"This cat does not like her."

Translation:Ten kot jej nie lubi.

January 10, 2016

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Okay this is where word position gets a bit freaky... I thought German was dodgy!


Pronouns are usually not used at the very end of a sentence except two-word sentences and their negations.

For example:

You would say: "Ten kot ją lubi/Ten kot jej nie lubi" (This cat likes her/This cat doesn't like her) but when the subject is obvious you can omit it: "Lubi ją/Nie lubi jej" (It likes her/It doesn't like her)


Ah so really I haven't been on the course long enough :P I'm guessing that further in I will discover the verb position goes to the end with more complicated sentences?


The most important rules are to never seperate "nie" with verb , never seperate preposition with object (noun or adjective +noun), then are strong guides: not let pronouns at the end, try not to start with verb, try not to end with verb,


Sorry I am struggling to understand what you mean :( But I guess that the verb doesn't come at the end unless in a certain sentence? :P


I exaggerate. There are "normal" sentences in Polish and when you change the order the sentence usually still makes sense but "looks" different - that difference makes certain parts stand out, so either a certain word is accented or whole sentence feels poetic.

The unbreakable rules are
- "nie" + verb and in my Polish mind that functions almost like one word
- preposition+noun (or adverb) - on table , on black table on black.....table (poetic)

But there are rules for those common sentences- avoid pronouns at the end, put something before verb, put something after verb. use SVO order

We rarely put verb at the end, it just sometimes happens to be there.


But this sentence has a verb at the very end.


I guess that's why he said "try not"... ie. not a hard and fast rule, more a guideline?


Not necessarily, it is a common word order when you use pronouns as objects of sentences but besides such situations SVO is rather default word order. Of course, there are also situations when you use pronouns at the end of a sentence.


Ten kot nie lubi jej. would be a correct sentence as well, it just gives us a different emphasis and it sounds different to us, but it's fully correct. It's a good side of Polish, the word order is quite loose. Nie lubi jej ten kot and Jej nie lubi ten kot would are correct as well.


Are you sure you would actually use this sentence? "Ten kot nie lubi jej"? How often? in which circumstances? We try to teach most "natural" word order.


Why would you use jej instead of ja (accented a) here? Isn't "her" accusative in this sentence?


It is not accusative it's genitive. If a verb normally requires accusative, when negated it requires genitive.


btw do you know why the case changes in negative sentences? because it makes absolutely no sense to me...


Russian clearly makes many aspects of Polish easier, but not word order.


Here's the reason that I like Italian (and math/science/music) so much over my native English or other languages that mess around with Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, Dative, etc. that I tried to ignore in 7th grade.


English only retains a subject and object case, and that only in pronouns, since at latest the sixteenth century. Did you maybe learn Latin, Greek or another language that uses cases in the seventh grade? Of course, Italian also has subject and object pronouns. You may want to learn a language like Indonesian or Chinese that lack that distinction even in pronouns.


I always thought her was ją but in this it says jej? Does it depend whether or not it's in ownership or objective position?


There is no exact equivalent for "her", since English does not have the dative and genitive case.

  • ją - accusative (direct object)
  • jej - genitive (here it's used for a negated direct object)
  • jej - dative (indirect object, looks the same as the genitive)


what is difference between the meanings of these two: Ten kot jej nie lubi and Ten kot nie lubi jej ??? Thank you!


No difference in meaning, but one shouldn't really put a pronoun (like "jej") at the end of a sentence if it can be avoided.


Czm nie "ten kot nie lubi ją"?


Declarative sentence, "This cat likes her" takes Accusative, so indeed "Ten kot ją lubi".

When you negate a verb that took Accusative, you need Genitive instead. "ją" turns into "jej": "Ten kot jej nie lubi".

Other cases stay unchanged when negated.


In English, there's he, his, and him for the males and she, her, and.. her. So is jej the objective form and ją the possessive form? Or vise-versa?


Jej is possessive, and both and jej can be objective. Direct objects in negative sentences take the genitive case, which is jej. Direct objects in positive sentences take the accusative case, which is .

  • Ten kot lubi.
  • Ten kot jej nie lubi.


So the negative of an accusative is declined as a genitive? Does this extend to locative as well?


No, only negated Accusative changes the case. Other cases stay unchanged when negated.

Also, if it's not the verb but the preposition that governs the case (e.g. "Idę przez dom" = "I am going through the house" -> Accusative is used because of the preposition "przez", not because of the verb), then the case also remains unchanged.


Why ten and not to or tego? Nie ma sensu

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