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  5. "Người phụ nữ là bạn."

"Người phụ nữ bạn."

Translation:The woman is you.

April 25, 2016

86 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Haagedoorn

Wouldn't turning this sentence around (You are the woman) make more sense? It is counted as wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Xanthippe42

That would be "Ban la nguoi phu nu." Word order matters.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Haagedoorn

I understand that. You actually make my point, because what I meant was that word order of the English translation of the sentence (''The woman is you''), makes no sense. No one would say it like that in English. So, to make it more clear, would someone actually say "Người phụ nữ là bạn" in Vietnam, instead of ''Ban la nguoi phu nu''?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Xanthippe42

In my experience, you're right--no one would say the original sentence. Someone might say "Nguoi phu nu la mot ban" (the woman is a friend) or maybe "ban cua em la nguoi phu nu" (my friend is a woman). "Ban la nguoi phu nu" is also grammatically correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MissSpell

Just to play devils advocate: "I know the woman who killed our suspect...(point finger at the woman)... the woman is you!" I guess that's not common.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BlackMetal16

Wouldn't the woman in your example BE the suspect? At any rate, no one would say what you said, they would say "That woman is you!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christophe343160

Nice point Miss Spell!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Please distinguish between "bạn" ("you" - a personal pronoun" with "(người) bạn" ("friend" - a noun). The two are homophones. They are pronounced exactly the same but have different meanings. You can also look up my other comment to get a clearer idea about OP's question.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michelle83803

I'm Vietnamese, and I can confirm that "The woman is you" and "Người phữ nữ là bạn" would both be really weird to say, but the main reasons for Duolingo choosing to teach like this while regularly switching it around is to make sure we genuinely know what each word means. Ex: we memorize the general look of a certain phrase and know what it should translate to, but when the time comes, we can't spell it because we don't know what it means.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vngdhuyen

would it be more used? I am not that sure, because obviously the person whom we are talking to knows they're a woman, well normally. is it that hard to imagine a context in which "the woman is you" would be used? the speaker can simply be pointing at a picture and say "oh [that] woman is you!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kazeshinimeyo

I think this example exists to show you that there is no difference between pronouns if they are the subject of the sentence or if they are the object of the sentence. I see that you're learning French, so maybe me explaining it with French examples would make more sense. If you were to say "La femme est toi" you would see that there are distinct verb conjugation and object pronoun declensions. Now if we were to flip it, "Tu es la femme", you see that there is a difference between the form tu/toi takes and the conjugation être takes. Yes, it all sounds weird regardless, but I think it's to illustrate that pronouns do not change regardless of where they occur in the sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dpatkat

Sherlock Holmes: "After tracing the origin of this rare lace, I've determined one fact about the killer: The woman is you." ....... Isn't learning language fun!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BlackMetal16

No. First, that wouldn't be considered a fact. And just saying "the woman is you" is way out of nowhere. There would need to be another sentence befor it, for that to even make sense. " I've determined two things about the killer. The killer is a woman, and that (not the) woman is you."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dpatkat

Father Brown might say that to a group of people that included more than one woman. After explaining who isnt guilty, he might point to the one guilty and say that the woman is you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BlackMetal16

No man, YOU are saying that now when talking about what father brown said. "...that the woman is you." Puting "that" in front of "the" when talking about what was said IN THE PAST is the only way that sentence works. But father brown would NOT say the sentence "the woman is you." unless he was new to English or something. Otherwise he would say "you are the woman." or "that woman is you."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alyson.23

Vietnamese grammar translated directly into english words sounds different.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/astronadiaahh

yeah that confused me too


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/somelauw

How does Người phụ nữ break down? Does Người mean person? Does phụ nữ mean female?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erin300410

EXACTLY! I wrote to to Duolingo and I think this needs to be explained before we can learn it more proficiently.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michelle83803

Người means person/human, and phữ nữ means woman/female.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NerdAndAll

and to think that this would be evenly remotely similiar to Chinese :) I am still a stupid American


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Some rules of Vietnamese grammar and vocabulary do look a bit like those of Chinese. The rest are a different story.

(P.S: You don't need to be American to become stupid. Just kidding! Don't ever say that again. Everyone's a gem.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alyson.23

actually, a lot of vietnamese words are similar to chinese and pronunciations are super similar as well.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tnarp

How exactly is người used here? Is it used like an article, "the" or "that"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TehVanarch

Người means person/human. It's used to specify a particular woman.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Djenthallman

It is some kind of an article, it precedes a noun in order to demonstrate a physical/non-physical appearance or quantity of that noun (taken from Tips And Notes).

P.S.

