"We have a cat because of our parents."

Translation:Wir haben eine Katze wegen unseren Eltern.

January 24, 2013

58 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CristianCantoro

I wrote "Wir haben eine Katze wegen unseren Eltern", that was accepted but also "Wir haben eine Katze wegen unserer Eltern." (notice: useren vs. unserer) was presented as another correct possibility. So, I am not sure I'm understating how the declination is working here...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wataya

'wegen' is mostly a genitive preposition with a few exceptions where it can also take the dative. http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/wegen So, "wegen unserer Eltern" is the better solution. "Wegen unseren Eltern" is a bit colloquial but ok to use.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FrancisKon

The sad part is that it takes five more rows for me to open genitive case from where I saw this bit.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Menigmand

The real sad thing is that I unlocked genitive a long time ago, and I still got this wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stuart-Patrick

Love the honesty... But at least we know why we are wrong now... Not saying it helps ..


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Garybald

Is there a difference between "wegen+gen" and "wegen+dat"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

"wegen+gen" is correct, "wegen+dat" is colloquial. But there is one exception: If only one single word follows "wegen", Dativ is correct (and Genitiv is wrong).
Wegen Umbau geschlossen Dativ
Wegen eines Umbaus geschlossen Genitiv
Wegen einem Umbau geschlossen colloquial use of Dativ instead of Genitiv
translation: Closed because of (a) building modification.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Avery_Eubanks

What even is genitive? Like why would you use "unserer Eltern" here when it makes more sense to me to use accusative? Unser already indicates possession so I don't understand the point of genitive.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

The Genitiv is not used because they are our parents. Even the word "Eltern" itself has to be Genitiv here. Not because they own anything, but because of the preposition "wegen". Since "unser" is something like an adjective here, its ending depends on the case of "Eltern".
some examples: wegen der Eltern (Dativ would be "den Eltern", Akkusativ "die Eltern".) wegen vieler Eltern, wegen dieser Website, wegen des Kommentars, wegen eines Kommentars, wegen deines Kommentars...

Akkusativ is completely wrong here; the colloquial alternative is Dativ.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BaSsGaz

Citing Wikipedia :

"In spoken language, the genitive with prepositions is nowadays often replaced by the dative. But it is important to notice that this replacement is still just colloquial language, e.g.:

Written: Während des Essens wollen wir nicht gestört werden.

Spoken: Während dem Essen wollen wir nicht gestört werden."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stuart-Patrick

Thank you. I have done both thinking; fem die Eltern dativ der Eltern unserer Eltern. But unseren Eltern is wrecking my head. At least I'm not alone.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

fem die Eltern

Take care: "die Eltern" is not femininum; it is plural. And since the word exists only in plural, one can't know the gender.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tim952328

I'll try to mend your head... Dative plural takes 'den', and adds an 'n' to the noun (unless it already ends in 'n').

Ich spiele mit den Eltern. I play with the parents

Ich spiele mit unseren Eltern I play with our parents.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/greenfire315

When do you use weil and when do you use wegen?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/muitosabao

I think weil = because, wegen = because of


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alaina441665

Right...wegen means both "because of" and "due to".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/greenfire315

Oh ok that makes sense. :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rusebbb

And when do you use "weil" and when with "denn"...? Danke!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Alaina441665

"Weil" and "denn" both mean "because" and are interchangeable...EXCEPT that "weil" requires you to put the conjugated verb at the end (it's a "kicker") and "denn" requires no change to the sentence structure at all (it takes the zero position, just like all the ADUSO connectors). For example: Ich mag ihn, weil er nett ist. Ich mag ihn, denn er ist nett. Both mean "I like him because he is nice," but the grammatical structure is just slightly different based on which form of "because" you use.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Diane125530

What are ADUSO connectors?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

"aber", "denn", "und", "so" and "oder". Their first letters build the "word" ADUSO. They have some common grammatical properties.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/margusoja

Would this be a valid translation too? Wir haben eine Katze dank unseren Eltern.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wataya

Yes, it's ok. But note that the preposition "dank" is more commonly used with the genitive case (at least for plural nouns): "Dank unserer Eltern". But the dative does work.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rowschank

Nach dem B1-Kurs des Goethe-Instituts, ist dies unbedingt Falsch. Man kann "wegen" mit Dativ benutzen, nur wenn ein Personalpronomen danach kommt, und das auch nur in der Umgangssprache. Sonst kommt "wegen" immer mit Genitiv.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/margaretdavies38

I wrote wir haben eine Katze wegen unseren Eltern . Surely that was correct? Also Wir haben eine Katze wegen unserer Eltern is correct. Which should I use?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

Originally correct is to use the Genitiv after "wegen". Wegen unserer Eltern.
But many native Germans use falsely the Dativ after "wegen". So about 70% will call "wegen unseren Eltern" correct and 90% use it themselves.

