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- Topic: Russian >
- "Мы никогда не ссоримся."
19 Comments
So in Russian you say "never not" (никогда не)? In that case, it is exactly like in Catalan (mai no) -> Nosaltres mai no discutim (lit. "We never NOT argue").
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Yes, Russians commonly use double and even triple negations, for instance: Мы никогда ничего не делаем - we never do anything.
- 1536
Katzner's Russian-English dictionary freely translates никода as "never" or "ever" when translating into good idiomatic English. The same for Ничего ("nothing" or "anything"). You don't really have to consider either a double-negative - just don't translate either in the positive sense without не as part of the process.
Is there a special pronunciation with this double c? Is it more of a hissing sound that a single c?
I noticed that the computer-generated pronunciation of double consonants in Russian is, shall we say, lacking. The key to pronouncing any double consonants is Russian is to follow the first sound by a short pause and then pronounce it again. Practice it with a distinct pause and then try shortening it as much as you can while still keeping the sound distinct from that of a single consonant. With DL's pronunciation, I cannot actually distinguish double consonants from the single ones.
- 2173
That is how the Italians and the Japanese pronounce their doubled consonants. For example, "pizza" in Italian is "piz-za" (https://translate.google.com/#it/ru/pizza) and "konnichiwa" in Japanese is "kon-ni-chi-wa" (http://forvo.com/word/konnichiwa/#ja).
(It is also apparently how to pronounce doubled consonants in Elvish. ^_^ Recall when Gandalf says the Elvish word for "friend" in The Lord of the Rings - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DgHCM68KkPY)
It definitely applies to "n". "H" in the name Aнна should sound distinctly different from "н" in "она" (she). Not so much with "m" though: коммунизм (communism) is pronounced as though it had a single "м".
Thanks, I need to check these out in Forvo, since I've heard нн pronounced in the Finnish way (no pause, just streched very long).
Really? I hear the double "н" here clearly: http://forvo.com/word/%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D0%B0/#ru (in all three recordings). That said, the double "н" is not always pronounced that way (now that I thought about it). It is commonly found in many Russian passive participles: сказанный (said), сделанный (made) etc. where the pronunciation of the double "н" is much less articulated (even though I can still clearly hear it e.g. here: http://forvo.com/word/%D1%81%D0%B4%D0%B5%D0%BB%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B9/#ru )
What would the Finnish way of pronouncing double consonants?
I think I sort of hear it in the first example, but the others sound like just one long n. Here's the first word I could find with double n http://forvo.com/word/k%C3%A4nnyk%C3%B6ill%C3%A4/ (with/by mobile phones). Here's short n for comparison http://forvo.com/word/munissa/
Here's double k http://forvo.com/word/rakkaisiin/ Which is essentially just longer silence than in short k (which you can hear in kännyköillä). And here's double l http://forvo.com/word/illalle/ again just longer version of l http://forvo.com/word/kalotti/ .
It's interesting to know what you hear in these! After all it's not just about what is being said. It's also what we assume is being said. One "fun" fact is that even though Finnish has strict categories for long and short phonemes, the the longest short phonemes are actually longer than the shortest long ones :D Finns aren't aware of it! They think they hear something that doesn't actually exist :D I have no idea how foreigners are able to learn this! And actually, many don't.
Weird. I don't hear it in Forvo either and my phonetics book says Russian has long consonants that are pronounced the Finnish way. In IPA these are marked for example [n:] instead of [nn] which would be two separately pronounced similar consonants (I think).
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To me, the double-c sounds like the "ss" in "hiss", so I practiced by saying "hissorimsa" then just "-ssorimsa"
Double "c" sounds different. For example: ссо́рить (cause to quarrel) - [ˈsːorʲɪtʲ], сори́ть (to litter) - [sɐˈrʲitʲ].
The IPA symbols seem to indicate that the first one is a long s instead of two short ones and not what zirkul explained above. I'm still confused by this :D
What is the diference between ссориться and обсуждать? And is дискутировать really used?
They are not even close.
Ссориться = to quarrel;
спорить = to argue (as in "to argue with somebody" or "to argue about somethig", not "to argue a point" - that would be "аргументировать");
обсуждать = to discuss (no animosity is implied).
"Дискутировать" is used, but not commonly. It means something like "to have a prolonged discussion".
