"Aucun d'eux n'est populaire."

Translation:None of them are popular.

December 14, 2013

100 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/4sily

Another question from a non-native English speaker: would it be appropriate to say "No one of them is popular"?

January 10, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/John_Swede

Of course that is correct, but duo simply forgot to list it. I had to do a little research in this topic, since duo failed also me on this one.

"None is descended from Old English nān meaning ‘not one’ and has been used for around a thousand years with both a singular and a plural verb, depending on the context and the emphasis needed." - Oxford Dictionaries

So, it could be debated if your suggestion isn't the most adequate.

January 10, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Janus8536

Just for the record: 'none of them is popular' is now accepted. [March, 2016].

March 20, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/4sily

Merci beaucoup!

January 10, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/milesnagopaleen

"Not one of them" but NOT "No one of them"

April 23, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dave.pretty

You can say it, but not often. With this stress: No one of them is popular, but none of them is hated.

May 11, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/milesnagopaleen

If your'e Scottish maybe!

May 11, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dave.pretty

No, American English, no problem.

May 11, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/esowl
  • 1573

Or, “No one of them is popular, but their group project was well liked.”

May 21, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Madame_Moss

Duo marked "not one of them is popular" incorrect. Bah, humbug.

December 7, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/n6zs
  • 1773

You could say, "No one of them is popular" which would be more emphatic. "None of them is popular" is simpler and more common.

January 31, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Edgaratc

are*

February 19, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jmg126

Not one of them is popular is also correct, but no one of them is popular is a bit akward.

July 12, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Moggy1969

4sily, despite other answers, NO - you cannot say "No one of them is popular', it has to be none, or 'no-one is popular'.

February 15, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mphoenix12e

Or "not one of them is popular"

March 12, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chaered

How about "No particular single one of them is popular individually, but they work well together." -- same construction but expanded?

April 12, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/peridot_lion

if used as no one it is singular, if used as not any it is plural, :) je souhaite que cela t'aide

December 2, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Betsy134556

Excellent catch -- but "are" is commonly used among native English speakers, even though it's technically incorrect.

May 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

It is not incorrect in English. Duo's use is correct.

None means not one but it also means not any. As such it is grammatically correct to use the plural where it applies.

not one = is = correct

not any = are = correct

May 23, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cliv
  • 974

General usage includes it as plural, but by prescriptive grammar rules, it is strictly singular in construction in formal English--even when referring to multiples. As Betsy134556 said, it is commonly used with plural verb in everyday speech. I, personally, agree with Duo following more of a descriptive than prescriptive usage.

April 27, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/willo47

No, Vasiliy. But, specific translation aside, you could say 'NOT one of them is popular'. However, Duo are not helping by repeating a common mistake. As 'none' is a contraction, the sentence should read 'None of them IS popular'.

May 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Not correct.

None is either singular or plural depending on context.

None of the people is voting = incorrect

None of the people are voting = correct

May 16, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LarryMitz

This one is definitely wrong. None of them IS popular. None is singular

January 17, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LolPepper

As John_Swede noted above there are insufficient grounds to assert that "none" takes the singular verb form. See http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/none

January 29, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mphoenix12e

I reported it 3/12/14

March 12, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alba

I reported 3/28/14 that "None of them is popular" should be considered correct.

March 29, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/drplasma64

I liked this discussion of when none uses singular vs. plural: http://www.grammarmudge.cityslide.com/articles/article/1026513/9903.htm

February 20, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pmm123

Wow, thank you for posting this link! I am one who was taught (wrongly, as it turns out) that "none" should always take a singular verb. I love learning about my native language when I'm studying a different one.

March 5, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dave.pretty

A good one, but still, for this sentence, both should be allowed.

May 11, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CinnamonTe1

If you are using the word them, it will always will be plural except for “one of them.”

“None of them” means that multiple nouns are being referenced, therefore it is plural. You wouldn’t say “none of them” if you are talking about only one of something.

