"I live with my mother and my grandparents."
Translation:Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni.
340 CommentsThis discussion is locked.
If I leave the article at "madre", "padre", "fratello" etc. then why shouldn't I leave it at "nonni"?
Because it's plural; you wouldn't with "mia nonna e mio nonno", but an article is almost always needed for possessive plural pronouns.
Yes, well done duo for giving us a lesson with both a plural ownership and a single ownership (when discussing familial relationships) so we can talk about and see how the article is included in the plural and not in the singular.
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It would have been even better if there had been a lightbulb explaining it. I don't learn by guessing.
Agreed. The Italian lessons in Duo leave a lot to be desired in terms of guidance and tips.
I looked for the lightbulb too, and it wasn't there, and I think it should be since otherswise it's a guessing game, like you said :)
yeah but you learn by reading the comments. That is in fact how you learned this.
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Can you explain why "ed" cannot be used to precede "i miei nonni"? I reported it, 21 August 2019, but I'm not at all sure whether it's right or wrong. Thanks!
In actual spoken Italian, it appears the d is sometimes used, but according to the latest rules, it should not really be used just before any vowel, but rather only before another actual that will begin with the same letter (i.e ed e.... or ad a....) Of course, people are not always super strict even in their own language or grammar (and nor is DL), so the old overuse of putting the d in before any vowel still exists. This was explained to me by an Italian just last week, but it´s a bit above my pay grade and Italian level to verify, so I´m just accepting it. Hth.
According to my Italian friend, the "d" is added to break up strings of more than two vowels, so:
"i miei nonni" -> "e i miei nonni";
"io sono grande" -> "ed io sono grande"
It seems an arbitrary rule to me, but it is how it's done.
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But in Tuscany you would add 'la', so 'la mia madre' should be accepted... Classic Duolingo..!
I just answered "Io vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni" and it accepted it! I guess 'vivo' and 'abito' are interchangeable?! When is it better to use 'vivo' vs. 'abito' ? Thanks!
It was not accepted to day... but I confirm you may say either "io vivo" or "io abito"
I wrote this exact phrase but it marked it wrong. It stated Abito instead of vivo
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Yes, DL is a mess at times. Same thing happened to me. Yet in an earlier part of the same lesson, it had in Italian "Vivo com mia...." and the correct English translation was "I live with...". But now, when reversed and I write "Vivo com..." it's marked wrong and corrected as "Abito...". WHY?
Don't worry. Although there might be a subtle deference between them there's nothing wrong with using "vivo" here
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me too, having just demonstrated the same sentence, for translation into English, using vivo
One word is not enough: if you had submitted a report I could have told you why it was rejected.
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I just answered "Vivo con mi madre e i miei nonni." but was marked wrong because Duo insisted "Abito" is the only correct verb. This is not true since an earlier Italian-to-English translation quiz had the same Italian sentence I quoted! Reported it.
It's "mia", not "mi". Just because the default translation-phrase that Duolingo shows at the bottom after a fail uses particular phraseology, doesn't mean that that particular phraseology was the cause of the failure. The alternative would be for Duo to show a list of ALL possible correct translations (which... wouldn't be a bad idea, actually).
It probably didn't register "mi" as just being a typo in your case, because "mi" is a word of its own. Either way, your particular mistake had nothing to do with the use of abito vs. vivo.
I downvoted your reply with on emphasis on BS because Duo doesn't respond to anything.
I believe vivare can be used in a more general sense, while abitare is used more in reference to living in a specific place. So both work here.
also wrong for me, yet the reverse translation it gave vivo as the word to translate into English... makes no sense.
Vivo ,abito, question?? Is one a past tense of i live, as i lived or l have lived.? Or is one a future tense, as i will live? I have lived? Which is which?
I just answered vivo and it was not accepted. However earlier in the same lesson they used vivo for their own translation in the same sentence.
Seems to be a frequent DuoLingo "gotcha".
Supposedly the Italian course is totally staffed by volunteers (unless something has changed recently) and apparently, not as actively upgraded or reviewed as some other language offerings.
