1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: Hebrew
  4. >
  5. "Tomato sauce."

"Tomato sauce."

Translation:רוטב עגבניות.

June 28, 2016

17 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AniKelly69

Why is רוטב עגבניה not acceptable?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

That's Hebrew for ya! As when, in a restaurant, I got a puzzled "?מה" from a server when I requested "מיץ תפוז"
instead of "מיץ תפוזים".

2019-08-28 rich739183


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mgrdAT

Why is "tomatoes sauce" or "tomatoes' sauce" not acceptable in English? After all, you need more than one tomato for the sauce. ( Unless you live in Woody Allen's "Sleeper" world.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

@mgrdAT:
In the [noun noun] phrase "tomato sauce", the first noun, "tomato", is descriptive, telling us what kind of sauce it is, not how many tomatoes are in it; that's how it's said in English. The same is true for tomato juice, tomato pie, tomato salad, egg salad, strawberry pie, grape juice, apple tree, bus stop, train station, et cetera.

The phrase "tomatoes sauce" is wrong because it is not idiomatic English.
The phrase "tomatoes' sauce" is wrong here because the apostrophe makes the first noun possessive, telling us that the sauce belongs to, or is owned by, some tomatoes.

Also, you should not assume that Hebrew always uses the plural of the descriptive ingredient. Although it does so here, and in other tomato products such as tomato juice, "מיץ עגבניות", and in some other juices such as orange juice, "מיץ תפוזים", there's also carrot juice, which is "מיץ גזר".

2020-05-14 rich739183


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tim5602

Is there a word for ketchup? קטשוף maybe?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Walrosse

Yup, same as in English: "קטשופ"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tim5602

But haven't it to be the final pe?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jg9000

Final pe (ף) always has an F sound. For a P sound you have to use the normal פ, even at the end of a word. This only happens in words and names of foreign origin that were transliterated to Hebrew, as normal Hebrew words will never end with a P sound.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tim5602

Ok, I understand. Thank you very much!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LilTweetingBird

Are there any words that end in a P sound that aren't borrowed from other languages? If so, is using the פ at the end of a word only applicable when not using a dagesh?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

jg9000 already answered your first question.

Walrosse's spelling of קטשופ is without dagesh for the same reason that it's without vowels: that's typical for Hebrew. But you can always include any of those marks when you feel that it will help you or the person with whom you're communicating: here, have some קֶטְשׁוֹפּ. (However we are not supposed to use those marks in answering Duolingo's lessons.)

2019-08-28 rich739183


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/xerostomus

Audio is missing here.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

The flag button is for reporting errors, but the audio button is here.

2019-08-28 rich739183


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/wandacummi

why is this plural


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

Wanda, the phrase "רוטב עגבניות" is a compact way of saying "רוטב של עגבניות", literally a sauce (singular) of tomatoes (plural). So the overall phrase is grammatically singular: it's just one sauce.

It's a Hebrew noun-noun "construct phrase" called a "smichut" ("סמיכות"); you can read about that in the course notes at https://duome.eu/tips/en/he
and you can find other sources online and in textbooks.
Note that the first noun in a smichut determines the gender and number of the smichut, regardless of the gender and number of the second noun. The smichut "רוטב עגבניות" is grammatically singular and masculine because רוטב is singular and masculine, even though עגבניות is plural and feminine.

Having said all that, the second noun is not plural in every such smichut. E.g., while orange juice is "מיץ תפוזים", carrot juice is "מיץ גזר".

2020-01-02 rich739183


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/VidAdler

if רוטב עגבניות is tomato sauce, how do you say "wet tomatoes"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rich739183

Wet tomatoes is עַגְבָנִיּוֹת רְטוּבוֹת
Different grammar and vocabulary: two nouns versus a noun and an adjective! And remember the difference in word order between the two languages.

2020-08-17 rich739183

Learn Hebrew in just 5 minutes a day. For free.