"Η ζακέτα και το μπουφάν."

Translation:The sweater and the jacket.

9/16/2016, 2:08:19 AM

21 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/Mark958555
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If "anorak" is correct for μπουφάν, then "coat" would be correct in American English, I would think. (I see an anorak as a very specific type of heavy coat, like an Eskimo would wear, and a totally different genus than a jacket…)

10/3/2016, 2:19:25 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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As you can see from the stream there are various views on names of clothing. You will also note that we made a serious effort to come to the most acceptable name for each item. In this case, we have used "short coat" for "μπουφάν" it is in the incubator as a correct translation. Hope that helps.

.

10/3/2016, 5:29:36 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/KatharinaM882088

I have problems to understand the difference between this different garments. English is not my native language. I tried google image search. As I understood: ζακέτα is used for a knitted jacket, μπουφάν for a sportiv jacket. Then there is the greek word σακάκι, which is a more formal jacket. But maybe I am all wrong!

3/25/2017, 9:57:09 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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Actually, you have described all these items very well. Yes, there is a problem because so many of the words resemble those in other languages but the items might be slightly different.

3/25/2017, 10:09:31 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/konix89

I put "The jacket and the coat" and it was counted as incorrect. From reading most of these comments it seems to me this should have been counted as correct. Just throwing it out there.

5/4/2017, 9:35:12 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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We have put more research into this sentence than a scientific experiment. It seems around the world these words are used for various items of clothing. Here is what we have:

for ζακέτα - [sweater/cardigan/jerkin/jacket/jumper]

for μπουφάν- [jacket/short coat/parka/anorak].

Note that we have "short coat" If you check out the images for μπουφάν on the net you'll see why here.

I'll also add that on the new tree which we are preparing this sentence will be "hat and gloves" or some other easily recognized items. :) Sorry, for the confusion.

5/4/2017, 10:15:31 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/cparticle
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As Greek American. To me it seems like the poverty of American English usage in this area is causing sweater to be included with ζακέτα. The tendency of any English dialect to use sweater for both a pullover and cardigan doesn't make a correct translation. It seems inherently wrong that "The sweater and the jacket." Should be accepted as a correct answer for"Η ζακέτα και το μπουφάν". I think only adds confusion to a person learning the language. This seems like a situation where less is more. Including sweater with πουλόβερ and cardigan with ζακέτα this avoids a situation where jacket wouldn't be used with ζακέτα. This might upset some people because there usage of sweater isn't exactly represented but sometimes when learning a new language there is not a one to one mapping. As this lesson is about learning Greek and not about English it feels like the English should be trimmed to match the Greek.

8/25/2017, 11:38:38 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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Surprisingly this skill has been one of the most difficult to create. Since so many words for clothes in Greek are loan words from other languages their meanings overlap. And since we tried to incorporate British English with the American we had a hard time coming up with definitions to suit all purposes.

As an American living in Greece for many years, I recognize that a "ζακέτα" is what we call a "sweater". It's a knit garment for the upper body with buttons or a zipper and is not a pullover. In a reply to another query on this subject, I specifically state that a "pullover" is "just that a knit garment without buttons that you pull over the head" (11 months ago). We do not accept "pullover or "pull over" as a correct translation for "ζακέτα". For that Greek has its own word "πουλόβερ". However, a recent search on google shows even "pullovers" as "sweaters" so we may have to rethink this.

In New York where I come from, a "sweater" is also called a "cardigan" so I accepted that as a translation for "ζακέτα".

I had questioned the use of "jacket" which sounds so much like "ζακέτα" because we also have "ζακάκη" in Greek to describe a "jacket" as for example in a suit but the google images for "ζακέτα" includes such items. So, if that is the Greek usage that is what we need to show. Our emphasis is on the learner understanding the Greek which is why we use so many English words to cover the meaning.

For further clarification please google "ζακέτα" and check out the images. These are what you'll find if you're shopping for such a garment. These are what we want the learners to recognize.

As for the use of American English which is the default language for Duo we are very careful to always use it as the primary definition for each word.

