"גם אם אתה רוצֶה, זה לא משנֶה."

Translation:Even if you want, it does not matter.

July 25, 2016

33 Comments
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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Stethoskop

Another "why is this not possible?": "Even if you want to, it doesn't matter."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/5PFCBdoi

This is not a complete sentence. Even if you want - want what -


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AniOhevYayin

Yes, in English the verb "want" often takes an object, so the English at any rate sounds incomplete or stilted. It's interesting, however, that Hebrew can use רוצה without an object, as was the case in classical Hebrew where the verb could have the sense of "be pleased, find acceptable" (e.g., Ecc 9:7) and so could be used without an object. This exercise helps us see that Hebrew works differently from English with this verb. It's good idiomatic Hebrew even if a literal translation into English is not so great.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HTIKVA

Great,, however, how are we supposed to know the concept without a proper grammatical explanation? It becomes a game of dam if you do, dam if you don't.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Theresa754142

I think Duolingo has us learn Hebrew the way a child does: he doesn’t get proper grammatical explanations, but he makes mistakes, listens to those around him and adjusts accordingly.

So it’s good you’re on this forum listening to those around you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/will_do

Learning through 'failure' is often a very good way to learn. Figure out what you didn't know that caused the issue, and then keep on trucking.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Belteshazzar

If one needs to learn that Hebrew "works differently from English with this verb," the way to learn that is by making meaningful sentences with it, not by asking students to come up with meaningless gibberish English. That's not "literal translation," it's treating language like a bad substitution cipher. Translation, no matter how literal, isn't just a search-and-replace job.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hsn626796

Doesn't גם mean "also" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/radagastthebrown

Yes. But "even if" = גם אם or אפילו אם.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TRH_blue

Why can't this mean "even if you want [it to], that won't change"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/radagastthebrown

ll זה לא משנה is a fixed phrase. Also, זה לא משנה is present tense, so you'd have to say "even if you want, it doesn't change", which doesn't sound great in English, I think.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AndrewWhit512932

It doesn't sound good in English, no. But something like, "It doesn't change anything", or "it won't change anything" are idiomatic, and may be closer to the literal meaning of the Hebrew expression. But maybe it is just best to learn it as "it doesn't matter". Cheers,


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MaryJaneKe4

exactly what I think :) so long as I can figure out how our expressions are expressed in Hebrew I am good!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hadassah277241

I would translate also, as it doesn't change anything. Which to me, as a native American English speaker means the same thing as, it doesn't matter. However, Duo did not agree.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Theresa754142

‏גַּם אִם אַתָּה רוֹצֶה זֶה לֹא מְשַׁנֶּה

Gam im ata rotse, ze lo meshane.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hsn626796

Can it be "also if you want, it doesn't change" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_judith_531

exactly what I wrote , though rejected by DL


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_judith_531

...and i wrote it again this way , and it was rejected again.... what makes it awkward for an English native speaker : Also if you want it doesn't matter. !???


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Theresa754142

Even if you want, it does not matter is acceptable in English, though a little awkward. More natural is Even if you want it or Even if you want to, it doesn’t matter.

“Also if you want, it doesn’t matter” is not how it would be said in English, though it’s literally what the Hebrew says.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/_judith_531

Thank you very much , Theresa , for your very helpful explanation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mtuJ4U
  • 1250

Oof. What an awkward english sentence


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JudithMett2

Why is 'it makes no difference' not accepted for 'it does not matter'.Couldn't לא משנה mean that here?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

Sounds to me like it should be accepted.


[deactivated user]

    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/LisaBear78

    This incorrectly flags "doesn't" as wrong, correcting to "does not."


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ChaimLauer

    Would "Even if you want it will make no difference" make an incorrect translation?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

    Change it to the present tense ("it makes no difference"), and I think it should be accepted.


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BuddyCountryRock

    Can we also translate it to: "even if you want, it doesn't change"?


    https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

    Not really. If by "it doesn't change" you mean that the thing you point to stays the same, then in Hebrew it would be זה לא משתנה (note the additional ת, I imagine it's taught in some more advanced lesson).

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