"השטיח נמצא על הרצפה."

Translation:The carpet is on the floor.

July 26, 2016

17 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stanehr

i said "the carpet is found on the floor" - maybe a bit clumsy .... but is it incorrect?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlmogL

Sort of... if I had to translate "They look for the carpet... the carpet is found on the floor", I can't think of any other way to say it. But when I see השטיח נמצא על הרצפה in Hebrew I understand נמצא as simply "is".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamOlean

In this context, or lack thereof, I would understand the speaker simply to be identifying the location of the carpet, which reflects a static situation or stative idea. English has at least some (intransitive) uses of "[is] found" that closely approach this idea: "[such-and-such] is found [in such-and-such a place]". We could also use "[is] located" to express that an entity—at present time (or situation)—has a static, spatial position (i.e., situated [prototypically] somewhere in physical space in relation to other entities or things, such as, "on the floor"). Generally, as AlmogL suggested, English speakers would often just say that "[an entity] is [somewhere]" or that "[such-and-such] is [in such-and-such a place]".

The most important thing is to understand Hebrew-as-Hebrew: the actual meanings/ideas/conceptions that the language is used to convey in real communicative contexts and situations. Only then can we reasonably attempt to convey those same ideas in English. Grammar-translation methods can sometimes get us too focused on English translations rather than, or at least before, understanding the actual meanings conveyed by the language we're attempting to learn (similar to how children and native speakers learn their first languages, not having another language as a crutch to fall back on).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AdamOlean

I noticed that the third definition in Wiktionary's entry for נמצא has "to be present, to be located, to be situated", which is what AlmogL was getting at.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D7%A0%D7%9E%D7%A6%D7%90

Verb[edit] נִמְצָא • (nimtsá) (nif'al construction, active counterpart מָצָא‏)

  1. to be found

  2. to be discovered (clarification of this definition is being sought)

  3. to be present, to be located, to be situated ‏אתה נמצא כאן.‏‎ ― You are here.

  4. to turn out (become known or apparent)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hannahhlj

It's not incorrect, but נמצאת sounds much more natural in hebrew than is found does in english. I would suggest ommitting it and saying simply "the carpet is on the floor."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MaryJaneKe4

In hebrew are they talking about a "rug" that you can move around or "carpeting" which is nailed down and covers wall to wall?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tsuj1g1r1

Exactly! "Is found" in English implies a sense of permanence. Countries "are found" somewhere, because they never move (or at least we think of them in common usage as never moving). Rugs move, so aren't "found" anywhere.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YardenNB

I think it's correct, but in a different way than people here (including maybe you?) think. Not as another way to say what is the location of the carpet, but as the passive form of " finds the carpet on the floor" (after someone looked for the carpet). It seems like likely, though, than just talking about where the carpet is. Now נמצא can be either present or past tense, so maybe slightly more likely is to describe the result of a past search operation: "the carpet was found on the floor".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/2finalbriancells

what were you expecting, the roof?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Theresa754142

Ha-shatiakh nimtsa al ha-ritspa.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GabeGewurt

Can we drop the "נמצא" and simply say "השטיח על הרצפה" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cqer1

Why can't I say "the carpet is on the ground"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/radagastthebrown

At least in Hebrew there's a difference between רצפה (floor) which is inside a building and אדמה or קרקע (ground) which is outside (and usually unpaved).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/talyamay

Because the ground is typically referring to outside, where you wouldn't normally find a carpet, and because רצפה means floor not ground.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HTIKVA

The rug in on the floor should be accepted

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