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Galway becomes "officially bilingual"

Lars200
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What do you guys think about this piece of news: http://www.galwayindependent.com/news/topics/articles/2016/03/09/4115825-galway-officially-becomes-bilingual/

Isn't Éire as a whole supposed to be bilingual with Irish as its first official language?

2 years ago

10 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Knocksedan

We're very good at pious aspirations, so we are. Galway is probably the most "Irish language friendly" city in Ireland, but it's still easier to be a mono-lingual English speaker than a (notional) mono-lingual Irish speaker there.

Article 4 of Bunreacht na hÉireann says: Éire is ainm don Stát nó, sa Sacs-Bhéarla, Ireland.

The sensible translation of that into English would be "Ireland is the name of the State, or, in Irish, Éire", but instead we have the literal transtalation "Éire is the name of the state, or, in English, Ireland", leading people to use Éire in English.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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It’s interesting that an article isn’t present before ainm in Irish, ainm don Stát literally meaning “a name for the State”. Perhaps if Article 4 had been a bit more verbose,

Éire is ainm don Stát sa Ghaeilge nó, sa Sacs-Bhéarla, Ireland.

then the use of Éire in English might have been minimized.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mwasson
mwasson
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I thought that though the Irish version takes precedence, the constitution was drafted first in English and then translated into Irish. Hrm, although I see that the drafting of that particular sentence was quite complex:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_the_Irish_state#.C3.89ire_.28Irish_language_name_since_1937.29

Interesting that de Valera was afraid that if they used "Éire" instead of "Ireland" too much Northern Ireland might take "Ireland" for itself, thus leading to a decline of stature internationally.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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You might find the Government of Ireland’s publication Bunreacht na hÉireann — A study of the Irish text interesting. Its introduction states that

This study seeks to establish that the Irish text is in fact no ‘mere translation’ of the English and reveals that almost every section of the Constitution contains divergences of some degree between the two texts. The following study illustrates that, were an official direct translation into Irish to be made today of the original English text of the Constitution, very few sections of such a translation would correspond to the existing Irish text of the Constitution, this by no means being due solely, nor even principally, to developments in the language which have taken place since 1937. In the commentary on the Constitution which follows, we shall see that while many of the provisions of the 1937 Constitution are identical to provisions of the 1922 Constitution, the Irish text of which is an acknowledged direct translation of the English, the corresponding Irish text in the 1937 Constitution differs greatly, and one must assume deliberately, from that of the 1922 Constitution, again this being in very few instances due to developments in the Irish language between 1922 and 1937.

The Irish text of the 1937 Constitution was prepared as the Constitution was being drafted, as against the usual translation process which commences with a definitive text. Speaking in the above-mentioned Dáil debate of 14 June 1937, the President of the Executive Council, Éamon de Valera, said that providing an Irish version was no mere afterthought on his part; neither was it a direct translation of the English. The drafting in Irish was progressing along with the English step by step, almost from the beginning when the main ideas which were accepted were being put down in draft-form:

I want to tell those who suggest that the Irish was only an afterthought, a mere translation of the English, that the Irish drafting has gone on pari passu almost from the beginning, when the fundamental ideas that were accepted for the Constitution were being put in draft form. It is true that, as far as the literal drafting of the Constitution was concerned, it has been largely left to one person. … But this does not mean that the Draft was not criticised. It does not mean that that draft was not changed from its original form to the form in which you have it now, finally. It was changed a number of times, but the principle was to get those changes always expressed and put in their final shape … as far as possible by the one hand. The Irish has gone side by side with that. We got the most competent people we could for the Irish. This Constitution has been criticised and examined closely by language experts, and … we have not had, as far as the Irish language is concerned, any criticism that was worth while.

In fact, as against Deputy Cosgrave’s assertion [that “the Irish text is a mere translation of the English”], it is claimed in the authorised Irish biography of Éamon de Valera by Pádraig Ó Fiannachta and Tomás Ó Néill that to a certain extent the final English draft derived from the Irish:

Na dréachta tosaigh den Bhunreacht a chuir Seán Ó hEathírn ar fáil ba iad ba bhonn do leagan Gaeilge a rinne Mícheál Ó Gríofa gan mhoill: bhí meas ag de Valera ar Ghaeilge shoiléir bheacht Mhíchíl. Ba é an leagan Gaeilge seo a bhí ag de Valera as sin amach mar bhonn saothair. Ba air a bunaíodh an leagan Béarla ina dhiaidh sin, i dtreo gur tiontú ón nGaeilge é an Béarla céanna. (The initial drafts of the Constitution which John Hearne provided were the basis for an Irish version which Mícheál Ó Gríobhtha made without delay: de Valera valued Mícheál’s clear precise Irish. It was this Irish version which de Valera had from then on as a basis for work. It was on this that the English version was afterwards based, with the result that the English is a translation from the Irish.)

This is in contrast to the Preamble, the Irish version of which, according to the authorised biography, is a direct translation done by T.F. O’Rahilly: […]

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Knocksedan

Mar chuid de Thogra do Chathair Dhátheangach, tá súil ag Comhairle Cathrach na Gaillimhe leibhéal an dátheangais a fhorbairt agus a fheabhsú. Is é seo an chéad chineál togra dá leithéid in Éirinn agus bheadh súil ag Comhairle Cathrach na Gaillimhe bheith ina heiseamláir í Cathair na Gaillimhe in Éirinn, san Eoraip agus go domhanda do dhea-chleachtas dátheangach.
Bheadh súil go mbeadh deiseanna ann do lucht labhartha Gaeilge Chathair na Gaillimhe an Ghaeilge a úsáid go fonnmhar ar fud na Cathrach, i mórán earnálacha; go gcuireann Cathair na Gaillimhe an Ghaeilge chun cinn agus éascaíonn sí a húsáid ar bhealach inbhuanaithe agus cuimsitheach; agus go gcuimsíonn agus spreagann Cathair na Gaillimhe an Ghaeilge ag gach leibhéal cumais.

As part of a Bilingual City Initiative, Galway City Council is looking to develop and improve the level of bilingualism in Galway City. This initiative is the first of its kind in Ireland, and Galway City Council would hope to be a model in Ireland, in Europe and globally for bilingual best practice.
We would hope Galway's Irish speaking population are afforded the opportunity to readily use Irish all over the City, in many sectors; that Galway City promotes and facilitates the use of the Irish language in a sustainable, inclusive manner and Galway City encourages and embraces the Irish language at all levels of ability.

http://www.galwaycity.ie/cso-gaeilge/

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/proinsias123

Ireland does have Irish as one of its official languages, so I'm not too sure what this means exactly. Maybe it's just more empty words that will garner few results.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/galaxyrocker

Yes, but the country is hardly bilingual, by any stretch of the definition. Galway, at least in the way I understand it, is looking to do something more than that, looking to actually make the city bilingual. I'm sure that their bid for European Capital of Culture 2020 had nothing to do with it.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/proinsias123

Well Galway's probably the best city to try something like this. Hopefully something comes of it.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/hpfan5
hpfan5
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maybe once the language revival continues it will in the future change to become an official language besides English then eventually the countries official language above English :) one would hope

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/galaxyrocker

Technically it is the country's "First Official Language", meaning that the Irish version of the Constitution takes precedence over the English one when it comes to matters of law.

2 years ago