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  5. "הסוס נוגע בךָ."

"הסוס נוגע בךָ."

Translation:The horse touches you.

July 6, 2016

32 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErranZimmermann

Any reason why it can't be הסוס נוגע אותך?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flootzavut

Yes, לגעת "takes" (must be used with) the preposition ב. In Hebrew, you touch "in" something. To watch לצפות also takes ב, as I recall, so not אני צופה את הטליוויזיה, but אני צופה בטלוויזיה.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hannah649004

Does it make any difference to the end of the sentence if there is no direct object? For example would "A horse touches you" still end with "בךָ" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flootzavut

No, it makes no difference, yes, it would be the same. The horse is the subject of the sentence, not the object, whether it is definite or not makes no difference. (Also, the object of the sentence here is a specific person; "you" is inherently definite.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/naomi535704

Could you also say "הסוס נוגע אתה" - is the בך necessary?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Walrosse

Yes it is. Also, you cannot use the word "את" without an object.

You just have to remember that the verb "לגעת" is followed by ב-something (It's like we're saying to touch in something).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bar_an

yes, בך is necessary here. First "את" will always be the subject of the sentence. Second, the literal translation of this sentence is "the horse touches in you". That's how this verbs works in Hebrew. You say "... touches in..."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jrp7sen

How does this horse touch "in" you?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cranberry.-.

Can you say, הסוס נוגע לך? Or אותך?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flootzavut

No. The verb לתת takes the preposition ב.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Cranberry.-.

Another q, Why בך? Doesnt that literally mean 'in you'?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tim5602

Yes. Look at Sarah's answer above


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HTIKVA

Lsat time I was in Israel never saw a horse!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

Well, we do have a bunch...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Michael112818

Why is the audio: "becha"? You is a direct object. It should be "bacha", no?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

No. "ba" is a contraction of b-ha (in-the). Here there would be no "ha", because it's a pronoun (you); we inflected the b- itself.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelJG7

How is נוגע pronounced in transliteration? Hearing the audio, I thought it was saying נגד, and was of course incorrect.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Nathan173901

Why does the Hebrew verb meaning "to touch" has to infinitive forms: לגעת (laga'at) and לנגוע (lingoa)?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

Actually it has three, ליגוע (but OK, that's a close variant of לנגוע, and I'm not sure it's considered standard; FWIW writing it seems strange, but I think it's often said).

I think it's just a quirk. לנגוע or ליגוע follow the normal pattern for this root (given it's initial נ), while לגעת follows a pattern of only a few verbs, generally not with an initial נ, but very common verbs. Apparently some speakers in ancient times drew a false analogy and it stuck. I can't see a reason why it happened here and not in other initial נ verbs. Maybe professional linguists do have a richer story, though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ParadoxSolver

so why cant you ended with אתה? in English, the horse touches in you, does not make any sense


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flootzavut

It's not a literal translation - see my posts above and below. You're assuming that because ב is translated "in" when talking about position, it always means that and should always be translated the same way, but languages don't work like that.

Incidentally, even if we are talking about a verb that doesn't take ב as it's preposition, אתה would still be wrong, because that's the form of the pronoun you use when "you" is the subject of the sentence. If it's the object of the sentence and the verb doesn't require a preposition (just takes a regular definite object), it will be אותך.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vykis92

This is Hebrew not English baby


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Corinnebelle

Does ב- also mean on and in this instances, the horse is touching on you is what it's really saying? On is pronounced differently to in.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SophiaTrou1

That is for a lady Erran


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mosheperlm

התרגום פה לאנגלית לוקה בחסר


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/nRSZxX8G

How can the horse touch in you? if ב is the in preposition, then the correct translation shouldn't be the horse leans on you?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/flootzavut

You're making the mistake of assuming there's a clear cut one-to-one relationship between Hebrew and English prepositions; there is not. In English, we put something in a bowl, we touch something (no preposition) and we watch TV (no preposition). In Hebrew, all of those actions require the preposition ב;

יש משהו בקערה
הסוס נוגע בך
אני צופה בטלוויזה

It's just the way the language works. There's no particular rule that a given preposition should match exactly between two languages.

To take an example or to from English, in British English, they write to someone, but in American English, they simply write someone. To British ears, writing someone sounds very weird - we write a letter or a book, not a person. But to American ears, the preposition isn't necessary. If we branch away from prepositions, take the word "tap" - for Americans, as far as I'm aware, the noun version would only mean what you call it if you briefly but sharply touch something: I gave him a tap on the shoulder. But in British English, it also means what Americans call a faucet.

And that's just two varieties of the same language!

With two languages, especially if they're not related, there's no guarantee whatsoever that a word that has a given array of meanings in English will have one equivalent with the exact same set of meanings in Hebrew. In fact, it's far more likely that they won't. This, incidentally, is one of the reasons automatic translation tends to be unreliable.

A reasonably good Hebrew/English example: In English, one plays sports and musical instruments, and acts in a play. In contrast, in Hebrew, to play sports and to act in a play use the same verb, לשחק, but to play an instrument is לנגן. The divisions between what verb applies to which situations isn't arbitrary, but it's not set in stone or the same between languages, either.

(For the most simple example, actually, look at the copula. In Hebrew, we say אני שרקן, אני אישה, אני מאנגליה. That doesn't mean that in standard English it's okay to say "I actor, I woman, I from England.)

TL;DR: The sooner you give up on the idea that any language is simply a set of words that corresponds exactly with the set of words and meanings in your own language, the less frustrating you will find language learning. Hebrew uses ב for watching and touching because that's how Hebrew works, and we translate it into English as a simple direct object because that's how English works.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Larry824711

תודה רבה I appreciate the clarity of your explanation. It's very helpful.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TeribleT

I can't imagine not using "writing to" someone. Are you sure about that? normally I would say you're wrong, but I started university in the U.K. and so it might be another carryover like certain spellings or dating day/month/year....


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Larry824711

It would sound normal to me (grew up in U.S.) to say "I am writing ..." without using "to", although saying "I am writing to..." would sound equally correct.

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