Just something to put up with as a downside of free language learning.
I have no idea for, according to the rule, singular relatives = no article, but plural relatives = article. Can someone clarify once more?
mamorim, see the link I posted above. It shows that for singular family relationships ... my mother, your husband, his grandfather ... the article is ommitted. For plural family relationships ... my grandparents, your brothers ... the article is used.
mia madre BUT i miei genitori
Singular relatives don't take the definite article: mia nonna ma i miei nonni.
There's not a rule that said: " If you got a vowel you add a (d) to (e), and it becomes "ed i miei nonni"?
The rule is called la d euphonica, and the agreement of its application seems to vary. Here's a good link
I think that the problem is "tua madre", while the given sentence says "my mother".
"vivo" is sort of like to be alive somewhere, whereas "abito" is like where you live (habitat)
I don't understand why there is an article used with "my grandparents" and not with "my mother." What is the rule?
Thanks for informing the variation of usage between singular and plural family members. Is there a grammar lesson for this on Duolingo? Or any grammar lessons?
Thanks, xyphax, for the link. I'm memorizing the rules that I didn't know or have forgotten over time away from Italian grammar.It's probably wise to use a standard Italian grammar with Duolingo.
"col" is a contraction of "con + il" (Similarly "coi" is a contraction of "con + i")
I'm sorry I still don't understand. I live with my mother and my grandparents.
<h1>1√ Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni.</h1> <h1>2 X Io vivo di mia madre ed i miei nonni.</h1>So I was half right, but not sure why duoLingo suggested the second was wrong. The article has a vowel "i" and I read "la d euphonica" stuff. Is the modifier the base noun "nonni" or the "miei" that don't have a vowel.
My guess is that the "vivo DI" is the incorrect part in the second sentence. As far as I know, the "ed, i, miei, and nonni" are all correct.
I know, they are so inconsistent. I think that "abito" refers to living in a particular situation or place. "Vivo" is more general.
Sometimes vivo sometimes abito. Be consistent or accept both answers
what is the difference betweern "abito con mia madre...." and "vivo con mia madre...." Both sentences were given and english translation was the same. ???
Earlier a similar sentence gave us "vivo" (which I thought strange) and now we are given "abito" (which would seem more correct in this sense). Are they interchangeable or is DL a bit slack?
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Duo should really accept both, but doesn't; they are fairly interchangeable in the real world in most contexts, and you could use either and people would know what you mean. Just use "Abito" when you get this question though.
i lived between italians and i can tell you duolingo is way more strict when it comes to language than they are. looks like it recognize that you are in good progress and than it keeps an eye one very e i o whatever is not even present on the keyboard. Good luck original speakers :)
i wrote "con" twice and i got it wrong....interesting...."Io vivo con mia madre e con i miei nonni "
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That's because the sentence wasn't "I live with my mother and WITH my grandparents" it was "I live with my mother and grandparents." Also, you would probably get marked off for using "con i" instead of the contraction "coi" but im not certain of that last point.
Think "I abide." It's an easy way to remember abitare. Of course, most U.S. English speakers never use the verb "to abide," but we do at least know it.
Is this something you just need to know, or are there any rules? I thought only words ending in 'a' was feminine. Is it because the word describes something feminine?
When the word describes something feminine (like "mother = madre", "wife = moglie"), then use feminine articles like "una" and "la".
Most of the time, feminine words end in "a" and masculine words end in "o". But as you saw above, there are also words that end in "e" and they can be both: feminine or masculine.
For such words ending in "e" you maybe can infer which article it must be from the word's context (e.g. a mother is a woman - so feminine) or you just have to know which article you need to use.
So for example: - "the tiger = la tigre" (feminine) - "the dessert = il dolce" (masculine)
Why could I not say Vivo instead of abito. My translate says Vivo is I live..... Can anyone explain? Grazie
I used it and it was accepted. I can never remember abito as that does mean a 'dress'.
I keep forgetting to use abito. What's the difference between vivo and arbito? Is it about dwelling or residing?
