"Az őznek a gidája ott fut az erdőben."

Translation:The roe deer's fawn is running there in the forest.

August 24, 2016

26 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JanTatouse

I highly doubt that these are useful words to learn in an early phase of language learning. I have no idea what a fawn is, and this is true for nearly all other baby animals. I speak four languages fluently, but only in my native language I would be able to recall that word, with difficulty. I don't know if it is because of my lack of interest in wild animals, but I have no idea why I should know this in Hungarian. The same is true for animal sounds. In Dutch which I use on everyday basis, I do not know any of those special words except for 'barking' and I'm fine. Therefore I believe that it is useless vocabulary on this level.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pedro771

You are absolutely right. Given the limited vocabulary in Duolingo courses there is no point of using such rare words. I have just checked the word "őz" is just the 18482th word, while "gida" is the 88227th word on the Hungarian word frequency list.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hulk014

I agree. The basic animal words like:

kutya - dog

macska - cat

kacsa - duck

ló - horse

szarvas - deer

disznó - pig

medve - bear

farkas - wolf

hal - fish

madár - bird

would be enough for beginners.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Judit294350

In 10 visits totalling about 15 months, I think I have actually seen more őz in Hungary than macska (about a dozen compared to one). Not that many ducks either - geese and hens but not ducks. The only szarvasok I have seen there were on a hunting reservation. No bears or wolves.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/faharanik

Szarvas and ló - very important and useful when shopping at Nagy vásárcsarnok. Szarvas és ló kolbász! (I highly recommend both by the way. :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Judit294350

Szamár szalámi is better than that made from lovak. :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Krisbaudi

I do not even know all these names in my mother language.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/woozlification

JanTatouse. I know what you mean, though in course terms it's late on. The Romanian course did words like "stallion" and "ox" almost from the start! However, from a former teacher's perspective, this is more than new vocabulary; it is revisiting grammar, vowel harmony and the use of suffixes, and we have to be able to apply them to unfamiliar words.

I suspect that it is checking the Hungarian letters, using nouns that produce a picture, (hopefully) in your mind. This animal section might be the answer to the problem: How can we practise this vowel and that one? That might mean finding a more unusual word, in the same way that anyone illustrating an English alphabet has to look around for an animal beginning with X or Q :) How many Hungarian words suitable for beginners start with the letter TY or Ő? We've had animals starting with both in this section.

Now, they could easily simply recycle dog and cat and bird or whatever endlessly, but we need to be able to deal with new words and to expand what we say and add colour to our conversation. The course creators are not lazy teachers- they never ever miss an opportunity to teach something else! They would never have let this section go without giving us new language, even if it doesn't match our interests. It's still vocab, and these things usually have some value, even if we have to wait to appreciate it.

There may be idioms and common metaphors that use some of these animal words. For example, in English, fawn is also a colour- a pale brown. To fawn is also a verb, though I'm not sure that bears any relation to deer! More vocabulary is overall a good thing. It gives you more to practise with.

Most courses teach in lexical sets- vocabulary groups- perhaps animals or jobs or ice cream flavours. As a course progresses, those chunks of language become increasingly specialised, so if Hungarian went on for perhaps treble the length, you would find sections that you related to more strongly than before, and those that seemed far less relevant. Give me a section on "Football" or "Art" or "Birds of Hungary" and remove any relating to "Fashion" and "Business" and I'll be happy and someone else will be annoyed :)

The perfect scenario is to have a DIY element to the course, with columns of vocabulary that you can pick and mix from and so practise the language you want to be able to use. That would let one person learn pig, cow and horse and stop at that, and another to go into the depths of lesser-spotted woodpeckers and antlions and lynx :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Judit294350

Roe deer are the small ones that jump out in front of your car in rural Hungary. The larger deer are less commonly seen (unless you go to a hunting park).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ion1122

smaller: roe deer = őz
larger: red deer or hart = gímszarvas or szarvas


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/richardkiss

The word for a female deer is "doe", not "roe".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Roe deer (Capreolus capreolus; őz) are not female deer (Cervus spp.; szarvas), though apparently some Hungarians think so. (As do some Germans, for that matter.)

The size (roe deer are smaller than "real" deer) may be an influence?

Roe deer are fairly common in Europe but don't seem to live elsewhere; perhaps that is why you are not familiar with them.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/richardkiss

Ah, I see. Yes, "roe" is not in common usage in North America.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Bastette54

"Roe" is more commonly known in the US as meaning fish eggs (maybe only certain kinds of fish, I'm not that familiar with it). More importantly, on a plate, "roe" is known as "caviar." :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raphi_K

No, it's not - Roe deer are a type of European deer.

Fun factoid: The deer in the tale of Bambi are roe deer. However, Disney changed them to mule deer as mule deer are present in the US, but roe deer are not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/joemagyarul

As a native speaker of American english, I have never even once in my life heard of a "roe" deer.

Maybe it is a common word in Europe, but it is very obscure here.

doe, a female deer is well known and fawn might be remembered with some difficulty.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ernierozsa

My Hungarian -English dictionary translates őz as deer or roe deer so both should be accepted


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raphi_K

Absolutely!

Also, if you just say "roe" - you generally are meaning fish eggs, unless you say "roe deer" (or the context is already different types of deer).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/woozlification

Raphi_K I agree. Roe on its own out of context wouldn't refer to deer at all, even if you are familiar with this type.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/woozlification

When I was growing up, (in the UK) we had wild roe deer in the wood behind our house. They were very shy. Even the males have only short horns. We also have fallow deer, with bigger horns and lots of spots, and in the north- Scotland, etc, red deer, which are much bigger. There are quite a few foreign species that live wild in the UK. Males may be called stags or harts. Females are called does, (like with rabbits).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Krisbaudi

Why is INTO the forest wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

Because it says "az erdőBEN" and not "az erdőBE".

So for the same reason that it would be wrong as a translation of "im Wald" -- "im Wald" is not the same as "in den Wald".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cattjm

I don't even know what a roe is and I'm a native english speaker and animal factoid master


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ion1122

As an 'animal factoid master', you will want to know this about 'deer':
1. The smaller European animal is known as the 'roe deer' or 'roe' (German 'Reh')
2. The larger animal is known as the 'red deer' or 'hart' (German 'Hirsch')
3. The North American animal usually called 'deer' is the 'white-tailed deer' or 'whitetail'. This species does not live in Europe.

Even in America, 'Hirsch' is sometimes seen as a family name (e.g., Judd Hirsch).

The original name of the American retail store 'Sears' was Sears, Roebuck and Co. The name 'Roebuck' refers to a male roe deer.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Judit294350

And a "hart" normally refers to a mature male (I spent a decade as a deer farmer here in NZ :-) )


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mizinamo

I'm guessing you may live in North America?

Roe deer are a Eurasian thing.

I wouldn't be surprised if most native English speakers from e.g. Europe or Australia wouldn't be familiar with some of the animals native to North America :)

Learn Hungarian in just 5 minutes a day. For free.