The English context is really not the point. The purpose of translation for Duo's purposes is to help people understand the Spanish context. You are correct that quit can be appropriate here, but to the extent that any user assigns a shade of meaning to the use of quit over stop, and for many people there would be a difference here, translating dejar de as quit will tend to color their understanding of the Spanish. We aren't being taught the English, we know that. But Duo would be remiss in providing translations that tend to color our understanding of the Spanish. There are many contexts where we use quit very much as we use stop, as in Quit it. But when it comes to something like drinking which can be considered a bad habit, vice or health risk, we are much more likely to use quit to imply at least an attempt for forever. Stop absolutely can also mean forever as can dejar de, but in this particular example seeing a translation of quit would tend to give the wrong connotation to quit.
So confusing that you might take LEAVE OF your senses? English has several expressions related to "lay off" or "put aside" an idea. Even "give up" has the same form. A verb related to LEAVE: "give, lay, put..." followed by a preposition: "of, away, off, up, etc." "Dejar de" isn't too much of a stretch.
That was not correct. I have noticed some strange things accepted recently. But I have to leave to drink would be Tengo que irme para beber. Dejar doesn't mean leave like that. It means leave as in leave it on the table. And para is used when you want to indicate a goal or destination.
What context would this be used in? Is it that they've been drinking too much tonight and should stop drinking for now? Or is that they drink too much in general and need to stay away from alcohol permanently? (Or both?)
Saying they have to "stop drinking" is a bit ambiguous, but if you translate it to "quit drinking" it seems to be the latter.
Can anyone please explain the use of "beber" and not "bebiendo". I'm thinking it's something along of bebiendo would mean they were drinking at that moment and beber is more like "these guys are alcoholics, they have to stop drinking". I'm not very good with grammar (in any language) so if someone could explain and use terms like present, infinitive, continuous present... that would be great! #BonusLesson
Although it's tempting at first, we just can't use the Spanish present participle as a gerund (or a "noun") the way we do in English.
Your "I'm thinking" example (continuous present, by the way) is actually pretty much on the mark. In the case of "they were drinking at the moment," the word "drinking" is part of the verb, but when we say "they have to stop drinking," we are actually using that word as a noun (in that case, as I said, a gerund) . Can't do that in Spanish. In Spanish, that same function (verb as noun) is done with the infinitive, so that If I wanted to say "Drinking is my favorite thing," I can't say "Bebiendo es mi cosa favorita," but would have to say something like "Beber es mi cosa favorita." ; -)
Edit: This will explain it better than I: http://www.spanishdict.com/topics/show/31
Thank you for the explanation.
I too have been having some trouble with this. I don't think we were ever really thought this grammar in English.
Anyway, what I've been trying to do is to replace the "-ing" word with something that is definitely a noun, and it helps me to figure out if it is the gerund or the present participle.
So for example, "they have to stop the bus", instead of "they have to stop drinking", does not change the action of the sentence, namely 'having to stop something', so this makes me think that it is the gerund in English.
However, "I am a man" versus "I am thinking", changes the action from me 'being something', a man, to , well, 'me thinking', the thinking itself is the action. So this time I think that 'thinking' is the present participle, and as such would be "estoy pensando" in Spanish.
Is this an ok way to think about it?
I believe the idea is that when you have multiple verbs linked together you only conjugate the first one. In this case you have "tener", "dejar" and "beber", so you conjugate the first one ("tener" becomes "tienen") and leave the others as infinitives.
This is only when the verbs are linked, so if you were to say "they eat and drink" you'd still conjugate both: "comen y beben".
Yes, quit should work for dejar de. The following is solid evidence:
dejar de [+ infinitivo]
You can definitely report it. :)
There is a subtle difference between the two in English. Stopping drinking is suggestive of a temporary cessation, you may well start drinking again tomorrow. Whereas quitting drinking is generally used when you're saying that you're never going to drink again. Although I don't think it is actually wrong to use them interchangeably.
No, you are not slightly wrong. There's some good discussion here about the subtle difference between "dejar" and "dejar de," but once you've taken the subject sentence into English, there is no substantive difference between "stop drinking" and "quit drinking." Note, though, that either could take the qualifiers, "for now" -- or "permanently."
"Que" means many things in different contexts. In this case, it is part of a set phrase, "tener que" which when conjugated, means "have to / has to" , etc.