One of them is here. One of them is not here. Not one of them is here. Three of them are here. None of them are here.

January 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pmm123

Interesting analysis. You say that we should use the singular verb in the sentence "Not one of them is here", and I agree with you. I think that's what most native speakers would say.

But one of the definitions of "none" is "not one".

Since "none" can mean "not one", "None of them is here" should be just as acceptable as "Not one of them is here", which you have agreed is correct.

I think it may get down to how one interprets the word "none", regardless of the sentence in which it occurs. If you think of "none" as meaning "not one", then you are likely to prefer the singular verb. If you think of it as "not any", then you are likely to prefer the plural verb. But that's just my opinion, and as you can see from the comments on this page, there are many opinions, and even the experts do not always agree about what is correct.

January 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Actually, most experts agree that taking none to be either not one or not any is equally correct. That means the context provides for the choice of singular or plural verb.

January 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alannakdennis

Zero hearts left, not even a quarter through. Palms sweating, eyebrows furrowing. I CAN GET THROUGH THIS.

January 26, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ElianaSolange

isn't the pas always needed for negation?

March 24, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pmm123

Other words besides "pas" can be used with "ne" for negation, and "ne" does not have to come before the other element. In this case, the other word is "aucun" and it precedes "ne."

This article gives a good summary of French negation with links to detailed explanations for each type listed, and I'm sure there are others that are even more complete:

http://french.about.com/od/grammar/a/negation.htm

March 24, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/damipage

thanks the site is really helpful

December 18, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nicholas_ashley

when aucun(e) acts on the subject of a sentence the structure is

aucun(e) + subject + ne + rest of sentence

examples

aucun argent n'a été retrouvé. - No money was found.

Aucune d'entre elles n'est vivante. - None of them are alive.

December 15, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nicola526448

Aucune d'entre elles n'est vivante. - None of them are alive.

What use is the 'entre' in this phrase? Can you explain? Is it actually literally something like 'not one amongst them are alive'? And could the 'entre' then actually be omitted entirely.

October 21, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nicholas_ashley

entre in this context means among and it is optional.

February 20, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mr_Philip

Again with the double negatives. I thought it was "none of them are not popular". Why is this false? Also, how can I tell the double negatives from the single negatives? I get a lot of sentences like this wrong.

October 23, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

From nicholas_ashley's comment above.

when aucun(e) acts on the subject of a sentence the structure is

aucun(e) + subject + ne + rest of sentence

So in this sentence n'est isn't another negative thrown into the sentence. The n in n'est is the trailing part of the Aucun acting on the subject.

Just one negative not two. Just one negative split into two parts just to mess with your head. I put the same answer as you for the same reason. However, I did wonder why there was no pas present to complete the apparent second negative. Seeing the correct answer, I now see that is because there is no second negative flowing from the ne that requires a pas to complete it. The ne completes the first negative.

Hope this helps.

January 9, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eser

Should this not be "Aucun d'eux ne sont populaires" since eux is plural?

December 20, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alexbertsch

Eux is plural, but aucun is singular and also the subject.

March 11, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anneguus

Neither ?

November 29, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/neringarek

what's the difference between "Aucun d'entre eux " and "Aucun d'eux"?

July 23, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

The difference is none between them or none of them.

January 9, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tia189832

why is it "est" if the sentence is talking about a plural noun

October 6, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pmm123

"Aucun" is singular and it's the subject of the sentence, so the verb is singular. "Eux" is a plural pronoun but it's not the subject of the sentence.

October 6, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jonesd1959

Could not you also say "Each of them is not popular"?

December 14, 2013

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/n6zs
  • 1773

"aucun" is "none". "aucun d'eux" = "none of them".

March 18, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnnVidetich

larry and jazzy are right! "None" is singular. How could "not one" be plural?

March 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/John_Swede

Singular or plural, maybe neither and that is what makes this fun to debate. For a swede there is absolutely no problem with seeing "none" as plural. Let me write a silly example:

"In the room there are seven tall men".