I always remember abito (abitare) as "habitat". My habitat is at X - I live at/in X, but that's just me, lol.
The lesson had the phrase "Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni' and its translation "I live with my mother and my grandparents". Now I used that sample but my answer haven't been accepted. Why the correct one is "Abito", but not "Vivo"? They teach one translation, but then you must guess which one is correct(((((
Why do they ask it one way in translate to English using vivo then when i translate from English to Italian they are using abito?
It's explained in the previous comments: the sentence is "with my mother and my grandparents," not "with my mother and with my grandparents."
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Is it possible to use the preposition DA instead of CON: "Abito da mia madre e i miei nonni."?
The grammar rule as I understand it is that you don't use the definite article with singular relatives like nonna or cugino but you do use it with plural relatives, like nonni or cugini.
last time i put abito and GOT IT WRONG, so this time i put vivo, AND GOT IT WRONG AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Probably a typing mistake. I experienced that quite a few times, that it marked something wrong I was SURE was correct in terms of the words I chose (and the order). Then when I had to do it again at the end of the round, I wrote the same and got it right. So yeah, most likely hit a wrong key somewhere that wasn't registered as a typo.
I wrote: Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni. Why is it incorrect? The answer given is: Abito con mia madre e i miei nonni.
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There is a difference between vivo and abito. Vivere is "to live" as in to have life in you, or to not be dead! Abito is to dwell, as in to live somewhere or with some-one.
Because it's a singular relative. Mia madre, i miei genitori. Mio fratello, i miei fratelli. Mia zia, le mie zie etc.
we have been taught that the definite article is not needed when referring to close relatives
This contradicts a previous exercise which translated ' He lives' as 'vive'
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I do not want a "Great!" or "Awsome!" or "Good job!" for every correct answer. A "Correct." is enough, together with Duo pepping now and then.
may I use wordings like this > abito i miei madre con nonni > because I speak about my mother and grandpas altogether?
Col = con il. So you wrote the equivalent of "con il i miei nonni." You can see that doesn't make sense. If the sentence to translate had been "with my mother and with my grandparents," perhaps "coi miei nonni" would have been correct, but now I'm speculating about a Duolingo answer, which is dangerous.
Because madre is a singular feminine noun. "I" is used with masculine plural nouns. Also, when referring to singular family members, the possessive pronoun is never used. You refer to your mother as mia madre, but your plural aunts as le mie zie.
They both can be used in this sentence. Report it. Here are some examples from DL exercises:
“Mio cugino vive a Genova”—->”My cousin lives in Genoa.”
“Abita con i suoi genitori.“—>“He lives with his parents.”
Italians do not use articles with the closest family members (if they talk about family themselves, but if you talk of someone's family then you should use an article : "Lui abita con la sua madre"
Very inconsistent will accept abito one time, vivo one time then another time it wll reject, very frustrating, I know that they want you to buy a course, annoying people is not how to sell your product.
When this phrase is in Italian, it is "vivo". When it is in English, it must be translated "abito". This makes it very confusing to learn without further explanation.
Abito or vivo, make up your mind, we've been taught to use vivo for life and abito for a residence. Well which is it?
It is not. Maybe you made another mistake? Next time copy/paste the whole sentence, otherwise we cannot help.
https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/191390?comment_id=26945092
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Abito and vivo seem to be interchangeable. Similar statements use either one. BUT whichever I choose is the wrong one - and is not given as 'another correct answer'. I change my choice of word to reflect the last Duolingo correction, and it's wrong again. Getting frustrated ...
Vivo means live as in "to be alive", whereas abito means "live" in the sense of residing in a location. They can usually both be used when referring to where you live, for example "Vivo a Venezia" and "Abito a Venezia" are both correct I think. I used vivo here and it was correct.
The exact same thing was written by duo in Italian for me to translate to English and it started with vivo not abbito. Now they want abbito instead of vivo. It's the exact same statement.
I used vivo here and it accepted it, perhaps you made another mistake? you might have left out the "i" in "i miei nonni".
