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"Премьер-министр критиковал действия депутата."

Translation:The Prime Minister criticized the MP's actions.

2 years ago

21 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/supermollusc
supermollusc
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"the prime minister criticised the actions of the MP" Duo has a few things to sort out in this section First off, "MP" (or "TD" if you're in Ireland) is the natural English translation of "deputy" a word which doesn't exist in the political sense in English politics Second off, words ending in "-ize" in American English (criticize, emphasize etc) end in "-ise" in British English and Duo should recognise (!) this

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/zirkul
zirkul
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Not just in English politics! The translation of депутат → deputy is simply wrong; these words are false friends. The Russian translation of deputy is "заместитель", while "депутат" corresponds to either "member of parliament" (MP) in the UK, Canada etc. or "(elected) representative/congressman/congresswoman" in the US.

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Q6uj
Q6uj
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Thanks! First I don't understand, what does mean the "MK"

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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If you've happened to see "MK" somewhere and that's why you're asking, it means "Member of the Knesset" (the Israeli parliament).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/zirkul
zirkul
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Простите, а где Вы видите "MK"?
"MP"=Member of Parliament.

Кроме того, правильная фраза: I don't understand what "MK" means.
В придаточном предложении инверсия не делается, даже если по смыслу оно передаёт вопрос.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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Why would you suppose one was discussing UK politics in Russian? "Chamber of Deputies", consisting of... deputies is a perfectly natural formulation in English to discuss political arrangements existing in any number of countries around the world. Oh, and Ireland, too, at the very least historically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chamber_of_Deputies

2 years ago

https://www.duolingo.com/emile_le_reveil

Hi I have a PhD in Political Science and agree with supermollusc and zirkul. In English we say for all countries "parliamentarians", "members of parliament", or "representatives" and by no means "deputies". Deputy in English means a person who replaces his/hers superior in case of absence - for example the vice-president is the deputy of the president. For Russian politics you can often also read "members of the State Duma" or "members of the Federation Council" or even "senators" talking about the Federation Council. By the way, I wouldn't say "congressman" is completely wrong but strictly speaking it is a term specific for the US (and a few other countries like Spain).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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Is your hypothesis then that the entire existence of that Wikipedia article is simply fallacious, and that every single use of "deputy" in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Duma is erroneous? I rather suspect instead that they were composed by people familiar with a definition of "deputy" present in Collins, Oxford, and Merriam-Webster. Sure, the (only) definition you and the others acknowledge is there, too, but that does not somehow mean that the second definition does not exist.

Further uses here, here, here, here (where both senses of "deputy" are present in the same article).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/emile_le_reveil

Hello, I think you misunderstood what I was writing. If you have a translation (into English) then general terms like "parliamentarian", "representative" etc have to be correct. I did not say that "deputy" is incorrect. It is just too specific. If I talk with someone only about the Russian situation then an article using "deputy" would be understandable, particularly if it has been defined that this is the regional use. But if you want to use that sentence in the context of another country it is unavoidably wrong.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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You are the one who said you agreed with zirkul, who stated "The translation of депутат → deputy is simply wrong." I don't know how to read that other than that you were asserting "deputy" as a translation to be, well, simply wrong.

OK, so now you agree it's OK for Russia. But then you assert that deputy "in the context of another country is unavoidably [emphasis mine] wrong." This is precisely the notion refuted by simply looking up the term "Chamber of Deputies," not to mention other post-Soviet countries which can hardly now be thought to be included in any reference to "the Russian situation."

Oh, and from the official website of the Irish legislature: https://www.oireachtas.ie/viewdoc.asp?fn=/documents/a-misc/deputy.htm

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Monica160414

I would also say MP. Deputy is not a good translation.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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Beyond my comment above, considering this is a sentence in Russian doesn't it make sense to assume it might be about Russian politics? Just count how many times "deputy" or "deputies" are used in this article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_Duma

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Q6uj
Q6uj
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You think so, but I can say, that there is not in Russian Language notion "MK". We always say "депутат", иногда "депутат парламента, ГосДумы или ЗакСобрания", than we mean a "Deputy", and we don't like reduce simple words or phrases even more

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bleepandbloop

"a MP" is accepted, but not "an MP". Actually, "a" is wrong because it's pronounced like 'em-pee'.

9 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Olly_1052
Olly_1052
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My question is not for politics :) Why here the word "actions" (plural) Duo requires the article "a/the"?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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In the example translation, "the" isn't modifying "actions"; it's modifying "deputy." Implicitly, this is referring to some set of actions, all of which the prime minister is criticizing.

One could also have written, "criticized the actions of the deputy." The first "the" here indicates, again, that it is the entirety of a set of actions (say, all those he/she did yesterday or with regard to a certain initiative) being criticized.

I believe "criticized actions of the deputy" should also be correct (probably this is what you wrote, given your inquiry?). Probably few have come up with this version, hence why it wasn't accepted, but that's just because it's not terribly common, not that it's wrong. It would mean that some of the deputy's actions were being criticized, but there is no reference to a whole set of actions.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Olly_1052
Olly_1052
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Thank you for the detailed explanation

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ivergruz777

You are right "The Prime Minister criticized the actions of the deputy" is already accepted

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jQuasebarth
jQuasebarth
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This is a more general question: Why is there a "ь" in "премьер"? After all, I thought the "м" should be soft just because of the "е", so why does it need an additional "ь"?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Olly_1052
Olly_1052
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In this case, "Ь" is the delimiter between "М" and "Е": "...мье..."=[mje]

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
piguy3
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To add a bit, yes the м would have been soft just because of the е, but here the м is soft, and the /j/ sound is still present.

1 year ago