish in just 5 minutes a day. For free.