None is short: 0 of them is short, when 0 is singular, is it? None are short: 7 of them are not short.

I guess we can debate this for another thousand years. Meanwhile the language evolves and the word "none" may very well have disappeared :)

/John

March 8, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JagMicker1

"deux"? - "d'eux"? HOW THE FU&#@$/+#* ARE WE SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND THE DIFFERENCE? NOT from this "translator"! Is this normal? Are they supposed to sound exactly the same? :-( :'(

August 22, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alannakdennis

From sound? You can't hear the difference. But from context you should be able to figure out that deux wouldn't make sense while d'eux would. But yeah I've got a comment above that I think more accurately explains the situation here.

August 28, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jean205378

I read the above as "None of them is NOT popular." Why do you need the n' ?

May 12, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BackgroundNoize

yikes

November 26, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TarikCaleb

Hi! I´ve put a negative word, in the sentense, but the Duolingo, did not acept it. N´est', I´ve saw it, so, I put not.

February 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sumemon

Why is 'est' translated as 'are' surely 'est ' means 'is'.

February 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rjones1765

None of them IS popular. subject "None" is singular.

April 28, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Popular myth....none is singular.

None is either singular or plural depending on use.

When none is used as not one it is singular

When none is used as not any it is plural.

April 28, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CinnamonTe1

“Not one / No one” and “None of them” are two entirely different constructs. People are debating whether none on its own is singular or plural and totally missing that “none of them“ as a whole is the noun in this sentence. If you are using the word “them” then it is always plural except in the case of “one of them.”

Not one guitar is cheap. One of them is cheap. Three of them are cheap. None of the guitars are cheap. None of them are cheap.

January 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nozz44

"One hell of a discussion....thoughtful and interesting".

November 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelLe3139

Why Duo keeps using plural for None?

July 3, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NezihD
  • 1320

Why not " Aucun d'eux n'est PAS populaire" ?

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nicholas_ashley

Your question has already been answered

March 14, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/glihua

what's the difference between aucun d'eux and aucun d'entre eux?

June 20, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesPyrah

why is n' needed? doesn't this make it none of them is not popular ie double negative making them all popular??

July 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/pmm123

No, it's not a double negative, any more than "ne....pas", "ne....rien", "ne....jamais" etc. are double negatives. You need both parts, including "ne", to make a negative ("ne" is sometimes omitted in casual speech, but that's a different situation).

So for example, "I never drive his car" is "Je ne conduis jamais sa voiture".

July 22, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JamesPyrah

Thanks- very helpful.

July 23, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/movingsouth

'None of them' in English can mean EITHER 'Not one of them' (in which case it is singular) OR 'Not any of them' (in which case it is plural.). If you mean the first then you say 'None of them is ...' and if you mean the second you say 'None of them are ...' So 'None of them is popular' should be accepted.

May 17, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Good reasoning except none is followed by a phrase (of them) that tells you that in this sentence, none is plural.

May 5, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

For the benefit of the down voter:

Stunk & White, The Elements of Style, says: "Use the singular verb when the word means 'no one' or 'not one.'" "A plural verb is commonly used when 'none' suggests more than one thing or person"

You may disagree and may even find some authority to say it is optional. But Duo is taking (at last reading) the same position as many authorities. If none is used to mean singular then use singular verb, if it is used to mean plural (as in this Duo example) then use plural verb. Assuming Duo is consistent throughout its examples, this is a perfectly good practice to maintain.

Since it is largely a matter of style intended to make for a nice flow of words that don't interrupt the listener/reader's attention, it is good practice for students to follow. No one will object to matching plural with plural and singular with singular. However mixing them could easily provide a small distraction. If you are unconcerned about causing small distractions then you don't need to worry about it and can mix to your heart's content.

November 26, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DaleLewis

Subject is "none"- verb is "is" - none is singular so verb is also singular

September 1, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CinnamonTe1

The subject is “none of them” not “none.” Nouns can be compound and consist of two or more words.