So question yourself if you want to learn correct German or German with nativ-speaker-mistakes. A good native German can both.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/doublelingot

you can use both but the latter is preferred


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MrZmann4000

when do you use unser instead of unserer, aren't you supposed to add the article, they both have dER unsER unserER


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TiagoSaboga

Unser is the base form. It just happens to end with the ER too.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eki461292

Wegen steht immer mit Genitiv. Also: wegen der Eltern / wegen unserer Eltern. Alles andere ist Dummdeutsch.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Probably what is best is that this point be brought up and discussed here in the discussion page, just as what you have initiated, eki461292. Per Wiktionary:

(#2) In the vernacular, and occasionally in writing, it is common to use the dative case after wegen at all times, whereby all the above peculiarities cease to apply. To some, the genitive may even sound pretentious in a private conversation. This is long-standing practice in the German dialects, which have mostly abolished the genitive per se.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/eki461292

Wegen muss mit Genitiv stehen, nicht wie hier mit Dativ. Bitte ändern.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

Bitte melden. Die Diskussionen werden nicht systematisch beobachtet.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fekundulo

That's cruel.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AmandaCunn4

It didnt accept Katze for me, saying it should have been Kater?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

In that case, you probably used a masculine article (z.B., einen) and so die Eule thought you wanted to say a male cat, which is der Kater. Had you said eine Katze, you'd have probably been correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/hoomau

If unserer is preferred over unseren, why is the translation at the top "unseren" -- and "unseren" the only option among the word choices?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

Because Duolingo is not perfect. And: Depending on whom you are talking to, you should prefer the wrong form to not being seen as a wise guy.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LukeBousfi1

Would "Wegen unsere Eltern, wir eine Katze haben" also be a valid translation?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jussel11

No, "wegen" needs Genitiv (or Dativ). "unsere Eltern" is Nominativ and Akkusativ.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Squizzie1

I was marked wrong for using 'unserer'.....


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Interesting, isn't it? In standard/formal Deutsch, "wegen" should be used with Genitiv, which would be unserer to reflect the plural Eltern. Apparently, however, in the vernacular, wegen is usually used with Dativ, thus unseren.

This has been discussed already. And unserer Eltern should be accepted. It's quite likely you had some other error. This is why it's important to copy/paste (or screenshot) your entire answer (and the correction).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MariaEduar546921

Can't I use "weil"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Potentially. How do you plan on using it? Have you read the other comments here about using weil?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jason_in_DC

wegen unsere eltern, haben wir eine katze. this was marked incorrect. not sure why, maybe b/c it need dative case for the parents?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Usage notes
1.) While use with the dative is now considered acceptable in informal use, it is still considered erroneous by conservative or linguistically aware speakers (except in certain cases, see below). In the standard language, wegen is usually followed by the original genitive.
. . . .
2.) In the vernacular, and occasionally in writing, it is common to use the dative case after wegen at all times, whereby all the above peculiarities cease to apply. To some, the genitive may even sound pretentious in a private conversation. This is long-standing practice in the German dialects, which have mostly abolished the genitive per se.
--Wiktionary::wegen

It looks like that's exactly the issue, although formal usage would have Genitiv: "Wegen unserer Eltern . . . . "


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stephan0475

Another fine example for Duolingo persistant failure to use the word “wegen“ in the right way. “Wegen“ always demands the genitiv. Always. No Exception. So the right words are: “wegen unserer Eltern“ instead of “wegen unseren Eltern“.!!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/g_io_vanni

why not Wir haben eine Katze wegen "unserer" Eltern.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

This is discussed throughout these comments. Have you read them? What is still unclear?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Heike508563

Wir haben eine Katze wegen u n s e r e r Eltern. Wegen ist eine Präposition, der der Genitiv folgen muss.

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