I used abito instead of vivo and it was marked wrong. I thought that abitare was used for living in a place and vivere was the state of being alive, i.e. the opposite of morire. Confused.
Doesn't 'i" mean "the"? so wouldn't it be
I live with my mother and the my grandpartents
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Definite articles must precede possessive pronouns combined with nouns, the exception is singular close family member. "nonni" is plural, that´s why the article "i" is obligatory. (However, fidanzato/-a is not a close family member yet, so the article cannot be omitted.)
Why this time abito and not vivo - you do well to tread your scholar.
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I am first language English, so it makes sense to me that 'abito' should be the translation for 'living with' - ie 'inhabiting'. Vivo, in English is much more about living and breathing.
Interesting, but “Vivo a Roma” clearly means that my current residency is in Rome, nothing about breathing here.
“vivo” and “to live” have more than one meaning depending on the context.
In this DL sentence both verbs should work fine.
Vivere means "to live", not only "to be alive", but also "to spend a life [somewhere or with somebody]". Abitare means "to inhabit", not necessarily "to live with", you can dwell somewhere alone. Both verbs should be accepted here.
Abito a Roma. - my house/apartment is in Rome
Vivo a Roma. - ditto or I work and spend my free time in Rome, but my house/apartment is elsewhere (most likely nearby, e.g. in Fiumicino or Lido di Ostia); in this case I cannot say abito a Roma
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What can I say, Stefan and Nathan - you are both right!
But the little green owl wants what the little green owl wants. Sometimes you have to read its little green mind. And sometimes you just have to gnash your teeth at the unfairness of it all in the language of your choice.
Sometimes we have to ignore the owl. It gives us just some options, not all options. There is much more out there.
I thought in another lesson it said that Madre was formal and therefore did take the article. Where is Mama took Mia because it's intimate. I'm confused.
I don't understand why it is mia madre- without the article but i miei nonni - with the article.
The rule is that you use an article only with plural of your family members and you do not use it with your singular family members.
Then you are stressing "io"
it would be like saying "It is me who lives with my mother and my grandparents"
I did "Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni" and it didnt accept. Why vivo is correct isnt it? Cuz when u click on it it also showes on the suggestions as well
Why can't I say "vivo" instead of "abito"? It always marks wrong, but in the Italian-English translation it says Vivo...
It's not needed if the vowels are different, but required if the vowels are the same, e.g. ed Emilio, od Otranto, ad Ancona. https://italiantutornow.co.uk/what-are-ed-ad-and-od-in-italian/
Why it take "...i miei nonni" we don't say with "...my the grandparents"
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Check the tips for possessives:
https://www.duolingo.com/skill/it/Possessives/tips-and-notes
"il mio" and its various constructions based on gender and quantity = "my," except when referring to close family members in the singular
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The answer above is not the answer that it marked correct. There it says Vivo con mia madre etc. which is correct or are both correct?
Why cant we use vivo for live and not just abito? Other sources use a form of vivere
Ok .Have now read that if it is plural you put in article!!! When one only has Duolingo to work with and no teacher or grammar book
Actually you have to use article with “i miei nonni”
But you cannot use one with “Mia madre” (as it is a singular family member)
“i miei” not “mei” (you have a typo)
Plus for plural relatives you need the article i (or le in some cases)
Anti-intuitive.
Supposed to use "ed" instead of "e" when it comes before a word starting with a vowel. Here, that is marked wrong.
Never saw anything saying "ed" was only used before a word starting with "e". "Ed io" is a perefect example.
I'm sure there's some obscure "rule" that some Italian linguist can quote - but also sure that in real life Italian conversation, native Italian speakers get this wrong just as often as American native English speakers (especially in the South) use wrong words and wrong word forms and few people bother to correct them.
Whats the difference between ABITO AND VIVO? does it change the meaning?
I answered " Vivo con mia madre..." AND Duo says " vivo" is wrong but " abito" is the write word...
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The exercise right before this one had "Vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni", for me to translate to English. But this one did not accept "Vivo", and forced the verb "Abito".
Both exercises with the same phrase in English, but different (different verbs) in Italian.