8/26/2017, 1:09:19 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/Kags
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Well, one silver lining: I've just worked out what to call an item of clothing that I bought in Corfu back in May. It's knitted, it's zipped and it has a hood. To my British English mind it's not a cardigan (knitted, but not usually zipped and/or hooded), it's not a hoody (usually fleecy or sweatshirt material) ... so obviously it must be a ζακέτα (particularly with Greek heritage!) and that will nicely avoid confusion with anything else I own!

8/26/2017, 6:59:06 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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I'd say you nailed it. Seriously, do that google image search. Almost anything worn on the upper body gets called a ζακέτα these days. Oh, and μπλούζα that's pretty much a man for all seasons. Thanks for the input and με γεια (wear it in good health) as we say in Greece.

8/26/2017, 8:46:13 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/JOrlando3
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A "pullover" does not need to be knit. You can have a sweater that is a knit pullover, but a sweatshirt can also be a pullover. It seems that the correct translation should be "cardigan." "Sweater" is too broad and can describe articles of clothing that ζακέτα does not describe. Googling ζακέτα shows cardigans, track jackets (like Duo's champagne tracksuit), zip up sweatshirts, and zip up fleeces.

3/18/2019, 2:31:20 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/lfd
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Why not ‘The jacket and the jumper.’?

9/16/2016, 2:08:19 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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The problem is in the definitions not only the dictionary but the colloquial and the British vs Amer. usage. I've just done a bit (a lot of) online searching and this is the simplest and clearest list I can give reflecting contemporary and international usage. Briefly:

  1. ζακέτα= sweater, jacket, cardigan
    2.μπουφάν = jacket, short coat, anorak, parka but not jumper because in BE it's knitted and without buttons and in AE a kind of dress.

All this will now be reflected in the drop down (hover) definitions. Of course, we don't want "The jacket and the jacket." So, "The sweater and the jacket." says it best. Hope this helps.

9/16/2016, 5:56:31 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/GeorgiosDC
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So, a sweater can have buttons as well? Because a ζακέτα (always) has buttons (it's a cardigan as I think of it, I just don't know if cardigan is both UK and US English and if yes, if there's a difference between the two). Otherwise it's a πουλόβερ. Or a καζάκα (sweater vest, again with no buttons).

9/16/2016, 9:09:53 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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What appeared at first to be a simple task turned out to be difficult considering the various terms for articles of clothing so using the net and a lot of images and I came up with many varieties. Then I emailed a British friend who gave good advice on what each item was called on that end and sent links to be viewed and, in the end, we decided this was the most general and authentic list. I won't be surprised if someone says: "Where I come from we ..." As I see it we've covered the two main English usages and are ok other items can be added if they fit.

A sweater and a cardigan are basically the same, a pullover is just what it says no buttons it goes over the head, kazaka and a jerkin are both sleeveless whereas the Greek garments we are translating have sleeves.

9/16/2016, 9:42:46 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/Kags
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I hate to start with "Where I come from ..." but in Britain a sweater and a cardigan are most definitely NOT the same. Sweater, pullover and jumper are the same ... knitted, and you put it on over your head. A cardigan is knitted and buttons down the front.

9/26/2016, 2:47:34 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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This was one of the most complex sentences we had to translate. And after much study and many changes and consultations with both AE and BE friends we've come to this conclusion. Not all things will be equal in all places, for example, the US a sweater is generic for a knitted top so it would include cardigan so it's not incorrect on a course which tries to cover as much native English as possible.

9/26/2016, 7:44:03 PM

https://www.duolingo.com/JOrlando3
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Perhaps your friends are not the best sources., This exercise translates incorrectly. Please fix it.

3/18/2019, 2:19:49 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/Atheia
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I'm glad I read this thread, the inclusion of sweater (aka jumper in BE) made me think ζακέτα meant any woolen/knitted garment and not just those that button up the front, I shall continue to translate it as cardigan so as not to confuse myself further (I kinda wish 'cardi' was an acceptable translation to save mouse clicks though hehe).

10/30/2018, 9:32:53 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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Good point ''cardi" is familiar enough to be included. Consider it done. Thanks.

10/30/2018, 11:20:01 AM

https://www.duolingo.com/JOrlando3
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It's not just where you come from - this is exactly what it means in all forms of English.

3/18/2019, 2:18:54 AM
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