"I am never outside."

Translation:Nem vagyok kint soha.

July 19, 2016

This discussion is locked.


I am getting very confused about word order here...


Exactly. Sometimes they seem like Japanese (SOV). Othertimes like english (SVO). Here, it sounds like XOXO. ❤❤❤??


soha nem itt vagy
nem vagyok kint soha

It just feels so random. But it does accept "soha nem kint vagyok" at least, so there's that.


Well, in Hungarian you have a relatively free word order with slight meaning modification effect of the position of the word. However, "soha nem kint vagyok" is not used therefore it should not be accepted at all. I recommend reporting the bug. "Soha nem vagyok kint" or "nem vagyok kint soha" are good solutions. You also can say "Kint nem vagyok soha" . Just pay attention that you negate "vagyok" not "kint".


I'm not sure that should be accepted at all... if it means anything, definitely different a different thing.


How about Soha nem kint vagyok?


"Nem vagyok kint soha" sound unnatural or at least forced to me. As a native speaker I would say "Soha nem vagyok kint."


Soha nem makes more sense to me-like the Polish nigdy nie (never not).


It works exactly like nigdy nie in polish. The example sentence is unnatural to a native speaker but still grammatically correct. Duo should concider the frequency of usage not just grammar.


Note: I would only use "Nem vagyok kint soha. " if I wanted to express my discomfort or frustration about never being outside.


It's correct, but I would expect it to continue. "Soha nem kint vagyok, hanem bent a szobában."


I take it the nem negates what's after, and in our case we need to negate the I am not, is that true?


"Soha nem kint vagyok, hanem bent a szobában." is not correct.


And why is that? I see nothing wrong with it.


"Nem kint vagyok, hanem bent (a szobában)." is perfectly well worded. It means "I am not outside, but in the room." (You principally negate the location.) But, you would never say "Soha nem kint vagyok, hanem bent (a szobában)." In this latter case, you are principally negating the time ("soha" means "never"). "nem kint" would introduce another principal negation in the sentence, "not outside". So, "Soha nem kint vagyok, hanem bent a szobában." would be translated to English as *"I am never not outside, but in the room." Which is also unnatural, isn"t it?


I guess... It makes sense the way you explained it, and I accept it as a reason to reject this translation. I can still see myself using this construction though, be it correct or not. "Soha nem az asztalra teszem a könyveket, hanem a polcra." "Soha nem a bátyámmal megyek sétálni, mindig csak a húgommal" etc.


We wouldn"t use "soha nem" with that word order in Hungarian, but rather "sohasem" or (contracted) "sosem". So: "Sohasem az asztalra teszem a könyveket, hanem a polcra." and "Sohasem a bátyámmal megyek sétálni, mindig csak a húgommal" are the proper form.


Since you asked for a link: An explanation in English: https://hungaryforyou.wordpress.com/2013/05/19/negation/ A detailed (and complicated) explanation in Hungarian: https://www.tankonyvtar.hu/en/tartalom/tamop425/2011_0001_536_MagyarNyelv/ch05s03.html


Thank you. I'll go through the second article when I have the time and I'll see if it convinces me that a sentence that feels natural to me is incorrect.


This is exactly how I put my answer!


"Soha nem kint vagyok." is not a correct word order.


As a native speaker, I would rather say "Sohasem vagyok kint." or even contracted "Sose vagyok kint." or "Sose vagyok kinn." (kint = kinn).


For anyone wondering: Duo's preferred translation is not unnatural nor unlikely either.


I wrote "sosem vagyok odakint", and it didn't accept. Duo still has much to learn about Hungarian.


What does the word "soha" represent?


So you essentially say "I am not never outside"? that does sound a bit weird to me tho


Okay, I'm gonna sort of flood this until you guys have to accept it. :D
In Hungarian (and in a couple of other languages, Romanian surely but I kinda think Slavic languages work similarly), "nothing", "noone", "never", "nowhere" aren't actual actors, things, times and locations. Quite the contrary - they are the lack of these things. Therefore, them being related to an action sounds like an oxymoron. They can only involve the lack of the action. The "not-action". Just like here. "Never" is not accepted as a time for being outside. The way to resolve this issue is to say what you do is not be outside never. :P


Great cognitive explanation! Thx. You definitely got my brain flushed :)

"(What I do is) not be outside ever." ...wow!!!


Yeah... not sure if these sentences are worth translating word by word. "ever" and "any-words" are much less commonly used in Hungarian (since you barely use them in negative sentences and they aren't the "first pick" in questions either).
"To happen never" versus "Not to happen never" is a bit like arguing whether parallel lines meet at infinity or don't.
Anyways, by saying "the idea that something can happen never sounds like an oxymoron in Hungarian", I had an easy time since that's just how it sounds to me... "never will come in 122 years, it's a very special event when former Duolingo users leave the house" :D It's almost as weird as asking "Where are you going?" and receiving "Tomorrow." as an answer.


Hungarian is not English. Double negatives are sometimes required.


can someone help me with "van" vs "vagyok"


"van" = it is, "vagyok" = I am


Van can also be used for ön or maga, which are the formal forma fir 'you'


I wrote, "Én soha vagyok kint." and I was marked wrong with the correct answer being, "Én sose vagyok kint." Is someone able to explain the difference between "sose" and "soha" so I can understand why this is?


Soha needa nem. Itbdoesmt stamd onigs own. Hungarian likes multiple negatives.


Wonder who is pedantically policing typing errors by down-voting? Must have a great life.


There is not such order in sentences in Hungarian as in English. You can make sentence in diferent orders and it is good.


I wrote "Én soha kint vagyok.", which was marked wrong with the right answer being "Én soha nem kint vagyok.". Could somebody explain why "nem" is needed here?


Double negative is usually required in Hungarian.


What kind of sentence structure is that?


word order: what should it be and why? There is no support in the tips here for this and I am getting a lot wrong for reasons I cannot understand. How is one supposed to learn?


It's not really the league of "tips". There is support and not little, though. Check out the forum, there are at least 4 articles about it. Probably more.


describes my life pretty well


Soha nem kint van?


"I" is first person singular, so "vagyok" is the appropriate form of "lenni".


"Sose nem" should be accepted


No, it shouldn't. "Sose" is the contraction of "soha nem".


What about "soha vaguok kint"?


It doesn't work, you have to make the sentence negative with soha.


Understandable, but not correct, as Márton pointed out.


The word order is very confusing. When you click on "Tips" for this lesson, there's no explanation of word order.


I'm not sure which lesson this is but I hit three lessons in a row (Places 1, V-1 Pres-S and Accusative respectively) that do talk about word order; let alone every second person under every second exercise forum.


én soha kint.... Why not?


There's no verb in that. Also "soha" requires another negative.


"Én soha vagyok kint" wasn't accepted but it literally means I am never outside. Is it that Hungarians just wouldn't say it like this grammatically? Or is it that the word 'nem' has to be included? Doesn't 'soha' mean never, negating the need for 'nem'?


Well, languages don't map "literally". I don't really get the difference between the choices you offered. Hungarians wouldn't say this grammatically AND 'nem' has to be included.

And no, in Hungarian, 'soha' doesn't negate the need for 'nem' - quite the contrary, it can only work with a negative sentence! It doesn't count as a "negative" by English terms, it requires a "negative". You may think of it as "never" not being an actual timestamp and hence it's paradoxical that things do happen "never". They can only not happen.


That makes sense. Now I get it that nem has to be included, soha and nem go together to mean never. I think that's what you're saying. Thank you for the explanation!

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