"The cat goes up onto the table, jumps over onto the bed and lies down onto the pillow."

Translation:A macska felmegy az asztalra, átugrik az ágyra, és a párnára fekszik.

July 19, 2016

15 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Evolita

Making these sentences more complicated won't teach people Hungarian. Quite the opposite! It will discourage people and they might give up. This one is 3 sentences squeezed into one. It's like a minefield. Feels like you expect people to mess up. Instead, like in the German and Italian courses, keep it simple and allow one or two simple mistakes to slide like a missing letter, correct it in the same time. To allow 3 mistakes in a 30 question test is way too strict.

July 19, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/TLB27957

I agree with you, Evolita. I'm not sure why the sentences in this course aren't simpler (in order to reinforce key basic concepts) and more useful (for those of us who find ourselves living in Hungary and wanting/needing to communicate with locals in a reasonable manner). It seems to me that the creators of the course put a lot of unnecessary effort into dreaming up overly clever sentences (in order to entertain themselves??) instead of doing their best to introduce well-intentioned English speakers to the interesting (and challenging) Hungarian language.

July 21, 2016

https://www.duolingo.com/morningtime

"a macska az asztalra felmegy, átugrik az ágyra és a párnára fekszik" is not correct? The word order is very difficult. Why is "a macska az asztalra felmegy" now wrong, but "a macska felmegy az asztalra" correct?

March 23, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Evolita

Good Morning, Morningtime! You got a good handle on the Hungarian language but the word order in the a.m. sentence is verb first: "felmegy" and then comes "az asztalra." Other than that your sentence was perfect!

May 18, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Andreas305

Although it is already ten months ago, that Evolita mentioned it, I just want to keep the responsibles in mind, that sentences with a length like this one are just awfull. Because it is not possible anymore to report a reason like "too long sentence" I have to take "the english sentence is unnatural".

May 18, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Biauwaz

Well I actually think that the purpose of this sentence is not to teach you a useful sentence, but to force you to do a mental excercise that helps you understand the meanings of cases and preverbs - after a few sentences like that, the regular sentences will be much easier for you, which is ultimately the goal.

Just as a reminder - non-native english speakers also have to do (at school or during language classes) a lot of seemingly stupid excercises, with neverending sentences that have multiple tenses squeezed in, many of which are not even used that much in modern coloquial english - but the purpose is to get a handle on these structures, and to be able to use them correclty later, in more natural situations.

That being said, I am aware that the course has some major issues, mostly requiring very specific translations where usually more than one would be possible.

August 6, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Andreas305

OK, if you have a look at the course English for German speaking people or vice versa, then you will maybe find one or two of those terrible long sentences, but not one single lesson only made up by sentences likes this.

August 7, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Biauwaz

But this sentence isn't even that terribly long :P You're whole comment is one sentence and it's much longer than the one in question :P The thing is, we would need a native hungarian speaker to determine whether the hungarian sentence sounds natural or not - the english one certainly doesn't but I suppose it was phrased that way to make the translation possible - I imagine in English you probably would just say "The cat goes/gets onto the table, jumps to the bed and lies down on the pillow", but as the course team mentioned - English is much less strict when it comes to descerning stative and active verbs - such phrasing would cause a lot of errors from the learners i.e. writing "párnán" instead of "párnára", which apparently is not an option in Hungarian.

Also - English and German are not an exemplary language pair, because they are so similar that most of the grammatical concepts in one are easily translatable to the another. Try Russian or Polish courses for English speakers - and not Duo, just regular courses - you'll find lots and lots of horrifyingly creative sentences with perfective vs. imperfective verbs :)

August 7, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Andreas305

English and German are similar?

Smile

English people have problems to understand the difference between the german verbs "reisen" and "verreisen". Hungarians get the meaning at once by using "utazni" and "elutazni". Same the Russians do with "е́хать" and "уе́хать".

And the Duolingo contributors? They became doubtful creative by using "to travel" and "to travel away".

In German you can put the object of a sentence at the beginning sentence in front of the verb; and it is possible in Hungarian as well as in Russian. In English that would be a no-go - accept for the case, your name would be Yoda ;-)

And now back to my original issue. If sentences are that long, the contributors have to accept all the possible constructions as correct. Just the first part of that sentence "A macska felmegy az asztalra..." can be done in at least TEN (10!) different ways without changing any word by a synonyme.

The second part "átugrik az ágyra" can have at least four forms - but instead of the preverb "át-" it is also correct and common to use "keresztül-". So you get eight forms.

The last part can be done in two ways.

And now combine them and you get 10 * 8 * 2 = 160 grammatical correct versions of that sentence above.

But mabye only a handful of them are accepted as correct.

August 8, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Biauwaz

Sure, there are some differences between German and English, but basically they are all minor, cosmetic issues and pretty much all phenomena that occur in one language have a pretty much direct counterpart in the other - maybe they are used slightly/completely different, maybe in one language it's present much more than in the other, but it's pretty much all the same.

Cases? - Sure, much more prominent in German, but also present in English in pronouns and saxon genitive. German word order voodoo? Same - much less present in English, but there is inversion in questions as well as stylistic inversion. Koniunktiv? English has a subjunctive. Verbs like verreisen, einladen, zuhoren - phrasal verbs in English (they are historically the same thing, just evolved in a different way).

My point is that learning pretty much any Indo-European language as a speaker of English (or pretty much any other I-E language) you are very unlikely to encounter a concept that is absolutely alien to you. (The notable exception would be us poor slavs that have nothing resembling neither articles nor a subjunctive, that pretty much everyone else around has) - all these languages are just very similar if you look close enough.

It's completely different thing with Hungarian though - things like different argument marking on verbs depending on definiteness of the object? Alien! Locative cases? Alien (though nothing really hard to wrap one's head around)! This ridiculous construction with demonstrative pronouns and repeating the postposisions (ez mellett a ház mellett)? I can't even. :P

About the terrible creativity with "to travel away" - well it's not perfect but as I said - the contributors had to somehow convey the information that is present in the Hungarian sentence and not in the English one. I think it's just the drawback of learning from a computer and not from a real teacher who could explain you stuff and just tell what they want you to translate without any unnecessary ambiguity. :P

August 8, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JzquelThom

I'm honestly considering to quit because of these last few exercices. "jumps over onto the bed"? Nobody ever said that anywhere. This is ridiculous, this is just making Hungarian a pain in the ass for no good reason.

June 20, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Evolita

Jzq: I totally agree! Why did you think I quit? The English these guys speak is from another universe...

June 20, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Feri62705

Igen! Eddig gondoltam hogy a magyar nyelv egy egészen más bolygó. De a mostonábal gondolom hogy a magyar nyelv egészen más világegyetem. Köszönöm

June 17, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Rka46820

Why this is not accepted? =>

"A macska felmegy az asztalra, átugrik az ágyra és lefekszik a párnara."

November 26, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Andreas305

It is correct. Just report it. But don't expect an answer within some weeks. I reduced my participation here maybe one year ago to a minimum after having sent hundreds of report with nearly no reaction. Now I get nearly every day a message, that Duolingo accepts the one suggested translation, which I can't remember anymore, when I have sent it :-D

November 27, 2018
Learn Hungarian in just 5 minutes a day. For free.