In the senctence, “red hats are pretty”, the word “red” is not the subject. The subject is “red hats.”

January 6, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/andhaz

not one is the same as none

August 29, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ryan-31

This sentence is really confusing. :(

February 13, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JojoFromDenver

May 5, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lucybarrer5

I do agree that in this case a singular "is" should prevail. Is there a way to confirm it?

October 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sandib67

"None" takes a singular verb in English

July 11, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

Please read the comments on the comments page before posting an identical comment that has already been shown to be incorrect.

July 11, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/babalenja

I would say it should be N "None of them is popular." None meaning 'Not one".

July 26, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/midgelet

Correct English for this is: None of them IS popular. (None means 'NOT ONE').

September 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/northernguy

midgelet

If you are going to make a flat out generalization about the English language without doing any research, you could at least read the other comments on this page.

September 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wanderina

Agree! None means Not one, and it should therefore not be wrong to say Not one of them IS (not are!!!) this is basic English/grammar. None/not one of them is popular!!

April 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chaered

It is a quantifier, not inherently singular. Compare the sentence "None of the supermarkets were open". Source: the British Council, Learn English.

April 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wanderina

None is not one, and hence singular so it should be 'None of them IS popular '. Likewise there is nothing wrong with writing 'Not one of them is popular'. This is such Basic English grammar but so basic that most UK graduates still get it wrong.

April 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chaered

From grammar mudge:
A common misconception is that none must always be treated as singular. The customary support for this view is that none necessarily means "not one" (implying singularity); in fact, "none" is just as likely to imply "not any" (implying plurality). As noted in The American Heritage Dictionary: "the word has been used as both a singular and a plural noun from Old English onward. The plural usage appears in the King James Bible as well as the works of John Dryden and Edmund Burke and is widespread in the works of respectable writers today."

From writer's digest:
This is a major misconception. “None” can be a singular pronoun if it’s referring to “not one” or “no part,” but it also can be plural when referring to “not any.” None of the apple was eaten. Apple is a singular item, so you’d use the singular verb “was.” None of the ballplayers were on the team bus after the game. Here, “none” refers to “not any of the ballplayers” just as much as it refers to “not one of the ballplayers,” so it can be plural. Pluralizing it not only makes it a clearer sentence, but also makes it less awkward to read.

From dictionary reference:
None means 'not one' or 'not any' and it may take either a singular or plural verb. Writers are more or less free to decide which meaning is appropriate in their context. This grammatical construction, which is based on sense rather than form, is called notional agreement or notional concord, and is very common. So, consider none as singular when you want to emphasize a single entity in a group, but consider none to be plural when you want to emphasize more than one. Examples are: None of the books is/are worth reading. / None of us is/are going to the banquet. However, when none means 'no amount' or 'no part', it must be singular: None of the debris has been cleared away. / None of the forest is deciduous. So, if your meaning is 'none of them', treat the word as plural; if it is 'none of it', treat it as singular.

From grammar girl:
You may be chided by the uninformed when you follow "none" with a plural verb, but don’t be afraid to do so if your sentence calls for it.

From online grammar, quoting the Oxford Dictionary:
It is sometimes held that none can only take a singular verb, never a plural verb: none of them is coming tonight rather than none of them are coming tonight. There is little justification, historical or grammatical, for this view. None is descended from Old English nān meaning ‘not one’ and has been used for around a thousand years with both a singular and a plural verb, depending on the context and the emphasis needed.

From grammar book:
Rule: The word none is versatile. It has a plural sense (“not any”) as well as a singular sense (“not a single one”). When none is followed by of, look at the noun in your of phrase (object of the preposition). If the object of the preposition is singular, use a singular verb. If the object of the preposition is plural, there is more leeway. Most of the time, but not always, you will want to use a plural verb.

April 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wanderina

Wow, I stand corrected and now better educated!