- Tengo que = I have to . . .
- Tienes que = you have to . . .
- Tiene que = he, she, it, has to . . .
- AND = you (Usted) have to ....
- Tenemos que = we have to . . .
- Tienen que = They have to . . .
Very useful. Follow it with an infinitive and you can say what anyone
has to (must) do.
Tengo que comer, I have to eat; Tienes que ir, you have to go; etc. etc.
All right, this is a tricky one.
Must and have to have the same differences as deber y tener que. Therefore they are not equivalent.
In addition to that, deber is used to express a probability or likeness to happen. So you can have a question to a friend on thephone, while reparing your car:
"So, I replace the air filter, connect the sensors and replace the lid, that should do it, right?"
Yes it should/probably = debería de, si.
Now, The use is not easy and the rule has changed. Before everybody said it wrong, but could quote the rule. Now, everybody says it wrong and nobody knows the rule, so
Ramosraul is incorrect. In English, "must" and "have to" mean exactly the same. Deber has more the sense of "should" in English, or, to translate more literally, to have an obligation to. To say that "I am obliged to" is weaker than "I must" or "I have to", since we do not always fulfill our obligations.
Tener que + inf = to have to; "tener a" does not have the same connotation and isn't used to mean "to have to". Here are some times when you might see "a" after "tener": http://spanish.about.com/od/usingparticularverbs/a/tener_a.htm
I'm not asking whether the Spanish sentence would change if I were using tener que or necesitar; this exercise was translating 'Tienen que dejar de beber' to English. I'm pretty sure "They have to stop drinking' is conversationally just as acceptable as "They need to stop drinking.' I may have been so accustomed to it that my grammar is failing me, but as far as I know a person may say "I need to..." in most, if not all situations where a person could use "I have to..."
In Spanish this would change but I would think in English both are acceptable? I mean people say "I need to do X" or "I need to go to Y" and the like all the time.
I'm curious no one else has asked why answers aren't accepted that way by DuoLingo before me apparently, though. Maybe 'need' is grammatically incorrect and these things just became common practice.
There is nothing incorrect about saying "They need to . . .". It's perfectly fine and acceptable to say that from a grammatical standpoint, and it's somewhat interchangeable. However, the connotation can be slightly different, so it can't be translated that way from this particular sentence in Spanish because "need to" and "have to" have slightly different meanings. While we should always translate "thought for thought" rather than "word for word", it's still important to get the closest meaning possible. Therefore, DL rightly only accepts "have to" because that is the meaning of "tener que". If they accepted anything that was "close" to the intended meaning, at what point what they draw the line? Therefore, a correct translation could only be "They have to. . ." So what you put is perfectly fine to say in English, but I was just trying to answer your question on why it's not an accepted translation for this sentence. I hope that makes sense. :)
No, I put "need to" also. I learned in school that "tener que" meant to need to, so I was surprised that this answer was not accepted for this sentence. I am not convinced that it is incorrect. Anyway, the only difference I can imagine between "have to" and "need to" in this context would be "they have to stop drinking because they have run out of liquid." But... it is not the only time DL corrects what I think is an acceptable answer. I am willing to accept that probably DL is right in these instances more often than I am ;-)
Perhaps "Tienen que parar para beber", or "Tienen que parar para tomar algo." The thing is, the kind of 'stop' contemplated by your question, even in English, is not exactly the same as 'stop' meaning to desist or refrain from an act of some sort — or, as JohnGrunewald notes just above, to "leave off" or "quit" doing a thing.
"Stop" in that sense is what you do at a "Pare" sign.
Perhaps this will help: http://users.ipfw.edu/jehle/courses/VRBSPREP.HTM Specifically: "Verbs meaning “to stop” or “to finish” are normally followed by de plus an infinitive" and "Verbs meaning “to continue” are normally followed by the -ndo form, with no preposition"
Also as far as I know it must be "tienen que" (they have to) not just "tienen" (they have).
So maybe this would have been accepted: tienen que parar de beber.
In English we seldom use the straight infinitive. One of the most common ways of translating the infinitive from Spanish to English is to use the present progressive, or participle. We wouln't, for instance, say "I am to go to the store." We would say, "I am going to the store." Very, very common transition of Spanish tense to English tense.
