https://www.duolingo.com/Luis

Immersion

LuisPlus
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Hi Everyone,

We have an exciting year ahead of us here at Duolingo. In addition to working on more social and interactive offerings such as Clubs and Chatbots, we are focused on making our core learning experience more personalized and effective than ever before.

To do so, we also have to make some very difficult choices, one of which is to retire our Immersion tool. We completely share the passion for collaborative translation and hope you understand that when evolving Duolingo, there are often tough (and potentially unpopular) decisions to be made on what to pursue in order to advance our mission. This is one of them. We simply don’t have the resources required to develop or maintain Immersion in a satisfactory way. Ultimately, we are committed to bringing the best learning experience to all Duolingo users, across all platforms and communities.

As we say goodbye to Immersion, I would like to thank you for your ongoing care and support. Even if you don’t agree with this decision, we truly appreciate each and every one of you and hope that you will enjoy the new features and improved experiences we are working hard to develop for you… デュオリンゴを使ってくれてありがとう!

1 year ago

1230 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/wombatua
wombatua
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Then goodbye and good luck, Duolingo. I have no use for you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/teachinjos
teachinjos
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I couldnt agree with you more, wombatua. The interaction with others in Immersion was the one real exciting factor about Duolingo. Now, that's gone, there is no need to stay. What is the sense in learning a language from scratch, only to be able to repeat it parrot-fashion, without the ability to interact with other learners ? Who wants the Clubs and Chatbots except the kids ?? Duolingo consisted of many seriously minded adults, who've now just been pushed aside. A sad, sad day. Lang-8 here I come !!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wombatua
wombatua
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As a 43-year-old adult who's trying to learn to read (not speak) German, immersion was all I was interested in (the other stuff is for laughs, really). This is turning into a high school class adjunct, and I don't care any more. I don't care about club, or chatbots, or friends (hundreds have friended me; I never return the favor - I don't care about that feature). Luis, your secretive, uncommunicative company no longer deserves my attention. Good riddance.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/1beppe
1beppe
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As a 78-year-old “adult” I completely agree with you Wombatua. By using Immersion I can now, yes now thanks to Immersion, read English, French and Spanish; and this is very important for me. Now someone will say that I can continue to read in those languages, but without my mistakes and the people (thank you so much!!) correcting me, it will never be the same thing.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/teachinjos
teachinjos
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Personally, I miss the friendships gained on Immersion. So, I'd like to take this opportunity to say farewell to Phil, Bernard, WendyMueller, Siegfried, Tico, Anitafunny, Irmgard, Pluto and all the others who worked with me. It was a true community, so rare these days. Goodbye my friends......

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/einkleinerVogel

I recommend German Quickly by April Wilson. It condenses the grammar for German 1 - 5 and provides great tips for reading fluency.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Beatles-Musician
Beatles-Musician
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Wow, you have an impressive streak

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/hoovco
hoovco
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Immersion is being replaced with clubs and chatbots? Those features are both terrible. Immersion was actually helpful and enjoyable. Way to go duolingo. Terrible decision. I worked tirelessly to move up in translation tiers, and you're removing that to cater to fads and terrible learning strategies.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JensBu
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So please remove the clubs and add Immersion again.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Bersalon
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How sad =(
I just wonder...what did Immersion have to go away to make room for? More apps that aren't even available for my PC (or any other non-iOS devices)?
Just want to say that Immersion helped me out WAY more in German than I think TinyCards or DuoBots ever could. I wish it didn't have to come to this.
Ruhe in Frieden, Immersion

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ECS9JD

I know, they need to make the "new" updates and things available to other comptuters and phones, because not everyone had IOS and can access these "awesome" new tools that replace all the social interaction.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Usagiboy7
Usagiboy7
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It is hard to read that Immersion is leaving us. I know that some staff members really loved this feature, as did many, many of our moderator and general community members. RIP Immersion, your absence brings a lot of grief. :'(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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Thx for the update Luis!

And more importantly for having finally taken an official and public decision(*) about Immersion:
we've been waiting for too long for that decision and for this never-ending "A/B test" to stop.


(*) between giving it (back) to everyone and putting it totally down.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SussexSoleil

I’m feeling a little sorry for a few die-hard translators – all long-retired I would have to guess, given the amount of time they must spend on here every day. They have been working the Immersion system for years and built up some massive Translation Tier scores; well into the hundreds.

