"We have all the colors but purple."

Translation:יש לנו את כל הצבעים חוץ מסגול.

June 29, 2016

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Why can't we omit את here? "yesh lanu" literally stands for "there is at our disposal", so, technically, את is not supposed to be used with "yesh". I know it is commonly used with 'yesh" - presumingly, under the influence of Yiddish and/or Ladino syntax, yet it shouldn't be wrong to omit it. (To people whose native language is Russian or one of the Turkic or Finno-Ugrian languages, in other words, languages that have exact equivalents of "yesh" and "ein", using "et" with "yesh" is sheer nonsense.. I wonder what the situation is with other Semitic languages).


Agreed, does anyone have a definitive answer on why it's marked wrong when we omit את?


Because it is accusative. So we need it in order to get a determinative.


It is easy to see that it is accusative in English, but the Hebrew construction does not show this. I need to go back and check, but does saying "I have the X" in English always necessitate writing "Xיש לי את ה" ? "I" would be the nominative in English, but in Hebrew "אני" is in a prepositional phrase. So, can you have an accusative noun without first having a nominative noun?


Easy rule of thumb. If there is את it is always a direct object, which means it is accusative.


There is a bit of controversy about that question. There is quite a bit of discussion about it in some other threads here on DL where you can find those discussions. Basically, when the language was revived, את was not used in this construction, but with time, people started using it and now it's caught on, that it sounds weird without it.

A construction exists in Russian that is very, very similar to the Hebrew one. And I think somebody mentioned Celtic languages have a similar feature. So, it's not that unique.


So the answer is that in Hebrew, "X יש לי", "X" is always considered a direct object and not just in this case? Is אני considered the subject even though it's in a prepositional phrase? I find it interesting because I don't remember coming across a similar setup in other languages - not that I have experience in all that many different languages.


I have a hard time bringing myself to say יש את - https://he.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D7%99%D7%A9_%D7%90%D7%AA


אין סגול, אין כיף!


Yesh lanu et kol ha-tsva’im khuts mi-sagol.


Is there a rule to when one should use חוץ and when to use מלבד??


why isnt it possible to change place of the words כל and את. i am thinking of the song "cholomot shel acherim" where they sing "kol et ha yom" not "et kol ha yom"


I think כל את היום means all day and את כל היום means everyday.


No, "כל היום" means "all day", and "every day" is "כל יום".
Duo explains this in the כל/כל ה section of the Tips for the "Determiner" skill on Duo's website, and in the compilation of Tips at https://www.duome.eu/tips/en/he

The word אֶת has nothing to do with the distinction between "all" and "every". It simply marks the definite direct object of a transitive verb, as explained in the Tips for the "Food 1" and "Dir. Obj." skills on Duo's website, and in the compilation of Tips linked above.

Also note that "everyday" is an adjective, not a noun phrase, so it is different than "every day".

b107 rich739183


No, in the Idan Raichel Project song "חלומות של אחרים" ("Chalomot Shel Acherim"), he does not sing "kol et ha yom". It has "et hayom", but only in the phrase "הָבִיאִי אֶת הַיּוֹם", without "kol".

Please be careful to check your sources, since we are all trying to learn, and small differences can be significant.

b107 rich739183


אני לא בטוח למה זה שגוי להשמיט "את" במשפט הזה.


חוץ and מלבד means thr same?


As I understand it, חוץ means literally "outside of" (like
חוץ לארץ outside the country) מלבד means "except for" (think of the word לבד meaning alone


הלא ש" אלא" גם נכון בפעם הזה?


But works as an "except" here and "אלא" cannot be used in the same sense.

It usually comes in a sentence in a positive sense, as in to replace something that is not. For example: "I wasn't angry, but disappointed" - "לא הייתי עצבני, אלא מאוכזב".


Okay, so it works like the expression: "except for".


Why isn't the following correct, it was marked wrong: יש לנו את כל הצבעים אבל סגול

I thought אבל means "but".


“Aval” (אבל) is a different kind of “but”. In the given sentence, “but” means “except for”. Another example of this “but” is found in the famous song “Don’t sit by the apple tree with anybody else but me”.


I'm in the Android app and they took away the underlining part to see your mistake, I spelt tsvaim wrong by adding a "on" accidentally (I Swype, so I Swyped and it wrote the wrong word, no matter,) but it didn't underline that the word was what was incorrect. Is this feature still accessible on ios and on the website? 4 April 2019


I dont understand the use of מסגול . why not ל for implied word "for"or nothing at all just סגול


A very important rule is that you can never translate prepositions directly, because they rarely match. It's always better to remember phrases and go from there. Here, חוץ מ is simply an inseparable phrase that means "except for" (מ is attached to the next word) and that is how you need to remember it. So, חוץ מסגול - "except for purple".


On a different subject, I'm having trouble with כל vs. כולם. Why is the singular כל used before הצבעים and not the plural כולם?


Because כולם means "everybody" or "all of them". It can't be used here, because just like in English, you can't say "all of them colors", you can't do that in Hebrew either.


Why can't we replace חוץ מ with אך and אלא or מלבד? What ate the rules of usage of each?


Here the problem is English, which can translate all those words with "but", but they are all not interchangeable. מלבד is the one that could also be used here. יש לנו את כל הצבעים מלבד הסגול. However, מלבד is more formal, so it is understandable that not every sentence accepts it. A better translation of חוץ מ is "except for" or "apart from".

As for אך, it is the basic word for "but", together with אבל. The difference between them is that אך is more formal and therefore less common. An example sentence: אני רוצה לבוא, אבל אין לי זמן. I want to come, but I don't have time. אך would have worked here as well.

As for אלא, this has the meaning "but rather". It is used to express the contrast between an affirmative and a negative statement. זה לא סוס אלא חמור. That is not a horse but (rather) a donkey.

Here are some additional posts I found, that deal with the same question:




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