April 24, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LarryMitz

Chaered, you are erudite and certainly illustrate one of the reasons that English is such a powerful language; it is continually evolving. I have no doubt that eventually "None of the ballplayers were on the bus" will be accepted as correct English but right now it grates on my ears and I consider it to be definitely wrong. Many changes have occurred in English over the years. The meaning of "presently" and "gay" come to mind; I abhor the first and applaud the latter. This forum is often more interesting than the lesson portion of Duolingo, isn't it?

April 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chaered

It is indeed one of the biggest draws for me too about duo: the pleasure of debating language in the company of others who are interested in language for its own sake! Thanks for participating in this enjoyable pastime.

One of the recurring points of discussions here on English is the absence of an ultimate authority to appeal to for rulings of "correctness" in the language; there is no "English Academy". So the discussions start out without an agreed-upon definition of "correct" (at the risk of invoking Laynes Law ). There is a nebulous consensus that some linguistic authority figures carry weight: I see your Shakespeare, I raise you one Webster and a Tolkien! You quote me a poet laureate, I counter you a Pulitzer winner. It descends to Google stats and rap lyrics. Given the long and widespread use of English, you can find some support for almost any preference in diction.

My stance: There is a wide spectrum of positions one can take in stating an objection to some usage, ranging from "I personally do not really like that" to "anyone who uses that is complete moron who should never have graduated from the womb". The further to the latter end of that spectrum somebody starts out, the more I would expect him/her to bolster that position with supporting statements from the aforementioned pantheon of language grandmasters, because in not doing so the writer implicitly dons that mantle of language authority him/herself. In other words: the bolder the assumption, the more I'd want to see your credentials or the supporting cast. I will not challenge the sovereignty of your idiolect, but beyond that lies fair game.

May the owl be with you!

April 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wanderina

Fun is indeed to be had, dans plusieurs langues, mais surtout en anglais. Usage is king, and only ambiguity trumps that. Having met various experts; Oxford dons as well as US literary scholars & there is no 'correct' and no authority. things & rules change with time (as they become 'common parlance' and we pedants debate or discuss what we think, know or have been taught, but ultimately what matters is what is understood. Like implication and inference - in legal terms you can argue each side, but who is right and who wrong? All such discussion is academic & of course a game. Ultimately we all seek the truth, whatever that might be and as you say,'qui sait'. Amusant, n'est ce pas?

April 26, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wanderina

Nevertheless, I shall continue whilst reviewing/editing scientific papers/chapters to insist on 'none' being singular just as 'data' is plural, our discussions re linguistic grammar are fascinating & more esoteric than the simple scientific clarity required from most medical graduate/PhD students. It is wonderful to discourse with polyglots however, I'd say Gay is sadly & inappropriately used nowadays and can never again be used to describe a happy, merry individual without defining their sexuality!

April 25, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TheWiseTurtle

Maybe it's British English, but I never heard anyone say "None of them is popular." I think "None of them are popular" makes more sense.

May 29, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pigslew

No more British than American. Chaered sums it up well.

July 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TheWiseTurtle

Or Australian, or Scottish, or Irish, or Canadian, or New Zealand-an. No wonder English has so many varieties.

July 22, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Moggy1969

And while I'm here, NONE is singular!!!!!!! This was reported a month ago by my friend, and it is STILL wrong. Sort it out DUOLINGO and employ some moderators that are native English speakers that actually know how to speak English correctly.

February 15, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nikitakimba

You know what would be really awesome?

If people like yourself, instead of shouting and stamping your feet and insisting that you're absolutely correct (because you happen to speak on behalf of ALL native English speakers in the world, that is), could actually reference your assertion with some kind of link proving your point.

You know, like some of the people who believe "none" can be plural have done.

October 20, 2014

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mr_Philip

yes, just google it! I am shocked how many people, having the full internet at there disposal, just post what they believe, without checking it first.

October 23, 2015

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cjr37

Should be 'is'. 'are' is heard and could be considered correct as a common usage, but few English teachers like it.

July 5, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/drplasma64

see my link above for an interesting discussion of none using singular vs. plural.

February 20, 2014
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