Will Duolingo be offering free rehabilitation and counselling for those affected by this sudden withdrawal of their daily brain stimulus?

Seriously, I can see depression setting in. What alternatives can you offer them? Or is there no hope for those addicted to Immersion?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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See you under the clock at Victoria :-)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SussexSoleil

Hi Ifphigenia! (All - Please excuse us while we bid our farewells, since the Activity stream is down! - We'll tidy up before turning out the lights.)

It's pretty much the end for me I'm afraid. Immersion was the only part of Duolingo where I learnt anything new. And if you could meet me under the clock at Haymarket, you will have a lot more chance on seeing me there at the moment. I'm travelling every week to Bonnie Scotland, which is why I've had little time for Duo in any event.

My very best wishes to you and I hope by some miracle we can have our Brief Encounter :-)

Oh, nearly forgot. Would you like 1,200 more Lingots?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Hi, I think that's true for an awful lot of us but apparently we aren't in the right demographic, ie at school!

I will try to get to Haymarket instead then ..... You never know, we might manage our Brief Encounter one day :-)

Thanks but no thanks for the lingots, can I interest you in a little over 4000 of them? Or ...... do you think we could trade them on eBay?

I wish you all the very best too my friend, maybe one day we might actually meet up in real life, in any event, it had been good knowing you and I will always be grateful for your help and encouragement when I was at my lowest point.

Au revoir et bonne chance! :-))

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daveSp
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Very sad about Immersion. It was the only reason I used Duolingo. I guess this means that today is my last day on Duolingo. I hope that somebody recognizes that there was a real market niche in the Immersion feature for advanced users and starts up an alternate web site that brings it back in some form. A real pity. I really felt that I had made progress via Immersion. Goodbye, all.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/blueeyedbookworm

You can tell your family is language-loving when your sister greets the news with "2016 was bad and 2017 starts even worse with this!" and you spend 15 minutes staring blankly at the screen when you read the words "retire Immersion". I really enjoyed Immersion and translating documents and finding just the right words in English to express what was said in Italian and interacting and getting inspiration from other users. Well, I'll have to find other translating opportunities and will keep using Duolingo to learn vocab. But I am sad.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mpbraendle
mpbraendlePlus
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Looks like you are betraying your own principles: https://www.ted.com/talks/luis_von_ahn_massive_scale_online_collaboration

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SussexSoleil

Yup.

However you look at it, Duolingo was a failed experimental research project that thousands of unpaid volunteers wasted their time on. All based on a promise that we would be doing something worthwhile to help bring knowledge to the poor.

At least that was true in the early days, until we realised that nothing we translated was being reposted to the Internet.

(Entertaining presentation though - could probably sell snow to the Eskimos.)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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And right now, don't you feel a little like an Eskimo with a new delivery of snow?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SussexSoleil

Yes, only it has strange yellow streaks running through it.

Notice someone has been through here and blitzed the down vote button on all your posts? Just like the good old days ... .

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Yup! As you say. The downvote trigger happy don't seem too keen on you either. Exactly like the good old days ....

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Aria487
Aria487
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Principles can change. This means either betrayal, or greater good. I trust Duolingo's going for the greater good, although I don't see how. Yet.

Besides, I don't see how you'd conclude that. The original plan was to translate the web (edit: I'm mistaken here. See scilling's note below), and the only directly-stated principle I see in that talk is "Fair business model for education". Duolingo is still free, and I don't think it's unfair.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
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The original plan was to test the hypothesis that is found in the abstract here.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mpbraendle
mpbraendlePlus
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Maybe I was harsh - I rather see it now as a business idea that failed because of wrong assumptions. As many business ideas do.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/carloxavier

the original principle is probably against some legal points.. is not that easy to make accessible to anybody sharing of copyrighted content, there's a big flaw unfortunately :(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/itastudent
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Immersion on Duolingo was a tool that was absolutely super and unique to learn a language. You could have learned a lot of words and expression by translating real word sentences on topics you like, getting help by the inline dictionary, and getting feedback from the other users. Its graphical interface made easy to compare the translation with the original article and to check and spot mistakes. And it was unique since I haven't seen anywhere a tool like that, really addictive for many people, who really learned a lot by translating articles.

This fantastic tool no longer exists.