'dejar' means 'to stop' only in the sense of 'leave off' or 'quit.' To stop the forward motion of something is "parar". Tienen que parar para beber I think would mean "they have to stop to drink. In the sense of "they can't drink while they are moving, so they have to stop."
In this case, Duolingo is correct, and John is correct. By " two sources on spanish dict.", I gather you mean two of the machine translators. because none of the knowledgeable users over there would have steered you wrong. Those translators are fairly good, but "dejar de" is a fixed idiomatic phrase (not an "idiom") meaning to stop, cease, or quit doing a thing. Suggestion: read through the entirely of these threads; in this case, it's been explained several times. Good luck.
Because "dejar de + [infinitive]" is a set phrase in Spanish, meaning to stop doing something, where the infinitive expresses the something. There's quite a bit of discussion covering this idea in the thread.
They have to stop to drink would be "Tienen que parar para beber", or "Tienen que parar para tomar algo," where "parar" is to stop in the physical sense.
Dejar de + infinitive means to stop doing whatever the infinitive verb is. Dejar de comer to stop eating. Dejar de trabajar to stop working.,etc To stop to drink is equivalent in English to to stop for a drink and that is how you would say it in Spanish, but since dejar de only means to stop doing something (otherwise it means let or leave) it would use parar. Para para una bebida
You have just demonstrated the problem with relying too much on the hints on Duo without understanding the actual meaning of the words. It is one of the major reasons why I recommend that people to always check hint meanings with a good dictionary to understand in what way and under what circumstances the words mean this.
The expression dejar de (infinitive) means to stop doing something (the action of the verb) meaning to no longer do it (at least for the moment) But the expression to stop to do something implies that you are interrupting what you were doing in order to do something else. But the implication is that your intention, at least, was to continue doing the original thing once the other has been accomplished. Using the term for this we have borrowed from racing, it is a pitstop. Dejar cannot be used to express this, or at least not easily. The basic meaning of dejar is to leave or let. There is an expression in some regional American dialects that might help you with this meaning if you are familiar with it. You may have heard people say I have to leave off drinking or smoking, etc. Now this expression is most often used in English when whatever you are "leaving off" doing is something that is considered a bad habit, which is NOT necessarily a connotation of dejar de, but the use of a similar verb in that expression did help me understand dejar de. So dejar de beber or dejar de comer means to stop drinking or stop eating (or at least that particular eating session/meal). If you want to say that you stopped (in order) to drink or you stopped (in order) to eat, you would use a verb like parar whose base meaning is to stop. So in terms of your sentence They have to stop to drink, that would be Tienen que parar para beber.
They're just things to memorize:
- "tener que" + infinitive = to have to ___
- "dejar de" + infinitive = to stop ___
"Tener que" will be followed by an infinitive in both languages. "Dejar de" will be followed by an infinitive in Spanish, but translates to the ING form of the verb in English (the "gerund" form, I believe).
- Tenemos que dejar de comer - We have to stop eating
- Queren dejar de comer - They want to stop eating
- Voy a dejar de comer ahora - I'm going to stop eating now
I don't know if there are any exceptions to anything above.
Dejar de + infinitive means to stop doing something (the action of the verb). So dejar de beber is to stop drinking, just as dejar de trabajar means to stop working. You have to remember that any infinitive that is the object of a preposition may well translate as an English gerund. The gerund in English is the form of the verb used as a noun, but in Spanish that form is the infinitive.
To stop to drink has a rather different translation. First of all you can't use dejar, since dejar without the de + infinitive doesn't mean to stop, it means to let or to leave. So it would use parar. And when you see a construction in English that is like stop to drink or work to eat, where the to is short for in order to, in Spanish that translates as para in Spanish. So They have to stop [in order] to drink would be Tienen que parar para beber/tomar.
That is wrong. I can see how you might get there if you only understand dejar as to let or to leave, but abandon would only be used in English with something like drinking in a rather poetically invocative sense. Abandon is an emotionally charged word in English. People stop drinking. You would only say that they abandoned drinking if you had just referred to drinking as a lifelong friend or something equally emotionally charged.
And the other side is the Spanish. Dejar de (infinitive) is a standard expression meaning to stop (doing the verb). Dejar de is synonymous with parar, but only when it is part of a phrasal verb. But it has no particular emotional impact, so would not support your translation. The tone and emotional impact of words is an extremely important part of effective communication and therefore language learning and translation.