"No, not until you open it."
Translation:No, non finché non lo apri.
Aprire is a regular verb meaning to open or to open up. Apri is the second person singular meaning 'you open'. Finché by itself means 'as long as' or 'while'. 'Finche non' means 'until' It is a false negative! The true negative is 'Non finché non' meaning 'not until' Lo is a direct object pronoun meaning either 'it' or 'him'
In general, "finché non = until", and "finché = while". You can find a discussion on this topic in the WordReference forum here: http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=47122highlight=finch%E9
Thanks. It's clearer in my head, but still a bit of a brain-twister, especially the "unless not" case, which apparently forces the speaker to come up with a different wording from the translation...
And I just ran into this other Duolingo sentence "Io aspetto finché trovi il cane.", with no "non" after finché. Now I'm confused again.
(Sorry to be such a pain in the ass, and why not "l'apri", instead of "lo apri" by the way?
I am no grammar expert, but I think it is correct to say "Io aspetto finché non trovi il cane" or "Io aspetto finché cerchi (look for) il cane". However in this specific case I would still understand the meaning because "finché trovi" = "while you find" which in Italian means while you are looking for it. But again, I am no expert and this is a little complicated, so I hope I am not saying anything wrong. I have never thought about it before :) As far as "l'apri" or "lo apri".. most people from where I am originally from (Northern Italy) would say and write "lo apri", while "l'apri" is correct but somewhat old-fashioned. Perhaps in Southern Italy it is still common, unfortunately I don't know. If you check here (http://grammatica-italiana.dossier.net/grammatica-italiana-02.htm) under "elisione" they say that both work. (sorry it's in Italian, I hope it's not too hard to understand).
No, sorry, wrong. "Non lo apri" must all stay together, Elena. Or you can write "No, non finché tu lo apri"
Prucsok, I think your option should be accepted.
"Finché tu lo apri" and "finché tu non lo apri" mean the same thing in Italian. "Finché tu non lo apri" is more common BUT I think that we are slowly getting the habit of English language not to use the negation there...
Doesn't "finché lo apri" mean "While you are still opening it", whereas "finché non lo apri" is "until you open it"? I am italian too, and that's how I would interpret the two sentences. To me, they don't mean the same thing. (Tipo: "Aspetto finche' lo apri", ad esempio sto aspettando che tu abbia finito di aprire qualcosa, azione che stai compiendo ora. Invece "aspetto finche' non lo apri" vuol dire che sto aspettando che tu vada ad aprire qualcosa, azione che non hai ancora iniziato).
You should be able to have «tu» in there if you write it as such: «No, non finché (tu) non lo apri.» The subject precedes all of the other verb modifiers, such as pronouns, negatives, and objects, and even adverbs (which follow the verb). The order is as follows: (subject, i.e. io, tu, noi, etc.) (negative, i.e. «non»), (reflexive pronouns/indirect objects, i.e. si, gli, le, etc.) (direct objects, i.e. ti, lo, ne, li, etc.) and (verb, i.e. apri, mangio, dà, etc.).
Agree I tripped on this one, too. But followed your lead and googled "non finche non" and actually came up with 332,000 hits. Here's a "No, non finche non": https://twitter.com/itsKin_/status/277772039660638208
In general, I try to remember that when thinking about the connections of two words, Italians usually don't repeat vowels. For example, if you say "and I", in Italian as " e io " , the more correct written form is to put a D after the E, so it would be " ed io " . If saying " the lava of Etna " (Mount Etna is a volcano in Sicily), it is more correct to say " la lava d'Etna " or " la lava dell'Etna " than to say " la lava della Etna " , even though Etna technically ends in an A. Again with saying " the watch " or " the watches " , being " l'orologio " and " gli orologi " , respectively.
In your case, " la apri " is repeating a vowel, so I would think there is an error. It would be better to say " l'apri " or " lo apri " , since when you have a noun that starts with the letter A, the article is " l' ", but when talking about pronouns, and the noun isn't specifically mentioned, you may use " l' " or " lo " . I do believe that each is masculine or feminine, but once again, it doesn't matter when the noun is obscure.
I'm sorry if this made you more confused, but I hope this helped!
I don't think new words like the pronoun "lo" should be a problem here. It may be a pronoun we haven't been formally introduced to but you can tap the word it and get the Italian word. Even if you miss it the first time you see it the next time it pops up you will remember and learn. A word introduced out of sequence stands out better and is learned and remembered faster because it's alone.
- It would be «aprirlo», with an "i" and not an "e".
- This is acceptable only after a conjugated verb beforehand, i.e. «Voglio aprirlo,» "I want to open it." If you just use an infinitive and no conjugated verb—i.e. «No, non finché non aprirlo,»—this would be akin to saying "No, not until to open it," which has no subject and makes no sense.
I dont get why it uses 3 times no in the italian while in english only 2 no's are given. No, non finche (non) lo apri... For me it sounds more like "No, not until you (don't) open it", which gives a totally other context. As example take a box, I hold it in my hand and ask someone if I can see the ring inside and get "No, not until you open it (No, non finché tu lo apri)" as reply, this makes sense, because if I open the box I can see the ring.
Explain please why I have to add the 3rd negation?
So, I selected two choices, only one DL considers correct. The two I selected were:
- No, non finche non lo apri (which I and DL agreed was correct)
- No, non finche voi non l'aprite.
These seem to be syntactically the same, the only difference being that one uses tu and the other voi. Can someone explain why I got this wrong?
Why is it "non finchè non lo apri"? Im not questioning the correctness or sense: i want to know what we're supposed to be learning from this and how we're expected to learn it with zero feedback. How are we supposed to know how to construct this sentence or apply the rule we (supposedly) learn to other sentences?
This sentence is more reasonable when I add a verb before the first "non": "non mangia finché non lo apri":
"non mangia" - don't eat
finché = as long as
non lo apri = You don't open it
"finché non lo apri" = as long as you don't open it, has the same logic as "until you open it"
so "non mangia finché non lo apri" = Don't eat until you open it, if you omit the verb, not (some untold action) until you open it