It is going to be replaced by TinyCards (and there are already websites providing something similar), Clubs (which I don't think are so useful to learn) and Chatbots (which I strongly doubt may have the same power to teach languages).

I personally think that the Immersion, even if no longer really fits with the way Duolingo is changing, could have at least deserved to be a separate app or website. Also, since it's unique and very useful, many people would be, in my opinion, even available to pay for it.

I don't understand why Duolingo tries to provide new tools by dismissing some valid ones that are already available.

I hope the immersion will come back... it definitely should!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
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I totally agree with you, Itastudent! I hope this idea will be taken into consideration.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BarbaraMorris
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About an option to pay for it, I think it would also have to be somewhat promoted to all Duolingo users to make it viable.

Something like this:

  • Duolingo creates a Kickstarter or Patreon or gofundme thing so they can get some initial funding to add back Immersion as a pay-for-use feature, and maybe to add support for the mobile version of Duolingo. They send an email to everyone who participated in Immersion in the past say year letting them know about the proposal.

  • Duolingo adds back Immersion as pay-for-use

  • When someone reaches some medium level in the tree, Duolingo adds the Immersion tab and when people complete a lesson or a section, it prompts people to try Immersion (maybe a specific popular article like it used to).

  • People get to try it for say 25 sessions for free, so that new people will find it and hopefully some will like it

  • After the free trial period, people have to pay to continue using it

  • Don't give XP, and drop translation tiers. That should keep the silly folks away.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wallysou
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@Luis,

let me tell you something, please.

I know this decision is hard. If I could put me in your shoes I would, I can just think, I'd feel the weight of this sad choice.

And I am so grateful for the time I learned so much here. I can clearly track my learning since I started to use Duolingo and this changed my life in so many ways.

And, I see, I didn't anything for Duolingo except use it so hard, share it with others and make a review in the Google Play Store. I know. It's nothing. I never put money in Doulingo. Indeed, I did not know how to, IF Doulingo needed it and if my little piece of money could really change anything.

I suspect it did not.

So, Luis, I have so many to thank you for those years so grateful and plenty of learning. You know (if you didn't, please be aware now) I'm Brazilian. In Brazil, we have so many English schools that I can't enumerate them.

But, these real schools aren't doing a good work. Most of them take the students, take their money, take their time and, after some months and years, let them go without the basic skills to engage a conversation in English.

But not only this: they put the shame in the students for this awkward thing. I'm not kidding. I'd like being joking but I'm not.

Please don't understand this statement I am not sad with your decision. I am. I am a LOT. But I must understand you. I have to. I don't pay you for this. Maybe I had to. You opened the doors of the world to me in several ways.

I don't know if is possible. Really, I don't. But if I can make a suggestion to you, let me do it:

Can you put the articles that have had 100% translated for the view? Only the view, not edition. There are so many interesting and important things there. If we just could get them for consult our loss was minor.

Please, Luis, think about it with a caring eye.

So, Luis, said this, said all this, I'd like to thank you in a very sincere way. My first feeling was to write something almost despicable. Really. But I regain my mind and now I am writing not what I wanted but what I must.

Maybe you won't read this. Maybe yes. If you read this please take note I am not a native English speaker, so you may find several errors here. These are all my fault, I own it. But if you read and can understand the most of this, thank yourself because I got it with Duolingo.

Duolingo is dead. Long live Duolingo!

I don't know if I will stay, maybe yes maybe not. But I'll never forget Duolingo. I couldn't. I am what I am - a better person since I arrived here - because of Duolingo.

Thank you, Luis. Thank you so much for invest your money to make me a better person.

May God bless you. In the name of so many like me around the world, thank you.

Wallace. Brazil, jan 20, 2017.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/hughcparker
hughcparker
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Thanks for the "news" :)

Your post ends with a passage of Japanese - should we take that as a hint?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/WildSage
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I'm trying not to hope for that as all to often hopes have been dashed on here by signs and outright posts. (Native American languages being one)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SenorDustin
SenorDustin
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After that "glitch" last week, I would gladly give up Immersion for Japanese.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/garpike
garpike
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It appears only to say 'thank you for using Duolingo'.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/spelaeus
spelaeus
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I thought it said 'sod you, the committed Immersion community'.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
Francevw
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Hi Spelaeus, we are here for the moment: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474 Please let's keep in touch!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ProDuoExtra
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...we are working hard to develop for you...Thank you for using Duo apple !

