"עכביש או עכבר?"

Translation:A spider or a mouse?

July 10, 2016

38 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/FreeMediaKids

You essentially won the Internet.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/quesilliquae

Now, the word for mouse is forever sealed in my memory.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Skaseforever

Akhbar=Ackbar Ackbar=IT'S A TRAP!!!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eliana_danielle

Acaveesh = spider Achbar = mouse


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/8amdani

why can't be "rat"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Elias103541

There is a different word for "rat": עכברוש You don't call a dragonfly a moth, either, do you?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/8amdani

in urdu, persian, arabic, saraiki, punjabi, and pashto... the languages I know... there are usually only one word translation for both mouse and rat. and usually vice versa, yes there are more than one word for that type of creatures, but they are mostly considered as synonyms, maybe there are different explicit names for them in high circles of zoologists or lexicographers, but I am talking about daily usage of the word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

If other languages in the Middle East don't distinguish between a mouse and a rat, it doesn't mean that Hebrew doesn't, either. Besides עכברוש, rat can also be חולדה.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

Not just scientific. In everyday usage, people make very clear distinction between a mouse עכבר and a rat עכברוש.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/8amdani

is this distinction at daily usage level also? or just at some scientific bookish level only?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/angbagongquezon

A rat is very different from a mouse though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TAD308940

In Canada and most of Europe we would scream about a rat, but just maybe shiver about a mouse. These cultural attitudes more than linguistic roots may have shaped the separate naming in modern Hebrew?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lavinia.Eleanor

How do you pronounce עכברוש, please?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Marc383010

The head of the mice = rat


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

Head is ראש, not רוש.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Snommelp

Welp... listening exercises are going to force me to memorize which words have ע and which have א, since you can't hear the difference. Though I've heard tell that native speakers do, in fact, put a hint of vocalization on them. Is that true?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ani_sofer

For the most part they do not differentiate... but there are still some who do.


[deactivated user]

    I do. I'm no Mizrachi, but I do like historical authenticity :)


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

    akavísh o achbár?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/yossi0joe

    but כביש is highway


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lulubeck

    You're right. "הכביש," the highway, sounds a lot like "עכביש," spider.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hamutaltul

    what? no it's not! XD the letter ה' sounds a lot like the letter H. altough this days most of the Hebrew speakers don't pronounced ע' as it is ought to be pronounced, it's usually sounds like the letter א (that sounds a lot like a/e/i/u/o, depends on the Niqqud)..


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ran6996

    Mind that the letter ע will never stand as 'the', only ה


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Berachot79

    Great point! I knew that :P but for beginners it's good info! Todah!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sarah916878

    עכבר, בבקשה.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/quesilliquae

    Why the letter כ sounds differently in these two words?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Some_Teeth

    Same reason the internet can't agree on how to pronounce the word "gif" Both English and Hebrew have letters with varying pronunciations that don't have much logic to them. One has to just learn which is in which word. However, one thing no one else seems to have mentioned, is that, as a rule of thumb, כ is pronounced k when at the beginning of a syllable, but pronounced kh when it's at the end. Compare עכביש and עכבר. If you listen closely, their syllables are a-ka-vish and akh-bar, which has a subtle but relevant distinction: in "עכביש", the כ is the beginning of a syllable (ka), while in "עכבר", the כ is at the end (akh). There's unfortunately no way to tell what the syllables of a word are just by looking at it though, so while there is a rule to it, that rule wouldn't help you predict how to pronounce these words, which just requires practice and patience, but I hope it helps satisfy your curiosity! If you're on the mobile app, I highly recommend using the alphabet lessons (on the א button at the bottom of the screen) and reading all the advice and explanation it provides, it helped me a ton! בהצלחה! Good luck!


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Some_Teeth

    (Shoot, I'm still not used to posting in the forums, I didn't mean for it to all be on one line, sorry if that's hard to read


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tiny_Twinkletoes

    Is the hard k pronunciation of the כ in עכביש due to the י following the ב? Because I hear the כ as kh in עכבר . תודה in advance.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

    No, nothing to do with it. כ is sometimes pronounced as "k" and sometimes as "kh". There are certain rules when it changes its pronunciation, which are rather complex, but that's when it's the same root. In this case, these are two unrelated words, so the pronunciation is also arbitrary.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Berachot79

    if the "כ" is the first letter of the word, then it is most likely a hard K. just like ב ,פ...


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/8amdani

    but why not a "a rat"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/danny912421

    Because עכבר is a mouse, not a rat.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/8amdani

    what is a rat then?

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