"They will have closed the bag then."
Translation:Sie werden die Tasche dann geschlossen haben.
Is "Dann werden sie die Tasche geschlossen haben" really wrong and, if so, why?
To stvwllms. - Thank you for this fine proposal ("Dann werden sie die Tasche geschlossen haben"). - I think your translation is excellent (and I assume it's the best word order here). By the way, DL accepted it. Great! (2018-07-02)
I think it is correct. I will make the claim it is and see whether Duo accepts it or not.
I wrote "dann werden sie ... “ and wasn't accepted. Can one start a sentence with Dann?
Before Duo was teaching "geschlossen sein", so why now "geschlossen haben"?
Ich habe die Tür geschlossen = Die Tür ist geschlossen.
aktiv und passiv.
Sie werden die Tür geschlossen sein. Sie werden die Tasche dann geschlossen haben. I did these sentences back to back. Why "sein" for one and "haben" for the other?
The vast majority of verbs take haben. Verbs that take sein have to be intransitive, i.e. they can't take an object, and they have to indicate a change of position or condition. sein (to be), bleiben (to stay), and passieren (to happen) take sein even though they don't indicate a change of position or condition.
I would say it's correct, but I am not a native German. Let's see if somebody reads. :)
Four year later - Duo still thinks it's wrong that way. I don't understand why.
damals means something like "back then" or "at that time (in the past)", so you can't use it here for a future date ("will").
Maybe it was "Die Tür wird geschlossen sein." my mistake , but is this the passive versus active?
Transitive vs. intransitive. "Haben" is used for most verbs (all transitive and some intransitive), and "sein" is used for certain intransitive verbs-- ones that show motion or some sort of change.
So "haben" for the transitive version and "sein" for the intransitive (since it shows, more or less, a movement or change from being open to being closed).
(By the way, if you need to remark on a previous comment you made, you should use the "Edit" button or at least "Reply" to that comment so that your new post is connected to your old one. :) )
okay, but closing a bag requires movement, so shouldn't this sentence end in "sein" instead of "haben"???
Again, all transitive verbs take "haben." The movement/change idea doesn't matter here because the verb is transitive.
apparently i cannot reply to your most recent post, Copernicus, so will have to respond to you here instead.
Every verb indicating movement will use "haben" if it is transitive? So a translation of, "I drove my car yesterday" must use haben because i've indicated the object that was being acted upon? If i didn't mention my car in that sentence, it would end in sein??
All transitive verbs take "haben"; for transitive verbs, motion doesn't matter at all. The motion only matters for intransitive verbs.
As for the car sentences, you've got the verbs right, but they wouldn't end in "haben/sein"; you'd have "Ich habe gestern mein Auto gefahren" and "Ich bin gestern gefahren."
i don't understand how to distinguish between transitive & intransitive verbs when i'm trying to formulate a thought & express it in German. i see no pattern & so i just keep getting it wrong over & over...
By definition, transitive just means that the verb has a direct object. If the sentence answers "What are they closing?" then the verb is transitive. Here, they're closing "the bag," so the closing is transitive.
If the sentence were "The bag will have closed then," there's nothing that the bag is closing; it's simply itself performing the action of closing. That would be intransitive.
ok so with Tür entweder Die Tür wird geschossen sein oder Sie werden die Tür geschlossen haben.
Sind beide Richtig??? Vielen dank
If you're just asking whether both of those are grammatical sentences, then yes, they are. If you're wanting to know something beyond that, I'm not sure how to answer since those are two totally different sentences.
DL said this when i got it wrong: You used the er/sie/es form "wird" instead of the sie/Sie form "werden". ; ok what it says "sie" twice so im guessing it should be correct , correct me if im wrong
The first sie means "she": sie wird = she will
The second sie means "they": sie werden = they will
Since the English sentence has "they will", you need sie werden and not sie wird.