That woman — Phụ nữ đó or Phụ nữ kia.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

It's not an article but a classifier :) Remember that Vietnamese doesn't have articles.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Edited - Sorry, I meant "này"/"đây" and "đó"/"ấy"/"kia" in Vietnamese serve the same function just as "the", "this" and "that" in English. They are determiners.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

Just "this" and "that", not "the". In Vietnamese, we don't have the corresponding word for "the" because Vietnamese doesn't have any articles.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

I understand your point. But you have to know that:
1. It's not necessary to use "đó/ấy" to make the phrase much more clearer. In almost case, we just need to say "người phụ nữ" for "the woman" and people still know who that woman is.
2. "Đó" and "ấy" (like English determiner "that") also contain the implication for the position (based on the distance from something) of the noun it modifies while "the" doesn't. For example: Người phụ nữ đó chạy can also imply that the woman you are talking about is staying far from you. How will you translate it into English? "That woman runs" or "The woman runs".
3. This course is created for foreigners to learn Vietnamese. So it'll be difficult for them if we bring much complicated information about Vietnamese grammar. Words in English and Vietnamese should be corresponding with each other.
Anyway, thank you for your opinion. We will note it for the next skill tree version.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

Thanks. I'm also glad to see that there are many native speakers here to help people learn our language. Your works are estimable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Yep. I agree that Vietnamese doesn't have what are called articles as those of English. What I meant above is that we should translate "The woman" as "Người phụ nữ đó/ấy". Don't just omit "đó/ấy" because they play an important role in making the phrase much more clearer. They are used to show that you are talking about a particular woman that has already been mentioned, is already known about, or is the only one. Without "đó/ấy", she can be any other woman. I hope you understand my point.

Vâng. Tôi đồng ý với phát biểu rằng Tiếng Việt không có mạo từ như trong Tiếng Anh. Ý của tôi ở bình luận trước đó là ta nên dịch "The woman" thành "Người phụ nữ đó/ấy". Ta không nên lược bỏ "đó/ấy" vì chúng đóng vai trò rất quan trọng trong việc làm cho cụm từ rõ nghĩa hơn. Chúng được dùng để chỉ ra rằng ta đang nói về một người phụ nữ cụ thể mà cô ấy đã được nhắc đến trước đó, đã được biết rõ, hoặc là người duy nhất. Néu không có "đó/ấy", cô ta có thể là bất kỳ người phụ nữ nào khác. Hy vọng bạn hiểu ý tôi.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Fair enough. Should there be clearer explanations at the beginning of this level, many learners wouldn't raise questions like these ones. You guys are doing well with this project anyway. Cheers! ; )


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kazeshinimeyo

"this" "that" "these" "those" are demonstratives, "a" "the" "every" "each" are determiners. There is a difference- one is a pronoun, one is an article or adjectival modifier.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tnarp

Gotcha. Thank you!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mitsuki228364

My english is bad...but for me everythings is ok nwn


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlmaDoggart

This sentence does not make sence


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HanTheNah

I am Vietnamese and I wrote "The female is you" and it said WRONG


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NNUGLES

I did the same. I thought i spoke Vietnamese and English fluently. I guess I was wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ThaoNguyen254317

Ban is friend so friend so it would be the woman is a feiend5


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/alexarze

Alright, so I don't quite understand this: Does the "nguòi" make it pointed towards a particular person? In other words, would "Phu nu là ban" be "She is you" vs. "Nguòi phu nu là ban" being "The woman is you"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

"She is you" -> "Cô ấy là bạn" - no more no less. Please have a look at my other comments to have a better idea about this problematic topic for beginners.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vana_sa

I'm confused: I typed the correct translation, yet they corrected me with the same answer. Is there an explanation for this error?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

The problem might relate to diacritical marks being coded differently on different keyboards. Use Unikey to type proper Vietnamese characters. http://www.unikey.org/. The software is free and open-source and is used on a daily basis by most Vietnamese people.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yusuf54464

I have ended english and I am at 40% in Gẻman, however vietnamese makes me feel stupid.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

Well, Vietnamese may seem difficult at first but when you get used to it, it is a very easy-to-speak language. Feel free to ask any questions :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paul593546

So classifiers are taxonomy I think. Like human man or human woman ? Is there animal man and animal woman?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

"con" is the most common classifier for animals. e.g:

  • CON mèo (cat);
  • 1 CON gà (a/one chicken);
  • 3 CON ếch (3 frogs);
  • 10 CON ong (10 bees), etc.

"Animal man and animal woman" ??? Do you mean "male animal and female animal". We add an adjective which defines the gender of an animal right after the word for that animal.

The most common adjectives defining animal genders are:

  • đực/trống (male)
  • cái/mái (female)

e.g.

  • gấu ĐỰC (MALE bear); gấu CÁI (FEMALE bear)
  • gà TRỐNG (rooster); gà MÁI (hen)

https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jeff14916

I can't understand!!! :/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fatima343285

Why is it that if you forget a period it is only wrong sometimes


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Yeou42

Why is variant "you are woman" wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kennialuna2

I don't know nothing . Started off at zero.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Christian286055

Put the woman is you. COUNTED WRONG


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jenette17313

I had right answer..