Missing consistence in the phrases/translations...
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I entered: vivo con mio madre e i miei nonni. This was acceptable before. What's the difference?
Why abito and not vivo when duo used vivo in similar sentence two questions back?
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One time vivo is written by duolingo to translate into english; the later I have to translate " I live with...." and my answer of "vivo" is marked wrong! It should be that both answers are accepted, non the inconsistency of accepting an answer one time but not another!
why not 'con LA mia madre ...'? (and we have 'con >i< miei nonni' here). I'm quite confused with the articles - I don't understand why sometimes they're omitted.
Abitare and vivere both mean "to live," but abitare has the sense of dwelling somewhere or with someone, while vivere has the sense of being alive. Perhaps they can be used interchangeably in some cases, but "living with" implies cohabitation, for which abitare is the better choice. Regarding mia madre and i miei nonni, one doesn't use the definite article when describing a family member in the singular. If it's plural, such as nonni, or amended in some way (sorellina, for example, rather than sorella), the definite article is used. "Vado al cinema con mia madre, mio fratello, la mia sorellina, mia figlia, la mia figliastra e i miei nonni." It sounds complicated, but it's really not hard, once you get used to the idea.
why does it use "Mia Madre" then "I miei nonni" ? is it because the word grandparents is plural?
Check out my response of yesterday. It begins with the abitare/vivere question, but answers yours as well.
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Why "la mia madre" is marked wrong and it must be "mia madre" while for example in another sentence is "il tuo padre ha un leone"
With your own family members you don’t use articles (when they are singular), you use them only in plural:
mia madre
but:
i miei nonni
I got the plural and single right but wrong on live. I put vivo instead of abito and got it wrong. What is wrong with using vivo for I live?
Must I state what I do not understand about this?
I put: Abito con la mia madre e I miei nonni. But I guess that is wrong? Could someone please explain to me when to use the 'la' in 'la mia'?
Grazie e ciao
James, may I respectfully ask you to check the questions and responses before asking a question? I have personally responded to this question at least three times. Many, many others have done the same. Italian has rules about not using the personal pronoun before singular, unaltered titles of family members (by unaltered, I mean that you use mia sorella but la mia sorellina). Please, folks, read what others have taken the time to offer before asking yet again.
Vivo and abito both should work on this sentence. The hints even say this too!!
Could you help me please why "Abito" and not "Vivo"? What is the difference between them? Thank you!
-“vivere” means to live (also in a sense of being alive) with someone or some place, so it is more appropriate when talking about living with a girlfriend/boyfriend, a spouse or other family members, or long term in your own apartment/city.
But you can use abitare in this situations as well, if you want only to communicate the fact of occupying/sharing the place, but not the personal connection to the persons or place you live with/at.
-“abitare” means rather that you are occupying/sharing a place with no long term or emotional connection to it. So it works better for a short time situations like living at a hotel/dorm or talking about living with roommates.
I hope this helps
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Why is vivo con mia madre e miei nonni wrong? Especially when that was used earlier.? The same with, why was la sua nome e sulla domanda was considered wrong...and it wanted il suo...surely both are correct
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The first part of the sentence is correct, because mia madre is singular,bu miei nonni is plural, so it should be i miei nonni; the sentence would then be vivo con mia madre e i miei nonni!
talliagluc have answered the first part of your question. And here is a quote from DL tips:
“In Italian an article is almost always mandatory before a possessive. The exceptions are:
It's not used before close family members, in the singular and not modified, e.g. "mio padre" (my father), unless the possessive is "loro" (in which case the article is needed).”
When it comes to the second part of your question, it should be ”il suo nome” (as nome is a masculine noun).
“sulla domanda”? Hm, it depends what was the English sentence, because it is grammatically correct, but could be wrong as a translation.
So what was the original, English sentence for that?
Why when I write abito it says it should be vivo, whereas when I write vivo it says in should be abito. I MEAN IN THIS PARTICULAR SENTENCE.
