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  5. "I am working with twelve emp…

"I am working with twelve employees."

Translation:Pracuję z dwunastoma pracownikami.

March 9, 2016

19 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Marie571456

Numbers declension makes me sad.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/babbeloergosum

Why does it have to be "dwunastoma" and not "dwanascie" here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vengir

Numbers also declinate with cases. „Dwunastoma” is the instrumental case of „dwanaście”.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/babbeloergosum

Dziękuję for the fast answer! :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jam420332

just when you start to think you're getting it...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cszerszen

The rules you provided state that 12 uses genitive. So does the "z" using instrumental supercede the need for genitive after the number? This is so confusing!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vengir

The rules you mention only apply when you would normally use nominative or accusative. You can say that all the other cases are immune to that change.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BieniekAlexander

This is a horrid rule... How can languages possibly get harder than this?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Craig842379

'Z dwunastu pracownikami' was rejected, but in the instrumental case aren't both dwunastoma and dwunastu both correct?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vengir

I don't think that „dwunastu” is a valid instrumental form, sorry.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Craig842379

Thanks for getting back to me, Vengir. My confusion arises because in the tables in the book (Polish Verbs and Essentials of Grammer / Swan) it gives both forms - -oma and -u forms as optional for instrumental for some reason, also stating "The instrumental forms in-oma are optional, alongside forms in -u" but I will make a point of not using the - u form from now on. The book wasn't written by a Polish native by the looks if things.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MartinHgho

According to wikisłownik, this is indeed the case for siedmioma/siedmiu, but seemingly not for the neighbouring numbers (https://pl.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/siedem)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Reinier260524

A Polish grammar says that also the -u ending is valid alongside with the -oma ending. Is this not correct: z dwunastu pracownikami? (Teach yourself Polish edition 1964)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vengir

I, the course creators, and some more people had a discussion about this. The conclusion we've come up to is that the -u form in instrumental is best avoided, regardless of whether grammar books allow it or not. Because even though we did find some phrases with the -u form in instrumental, it's not used commonly overall and is thus considered incorrect by some.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Reinier260524

Thank you for your clear explanation. Sometimes I ask myself why the hell am I learning this impossibly complex language? Nevertheless it's lots of fun once you have mastered another hopelessly difficult subject such as numbers in all their forms ...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AliT.Firefly

Hang on. DwUnastoma? OK, endings are going to be weird (TABLE PLEASE) but where did the 'u' come from?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jellei

Table: here (yes, Wiktionary, I know): https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dwana%C5%9Bcie#Declension

Reason: Hmmm... it seems to come from a rather outdated form of "dwa" that is still shown in this table for 2: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dwa#Declension_3

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