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/asian426292

Even I wrote this down and it says it's wrong


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xiahwolf

Why is "The woman" correct but not "A woman"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TeacherHayes

Terrible English translation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FoxHu2

Does Vietnamese has to have the article in front if the noun? Or I got the answer wrong because I was filling in English and I did not put the article which was violated the English grammar? I am curious, it's likely most language in Asia we usually do not put 'the' with any noun. If we would like to point out something specifically, for example, in Chinese we use '那個' ( that ) or '這個' ( this ). I am from Taiwan, my mother tongue is Chinese.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vngdhuyen

no, VNmese doesn't have articles. people, mostly European-language speakers, have a hard translating because they often try to look for articles where there aren't. the very first contributors had to give some equivalents for people to understand and be satisfied: a classifier becomes the definite article and "một" the indefinite article. on the other hand, the English translation should follow its own grammar, and have articles when needed.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FoxHu2

Thanks for the answer. I was confused because sometimes Duolingo would be ok if you left the literal translation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nelson935486

Any one else havin trouble with puttin the correct translation and it still counts it as wrong? I reported it, but how long i gotta wait til this gets fixed?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vngdhuyen

do you mind writing your answer here or report it so I can see what made your answer rejected.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/valeria08154806

I like this site and language so much


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erin300410

i totally don't get this. why not start with individual words like with SPANISH. This is hard to use and most likely, won't work


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

Because Vietnamese isn't like Spanish. Most of words in Vietnamese are compound words and Vietnamese has classifers, which Spanish doesn't have. So if we teach you each individual word, how can you know the meaning of the compound word which is formed when they stand together?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Erin300410

Well, i live in Vietnam. I learn individual words. And, then I put ideas together. The way you throw out the words.....I have not idea how to learn with this system. You need to explain this information and somehow make it more user friendly. I am sorry. I know Vietnamese is hard. I teach English to Vietnamese students. And, it is very difficult to translate either way because of the differences. Perhaps the beginning of this program should have an explanation of the differences between this type of language and a latin based language. Vietnamese was originally character based. This is a big issue. I don't mean to be so critical but, it is hard.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MissSpell

Erin300410, would you mind listing some of the differences between vietnamese and a latin based languages? Any insight you have from gained from teaching would be appreciated.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Xanthippe42

Off the top of my head, here are some big ones: - Pronouns in Vietnamese depend on who you are relative to the person you're talking to, primarily in terms of age but also in terms of status. (As an aside, the way pronouns are dealt with in the duolingo lessons really bugs me. It is taking away so much of the richness.) - Verbs are not conjugated. There are some helper words like "se," but Vietnamese doesn't have tense in the same way romance languages do. - Nouns don't take a plural. - Tone indicates the word rather than the mood of the sentence (English for example tends to go up at the end of a sentence to indicate a question; can't do that in Vietnamese). - Words often occur in pairs that are not separable (like gia dinh for family). - Adjectives follow the nouns they modify. - Vietnamese uses classifiers, which are like measure words in Chinese--they put things into categories. This is what "nguoi" is doing in the sentence under discussion here. The word serves a grammatical purpose in Vietnamese but it doesn't have a one-to-one translation into English.

There are probably some more things, but that's what sticks out to me as a long-time learner of Vietnamese.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TranVanHaiNam

Most of them are right, but this: "Tone indicates the word rather than the mood of the sentence (English for example tends to go up at the end of a sentence to indicate a question; can't do that in Vietnamese)."

Maybe you are confused between tones and the intonation. Tones occur on individual word while the intonation occurs along the sentence. And sentences in Vietnamese do have the intonations like English though its effect is faint comparing to the tones. Sometimes, the intonation will affect the tones of some words in the sentence (usually last words), make it a little bit higher or lower. For example: this sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

LOL. Our native language is a bit of everything. At least, we don't have to write (or perhaps draw) characters like in Chinese or conjugate verbs, nouns, adjectives etc. based on their genders like in Latin languages.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dylan484330

Spanish isn't Vietnamese and Vietnamese isn't Spanish. The rules are different and you just have to adjust to them. It's not hard, you're just not familiar with the rules.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michelle83803

Vietnamese doesn't work that way. Most of thsi language is formed with compound words, and learning individual pieces will not make sense, and some words have no translation without the others. Ex: "dog" in vietnamese is "con chó". If you say chó to someone in Vietnam, you are essentially calling them the b-word, so using the word con that is attached will provide much better clarification and not get you beat up.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vngdhuyen

all depend on in which context you say it, how you say it. you are not insulting anyone by saying "tôi thích chó".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kazeshinimeyo

Because they're completely different languages. Most European languages do not require a thing called classifiers, which Vietnamese requires. You cannot learn them without the context of examples and be learning the language proficiently, meaning how to actually say specific words at appropriate times without learning the context alongside the vocabulary introduction.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gabrielhen126602

americans learn vietnamese,ironic no? ( no,i not from usa, i am from brazil,and no,we don't speak spanish,we speak portuguese) bye


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Meu426232

I put ' you are the woman', guess not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dd721411

"You are the woman." -> Bạn là người phụ nữ. (Wrong word order)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cosmicapplesauce

again not a sentence you would ever need in vietnamese

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