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  5. "Inside her or inside you?"

"Inside her or inside you?"

Translation:בתוכה או בתוככן?

July 6, 2016

38 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ani_sofer

בתוכךָ בתוכךְ בתוככם בתוככן

All of the prepositions follow the same pattern of suffixes. שלךָ שלךְ שלכם שלכן


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gerardd88

I know but I can't remember which one is which, especially the singular forms.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ani_sofer

Ok, so the feminine form ends with the sound of the ךְ no vowel sound following it, "shelach" (yours) "lach" (to you) "otach" (you {objective})

And all of the masculine forms end with a ךָ with the "ah" vowel, so it always ends in "cha" "shelcha" (yours) "l'cha" (to you) "otcha" (you {objective})

Think about the way it works with the pronoun itself, אתה (ata) is "you" masculine and את (at) is feminine. We see the same pattern of the vowel ending here.

Hope that helps...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gerardd88

Thanks a lot. I think I'll remember it now. I wouldn't probably have any problems with that but imagine how confused you can become if you have four forms of the pronoun, different from simple personal pronouns, when you are simultaneously learning how prepositions work with these pronouns, etc. And you translate them all in every sentence as you! Thanks English... :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shimkelevine

"you" in English does not specify gender or number, so "inside you" would have four possible equivalents in Hebrew. Why is the singular marked wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ninon.de.Lenclos

Different genders are often marked as typos although they are applied correctly.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HTIKVA

my answer is correct yet it tells me it is wrong! what gives


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/psheri

how can i have a typo if you provide the choices???????


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ninon.de.Lenclos

Why are gender changes considered typos so often?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Snezhi

I wrote בתוכה או בתוכך which was accepted as correct. My question has to do more with pronunciation. Could someone help me differentiate between those two when only listening? Especially the form of בתוכך that ends on ‘a’ (sorry, can’t type the nikkud). I hope what I’m asking for makes sense.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

They are almost the same, except that "inside you" has an additional syllable - "che", so it's: "betochá o betochechá.

Here you can check the other persons, if you wish: https://www.pealim.com/dict/4170-betoch/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Snezhi

Thank you so much! That is very helpful.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shimkelevine

This is a general question, but I do not know how to ask general questions so am asking here -- how do I access "tips" or grammatical pointers, for example how to say WHAT in sentences like "What an interesting book!" "What a woman!" What lofty mountains!" "What exotic lands!"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

Well there are tips and notes on many of the skills, available only on the web version. Not sure you'll be able to find answers to all the ones you listed, but it's a good start.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Leananseidhe

Israelis have a phrases "איזה יופי!" (so great!) or "איזה חוצפה" (what a impudence), so I think איזה is correct analog for WHAT in your samples. Hope it helps


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Susan189831

How can I keep having typos when I am merely click on the word options they provide - they don't mark me wrong. I am so annoyed!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelJG7

Having the chaf letter at the end is a little trippy. -cha at the end sounds like "you" masc. sing., though it means "her". Pronouncing the double -che-che at the end is relatively difficult too for -che-chen and -che-chem.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dovbear57

Yes it takes a bit of practice -- that's why we do Duolingo I guess. You know that the feminine singular "inside you" is betochéch (or b'tokheikh)? So in that one instance we have a nice big vowel in between the two chafs. In the other three, it's true there is just a sh'va between them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

Modern Hebrew pronunciation lost the שווא נע, so in בתוככם it's the same /e/ between the kafs as in בתוכך (Or maybe a tiny bit weaker because it's not stressed).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/StevenRBru

The correct answer had an option that wasn't present in the choices.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gerardd88

I still can't get the 'you' pronouns for objects or in constructions like this one. What are the forms of 'inside you' for all the forms for the 2. person?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TeribleT

Use the tips and notes for duolingo Hebrew! (Memrise Duolingo Hebrew vocab is good too): Duome.edu/username/progress

Put your Duolingo username in the space instead of username.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sylgua

When do you expect singular or plural_


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NaftaliFri1

Depends who you're talking about


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tova497054

we should have a keyboard that pops up?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TeribleT

Silicone keyboard cover works on a laptop or desktop, mine was $10 on Amazon. Then I just set it (in your computer settings) to switch languages when I hit a certain keyboard combination (like space bar + control). On mobile devices I use Swype app, there I just hold the space bar for a second and the languages I've chosen come up.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MariusIchi1

מדוע התשובה השנייה אינה נכונה ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

In the forum we can't see what is the second answer you were shown )-:


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DianaJohns790807

What is the difference betweenבתוככן ובתוכך ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/dovbear57

In English both mean inside you, but בתוכך = singular; בתוככן = feminine plural.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ReyMarlies

Why is this wrong? How can I find out, if you want f or m


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NatashaSha386361

What's wrong with "בתוכה ובתוכך"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Orevafor

That means "inside her AND inside you"

"ו" = and

" או" = or


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tova497054

בְּתוֹך שֶׁלָה אוֹ בְּתוֹך אתה ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hava_Dorit

I think you are essentially right, that the words we are dealing with are compound words, and you are breaking them down into separate words, without the pronouns attached. According to https://www.pealim.com/dict/4170-betoch/, it seems that your breakdown of the words בתוכה and בתוככן should be בתווך שלה או בתווך שלך (betavékh shelah o betavékh shelkhá). However, a native Hebrew speaker will have to come along and confirm this. I'm betting that it's at least close, and hoping that it helps.

(keeping L-R format) בתוך is a tough example because it's already a compound word even before one compounds it again with another word!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ani_sofer

In Hebrew all declensions (combination words of both the preposition and pronoun) cannot be used separately. For example:

my/mine can never be: של אני

the two words must always be combined: שלי

example 2: in her can never be: בתוך היא

but must always be: בתוכה

It is the same with every one of these joint words with both the preposition and the pronoun.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hava_Dorit

Ani_sofer: Thanks for the proper term for what I'm reaching for. I knew I forgot something: to explain that we don't speak that way.

I understand what you're saying. But we're trying to answer Tova's question, which seems to be: What was this declension before it became one? It's not that she's trying to speak that way (at least, I hope not), but, like any non-native Hebrew speaker learning Hebrew, she wants to know how to understand it fully. In order to do that, one must be able to break the declension down into its parts, at least for a second, for comprehension - until it becomes internalized.

Tova, does this make sense to you? Does this help? Or is your question a different one?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ani_sofer

ok, so in effect it is just the simple subjective form of the pronoun and the preposition that are being stuck together.

these pronoun forms are: אני, אנחנו, את, אתה, אתם, אתן, הוא, היא, הם, הן

however, you don't always see the direct relationship between these pronouns and the suffix that is attached to the preposition.

so the ending that is always added to a preposition relate to or equal the pronoun like this:

אני = י

אנחנו = נו

את = ךְ

אתה = ךָ

אתם = כם

אתן = כן

הוא = ו

היא = ה

הם = ם/הם

הן = ן/הן

With some of the prepositions, an extra yod may appear before the suffix letter(s).

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