1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: Greek
  4. >
  5. "Αυτό είναι το μήλο του οποίο…

"Αυτό είναι το μήλο του οποίου το χρώμα είναι κόκκινο."

Translation:This is the apple whose color is red.

December 10, 2016

18 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lyazko

"of which" = whose; and should be accepted, especially as "whose" suggests masculine/feminine in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Giorgio182480

Agree, "of which" would be better since it does not refer to a person.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

"whose" does not refer exclusively to people and can be correctly used for objects.

Using 'Whose' for Objects and Things | Merriam-Webster

https://www.merriam-webster.com › whose-used-for-inanimate-objects

"You Can Use 'Whose' for Things. Whose is the possessive version of the relative pronoun of who. Which and that, the relative pronouns for animals and objects do not have an equivalent so "whose" can be used here as well, such as in "the movie, whose name I can't remember."Jun 11, 2019"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ct1001

I understand that there are grammatical reasons for the sentences of this section, but I wonder whether other more natural ones can illustrate the same grammatical points. Here, "Αυτό είναι ένα κόκκινο μήλο." conveys the same information as the original sentence. On the other hand, "Peter, whose father is an engineer, wants to study medicine." is a more natural sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RaleighStarbuck

I definitely agree and I was about to post a similar comment. I am a native English speaker, and (in English at least) I would never say "This is the apple whose color is red." In English, the relative pronoun "whose" tends to only have human antecedents (or at the very least refer back to something animate). Instead, I would say "This is the apple that/which is red." I really like your example sentence where the pronoun "whose" fits much more naturally.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/teopap2

In Greek, though, του οποίου does not have to refer to human beings, it can refer to anything grammatically masculine or neuter.

Ο τουρισμός, του οποίου η συνεισφορά στο ΑΕΠ είναι σημαντική, αυξήθηκε τον τελευταίο χρόνο. (Tourism, whose contribution to the GDP is important, has increased in the last year).

Similarly, της οποίας can refer to anything feminine.

Η χώρα αυτή, της οποίας ο λαός υποφέρει... (This country, whose people is suffering...)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JuliaPrespa

True about the use of του οποίου in Greek but translating it into English, as the exercise asks you to do, presents problems, since RaleighStarbuck is quite right, we only use whose for people, not things. In this example, the correct translation is more like 'this is the apple which is red in colour', which isn't accepted - it's not particularly elegant English but it is right, unlike 'whose colour is red'. In your examples (which are very useful, thanks!) the translations would therefore include the phrases 'the contribution of which to GDP is important' and 'the people of which are suffering' - though, to be honest, when translating I would look for an alternative way of expressing it, since these are pretty clunky clauses :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Just to reassure myself that what I remembered was accurate. I referred to some reliable grammar books which you'll find:

here here and here

All of which show that "whose" is used with inanimate objects.

That doesn't mean that I don't find the sentence awkward and would prefer: "That is the apple that is red." But in these exercises it's always best to adhere to the sense of the source language.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JuliaPrespa

Fair enough! Technically it can be used it seems, though it really isn't common in the UK to use it this way (possibly more so in the US, I don't know). Thanks for the links, and I'll be following your advice about the source language from now on! :-)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

OK, here is the view of: https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/whose. :-) Not common but correct even in UK.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Very good. The authentic examples are appreciated. Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TinaMarga634648

Thank you very much for this discussion. As a non-English non-Greek speaker, I understand the language differences now much better. Apparently in Greek more words are used than in English to say the same.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Good for you taking on one foreign language through another foreign language.

Sometimes Greek needs more words but sometimes it doesn't.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Yes, this is not the most melodious sentence but it's trying to show the relative pronoun "του οποίου". This is better "Πέτρο, του οποίου ο πατέρας είναι ένας μηχανικός, θέλει να σπουδάσει ιατρική." I'll try to fit it in. Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ct1001

A minor adjustment to the sentence in question: "Ο Πέτρος, του οποίου ο πατέρας είναι μηχανικός, θέλει να σπουδάσει ιατρική." The indefinite article in front of μηχανικός is not necessary.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Languages127

So there is only one red apple?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cjbrewer

"this is the red apple."

... is probably the idiomatic English. Although I understand it's not literally what's been said in Greek


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Yes, that's the basic meaning of the sentence. But I'm sure you realize that what we are attempting to do is to show you the various means of expression in Greek and while neither the Greek nor the English is the most usual way of expressing the color of the apple it's what's necessary to give you the learner some other means of expression.

Another time, for another sentence you may find it useful...or so we hope.

Learn Greek in just 5 minutes a day. For free.