"La tartaruga non è certo nostra."

Translation:The turtle is certainly not ours.

February 15, 2013

43 Comments
This discussion is locked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gabor.kurdi

I would argue with this translation. The turtle is certainly not ours. Should be: La tartaruga certamente non è nostra. While: La tartaruga non è certo nostra. Should be: It's not sure that the turtle is ours.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/f.formica

I see what you mean, but in this case "certo" is used to strengthen the negation, even though it's not close to non; it delivers a "you certainly can't believe that" meaning, sometimes used sarcastically ("Non è mia" "Non è certo mia" - "It's not mine" "Well it can't be mine either"). It could also have been "non è affatto nostra", to the effect of a "no way it's like that". "It's not sure that the turtle is ours" would be "Non è certo che la tartaruga sia nostra".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Apprantice

Another issue ; why "nostra" is used instead of "la nostra"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/f.formica

When the possessive is in predicate position, i.e. subject+be+possessive, the article is optional; it has a subtle difference in meaning, "la nostra" is close to "our one" rather than a simple "ours", but in cases such as this it's basically the same.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GuerraAmanda

Formica is our hero


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KarenColle

I am ever so grateful for "Ant"!!♥


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/XlUi8bZ7

I agree. Thank you sooo much Formica.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/peggy582366

Then ot shouldn't be wrong


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MariaIramendy

Ciao Formica: could you please direct us, the people leaning here, to the rule which indicates that an adjective is use in Italian to strengthen a negation? As far as I know, it is an adverb that modifies the verb and not and adjective. Here the verb is è follow by an adjective certo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Antoine_cello

Thanks for your answer f.formica. How would you differiciate between not certain and certainly not?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/YonasNigussie

"The Ant Man" please follow me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KenPatters3

I'm confused. I thought certo meant sure, not certainly.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MariaIramendy

Ciao formica sei un maestro di lingua italiana?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/greenbajr

To Gabor: This is a big difference between Italian and English. The given translation is correct in spite of the word order. A word-by-word translation would be quite wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TanjaItaliana1

very good explanation, thanks :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HydraBianca

So how would you say "the turtle is not certainly ours" or as Gabor put it - "It's not sure that the turtle is ours" ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/mfgbkk

Same question that I have.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pogosticksteve

"Non è certo che la tartaruga sia nostra" (It would require the subjunctive tense of essere - sia. If you don't know what that means, you'll get to it later. Sentences with an inflection of doubt use a different tense in Italian, and in proper English grammar for that matter)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/coloraday

It's not a tense but a mood, I think.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/palocortado

correct. the subjunctive (or the conjunctive -- congiuntivo, as its known in italian) is a mood, and is in contrast to the indicative mood.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BookerPrizWinner

Perché il nostro può leggere.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Biggles1957

Why does it sound like "nostre"?? Misleading pronunciation!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/garbagehead

The readers have to better articulate their end vowels. This one doesn't sound like "a" at all more like "e".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/meitalian

The audio is awful. Tartaruga does not sounds right at all!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/drrockfish

I would also like to know why it is CERTO and not CERTA?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GidiZisk

By Collins, certo can be an adjective or a an adverb, as an adjective it changes by the gender of the subject, but as an adverb it doesn't. Here, as f.formica explained - it is an adverb - therefore it can only be certo, no matter what is the gender.

There is also an adverb 'certamente', but I don't know if the two are interchangeable fully, or depend by the context.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SAHMaMom

Certo is mostly used for certainly, of course, Surley...etc. certa would be used for certain, sure, somewhat..etc.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/brianl

Another example of the same tricky word order (from further down the tree).

https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/5698681

Non siete sicuramente in Italia. / You are certainly not in Italy.

It's tricky -- learn it! :)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Wira_basa

[QUESTION]

Is it also correct if we translate this sentence like this?

La tartaruga non è certo nostra. = The turtle isn't certainly ours.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bonbayel

It's very unusual word order for English. I can't even figure out how to write what it means. Something like "it's not certain that...", as in "Non é certo...". But this means "it's definitely not ours." (I came here because i didn't understsnd the Italuan word order. This is how i understand the meaning of the Italian.) We have to get used to the fact that different languages use different word order, and adverb placement is one of the really difficult things for English learners. (I used to be a teacher of English for foreigners.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PATRICKPIZ1

this english sentence is very common and clear to an english speaker. it is much more assertive than saying; "the turtle certainly is not ours' or " certainly, the turtle is not ours". it means that without a doubt, the turtle is not ours and the adverb placement strengthens that assertion. as you say; it's definitely not ours.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rondicostanzo

Why not "The turtle is not certainly ours"? This is the kind of chronic issue that will drive me (and others?) off Duolingo.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SofieJones798

My version is "definitely not ours" and it is wrong. I don't agree.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RichardWil528737

So - "the turtle is not definitely ours" was marked wrong. Is there a subtlety here about "not definitely" and "definitely not" that I haven't caught?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Elena92962

Duolingo needs to check word order in this sentence if it wants a clear translation. And by the way, is this my turtle or yours? I knew i should have bought mine in a different colour.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/GidiZisk

I read CivisRomanus comment here -> https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/23968768

He said "certo che"/"certo di" /"certamente" are also acceptable expressions (in general), can someone explain what is most appropriate here, and if "certo" alone is the most correct/spoken?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kapinny

I have looked up the translation of 'tortoise' and it appears to also be 'tartaruga'. But 'tortoise' was marked wrong. I agree that they are different animals, but how is one to know which is meant?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PhkcoBoJ

My hearing is bad, but on this audio, he says nostre, not nostra.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sailorsnook

He really does pronounce nostra as nostre.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paperino188645

just out of curiosity, why is this sentence wrong? "the turtle isn't certainly ours"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RichardWil528737

The two sentences have different meanings. The turtle isn't certainly ours -means - it might be ours, but we're not sure; The turtle is certainly not ours - means - the turtle definitely isn't ours. The Italian phrase carries the latter meaning.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KathrynSmi482342

I used 'the turtle definitely isn't ours' - incorrect.

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