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I tried being informal and was shot down. We have been told somewhere that the possessive was often implicit. So I boldly answered: "Vivo con la madre e i nonni." Duo insists on "la mia" and "i miei", but it still doesn't seem like a necessity to me.
What is wrong with my answer and why is it wrong?
For some reason we only use that with the third persons: vive or vivono would be fine, but for vivo it's just weird.
"Vivo con la mamma" is a valid sentence if spoken by a young child, at the age when their immediate family is their whole world (it would imply their parents are divorced or at least separated): it doesn't work with madre because that's already outside of child-speak.
Duo doesn’t insist on la mia as with singular family members we do not use articles.
It has to be mia madre and i miei nonni (as “nonni” is a plural noun for family members we use article with it)
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Thanks, but that's not what I was talking about. I didn't think mia and miei were necessary.
But that’s what you have said in your post.
In this case “mia” is necessary
But when you brush “your teeth” or break “your leg” you don’t use possessive in Italian in such cases, you simply say:
“i denti”
“la gamba”
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I thought I had seen cases of using just "la madre" or such. Must have been mistaken. OK, thanks.
In translation from Italian to English DL used Vivo, here DL used abbito. ? What is correct?
This is from DL tips:
In Italian an article is almost always mandatory before a possessive.
The exceptions are:
- It's not used before close family members, in the singular and not modified, e.g. "mio padre" (my father), unless the possessive is "loro" (in which case the article is needed).
- It's optional when the possessive adjective is alone following a form of "essere," e.g. "è mio" (it's mine).
- It's not used in a small number of set phrases, e.g. "casa mia" (my home).
"Io vivo...", and "Abito..." are accepted. "Vivo..." is not. Is this some obscure rule?
Why abito instead of vivo con mia madre? In an earlier exercise vivo con i miei genitori was correct
Although they're not 100% interchangeable, in this case it should have been an accepted answer.
If you're wondering when they are/aren't interchangeable, here's a really good forum of someone explaining that in detail:
https://www.quora.com/How-do-vivere-and-abitare-differ-from-each-other
But on another hand this is a comment by a native speaker:
https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/191390?comment_id=52003527
Because io is implied in the conjugated verb abitare so it is unnecessary to use it.
In some situation when you want to emphasize the subject you can use a personal pronoun but in general Italians just skip it.
Vivo com mia madre e i miei nonni . Why is vivere not acceptable as a synonim of abitare, like the dictionaries show?
It’s not because of that
Both of them works
You just don’t use “vivere” in this context in a 1st person:
https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/191390?comment_id=55421936
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It's uncler whether the post you're referring to is regarding the verb or the possessive. If it's regarding the verb, then I think it actually says you WOULD use "vivere" in 3rd person ('vive') but that it's weird to say in 1st person in this context. Either way, I think this is subjective though as my Florentine partner says "Vivo con mia madre è i miei nonni" is completely fine to say.
Generally "Vivere" and "Abitare" are interchangeable, and people would know what you mean either way, though context is still important; if you're talking about a physical house for example, you should use "abitare". To that effect though, Duo should probably cut a little slack with answers given here.
If I remember duolingo used "vivo" when they wanted us to type the english
Why when duo used "vivo" when asking us to type the English translation but when then say the same thing in English and as us to type in Italian they want "abito" and mark vivo as wrong
Should "abito con mia madre è con i miei nonni" really be marked as wrong
Why is Vivo not correct? In similar sentences vivo is the correct word.
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Live : can be abito or vivo. Do why do i get a red screen. If i press live they give me 2 possibility ....but if i use one you say it is wrong....
Well I'm not an Italian so i can't say for sure but in my house (which was pretty influenced by Italian culture) we used "bisnonni" for great-grandparents so the answer would be because these have a completely different meaning
Why does duolingo, in the same context, use vivo but then marks it wrong (instead of abito)
- First it looks like you have to use abito
This is an explanation why from a native speaker:
https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/191390?comment_id=52003527 - Also it has to be ”e” without an accent.
- And finally your sentence is missing the article ”i” before “nonni”
What are the lightbulbs? I've been on here for a month and still don't understand how to learn some of the finer grammatical points?