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"Can you help me?"

Translation:Вы можете мне помочь?

2 years ago

15 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/CMoldes
CMoldes
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Why not Вы мне можете помочь? I get that some word orders are preferred over others, but it's grammatically correct

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Michael371066

I would also like to know that

1 year ago

[deactivated user]

    Duolingo consistently rejects less common word orders, this sentence is not an exception.

    EditDelete1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/LutzvonGra
    LutzvonGraPlus
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    i doubt it is consistent. there are surely exercises who are more flexible. but i suspect that each version of a sentence needs to be stored explicitly, so i suggest to report these cases so that they can be added eventually

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/peachtree2

    We can drop вы / ты here, or this changes it?

    2 years ago

    [deactivated user]

      This is complicated. You can drop it sometimes, this depends on the context and it's not too easy to explain. It's safer not to drop it. ^^"

      EditDelete2 years ago

      https://www.duolingo.com/clio_vi
      clio_vi
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      I understand that sometimes things are hard to explain between languages, but do you possibly know of an outlet that you could refer me (us) to that would help demonstrate the rules behind this phenomenon? Thanks!

      1 year ago

      [deactivated user]

        Hello! Unfortunately, I don’t know about a good explanation for laypeople.

        All I’ve seen are academic papers that might be hard to read and don’t give you clear-cut rules, just some theories or percents. For example, Tatiana Zadoenko in her paper ‘Subject omission in Russian: a study of the Russian National Corpus’ has percentages for the number of omissions in different kinds of conversations and texts:

        Table 1. Proportions (tokens) of subject types in three subcorpora of the spoken RNC. Noun subjects accounted for 35% of subject in private speec, 59% of subjects in interviews and 58% of subject in the lectures. In the number of tokens, 28, 42 and 42. Pronoun subjects accounted for 33% of subject in private conversations, 35% of subjects in interviews and 39% of subjects in lectures. In the number of tokens, 26, 25 and 28. Null subjects (that is, omited pronouns) accounted for 32% subjects in private conversations, 6% of subjects in the interviews and 3% of subjects in lectures. In the number of tokens, 25, 4 and 2. Table 2. Proportions (tokens) of subject types in three subcorpora of the written RNC. Noun subjects accounted for 39% of subjects in blogs, 82% of subjects in newspapers and 74% of subjects in fiction. In absolute numbers, 23, 60 and 53. Pronoun subjects accounted for 59% of subects in blogs, 14% of subjects in newspapers and 26% of subjects in fiction. In absolute numbers, 35, 10 and 19. Null subjects (that is, omited pronouns) accounted for 2% of subjects in blogs, 4% of subjects in newspapers and 0% of subjects in fiction. In absolute numbers, 1, 3 and 0.

        So, basically, the pronouns are omited only in private conversations (32%), but normally not omited in oral interviews, lectures, or written texts. So, in her words:

        This leads us to the important conclusion that subject omission appears to be a feature of spoken language and, moreover, a feature of informal spoken language.

        T.Zadoenko also notes that the first-person (я, мы) and second-person (ты, Вы) subjects are more likely to be omited comparing to a third-person sibject:

        Table 4. Types of subjects used in first-, second-, and third-person contexts in the RNC. For the first-person, null subjects (that is, omited pronouns) accounted to 27% of subjects, and explicit pronouns accounted to 73% of subjects. In absolute numbers, 46 and 126. For the second-person subjects, omited pronouns (null subjects) accounted for 33% of subjects, and explicit pronouns accounted for 67% of them. In absolute numbers, 23 and 46. For the third-person subjects, null subjects accounted for 12% of subjects, pronoun subject accounted for 32% percent of subjects, and nouns accounted for 56% of subjects. In absolute numbers, 32, 82 and 147.

        Some verbs are used as ‘discourse markers’:

        Discourse markers (DMs) are independent elements that are used to structure a conversation and maintain cohesiveness. For instance, a DM can be used to initiate discourse, change the topic, hold or change turns, express the speaker’s attitude to an utterance, or indicate the relationship between an utterance and preceding discourse.

        When the verbs are used as discourse markers, they are often used without a subject. T. Zadoenko describes the statistics for two such markers, «понима́ешь» ‘you see’ and «зна́ешь» ‘you know’.

        This paper is pirateable. If you’re against piracy, it’s available for 30$, but it might not be a very good investment of 30$ because it won’t give you clear-cut rules.

        EditDelete1 year ago

        https://www.duolingo.com/taffarelbergamin

        That was a great explanation! Thanks a lot! Ill try not to drop it again in the future just in case) i dont want to have informal Russian before the formal one! I tend to do he same with english (im not native)

        9 months ago

        https://www.duolingo.com/LutzvonGra
        LutzvonGraPlus
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        Помогать instead of помочь is not accepted. What is the difference?

        1 year ago

        [deactivated user]

          Помочь is perfective, it refers to (successfully) helping one time. «Вы можете мне помочь?» is a question to be asked when you have a specific thing you need help with.

          Помогать is imperfective, it describes an action as a process that has beginning and end. It can be used when the action is repeated (i.e. you‘re asking if someone can be helping you with more than one problem during some period of time), or when the success is not important.

          Помогать doesn’t sound very natural in this sentence. I’d use «Вы можете мне помочь?» when needed help more than once. Because it makes more sense to ask a person whether they can help me each time I need help. No one will have time for me at any time of day and night, so I need to agree upon each act of ‘helping’ separately.

          EditDelete1 year ago

          https://www.duolingo.com/LutzvonGra
          LutzvonGraPlus
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          thanks a lot

          1 year ago

          https://www.duolingo.com/Vik84w
          Vik84w
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          "Можете мне помочь" was rejected for some reasons. There are a lot of contexts where this phrase without вы sounds better. if you want to address to a salesperson in a store, for example.

          1 year ago

          https://www.duolingo.com/Vivekanand643577

          Difference between мне and меня ?

          1 year ago

          https://www.duolingo.com/LutzvonGra
          LutzvonGraPlus
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          мне is dative or prepositional case, and меня is genitive or accusative case. see: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/13466871 for a more lengthy explanation, or for full declensions of the Russian pronouns: http://www.russianlessons.net/grammar/pronouns.php

          1 year ago