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PotatoSanta
PotatoSanta
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Did you use google translate? Lingo and ringo(apple) are both written リンゴ

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/moeka518
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I remember when my friend told me that Google translates 黒バス (KnB/KuroBasu) to black bus... I know it's not a good time to laugh, but still, this translation of デュオリンゴ made me laugh XD

Thank you for posting this!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/garpike
garpike
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I am presuming that 'Duoringo' is a transliteration and nothing to do with apples!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PotatoSanta
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I think we deserve a new language in the incubator after hearing this

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Amanesse77
Amanesse77
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Japanese for English speakers is now in the incubator

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/aanaaaa
aanaaaa
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For you that love Immersion, maybe this website can help you : http://lang-8.com/

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
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Thanks, I just did the video tour and it certainly sounds promising.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Luscinda
Luscinda
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It sounds like we need a place for everyone to find each other again. Anyone feel competent to set up a site and give us all the link?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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I only wish I had the know-how I'd do it myself, fingers crossed that someone among us both has and does.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Luscinda
Luscinda
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I bet someone knows what they are doing with proboards, which has private messages for contact detail swaps, and that would be a start.

Though as I've pointed out elsewhere, the state of the activity stream etc at the moment means it's much easier to post discreet messages to your friends here than previously, should anyone feel the need.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JoThelan
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That's along the lines of what I've been thinking. Create some kind forum for community and add on Google Docs for group translation work. The good thing about Google Docs is that you have added to the document, can't just automatically join, which would hinder Immersion scam artists from ruining other people's work. Anyone up for making this happen?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Yes, I am :-))

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JoThelan
JoThelanPlus
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Here, take a look at this: https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474 :·)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/hattieeee

You guys should try http://lang-8.com/ :) But yeah - that google docs idea sounds awesome! I'm up for that:D

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jaye16
jaye16
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What "google docs" please let me in on it. I just did the video tour for lang-8 and it sounds promising. But I'd like to look into other courses. Thank you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Dear Luis, I must say this is the saddest decision Duolingo could ever take. There is nothing similar and valuable as Immersion. There is nothing more I can say about such an impressive tool. It was the heart of your dream when creating Duolingo and I shared your dream. For more than two years thousands of learners have shared your dream. We have worked on a daily basis to help to achieve it. Now all is gone. We have been left alone outside: Duolingo is slamming the door before us.

I know there is nothing we could say or do to make Duolingo consider it twice. I just want to ask if you are going to create an access to the Immersion texts so that we can download our translation work in those years?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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You mean that all the translated texts have vanished? WOW. Way to show people their efforts are not valued!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Well, I heard no word made on that issue, anyway. I (and many other users) have been working in a great number of Wikipedia articles with the goal to provide a good translation and publish them back into other Wikipedia languages.

And now, right when Wikipedia is doing its best to improve their translation tool to make it easier to contribute...

A huge amount of translated articles are just sitting there, in the closed Immersion section. It is really sad even to think about it.

I would be really grateful if Duolingo could provide any kind of answer to this question.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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That hurts. And is a denial of everything Duolingo claimed that it stood for, in terms of its goal of opening the information on the Internet to all. I really hope you are able to retrieve the work so many people have put into this.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Thanks a lot, DaughterofAlbion! I feel I would never succeed to express how deeply sad this announcement and, especially, the way it has been made makes me feel.

Although all of us were expecting it, I wouldn't have ever dared to imagine we won't be given even the chance to access our work again. Somehow, I expected a bit more of respect from Duolingo with its users, letting them to adapt to this situation... a previous announcement... a time of "grace". But we only learnt about it by whispering among users in the forum and across the activity roll. Never an official word about this. As it has been announced, Luis words sound as a slamming door on the face of a huge amount of Duo users.

I am not judging the reasons that have lead to this announcement, I can cope with it, but I want to express my deep sorrow because I now know how little we users counted and how wrong we were when thinking we were contributing to make something good.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/edouardchapeaux

Hi Sandy ! I totally agree with you, hours and hours of our lives, passion and love to languages and cultures, has been swept in a second. I was also expecting something like this, too much failures, and I also imagined that sponsorship was a big failure. Why not crowdfund Duolingo ?? just a dollar would have meant monthly millions of dollars, why not to ask for a payment each time a new article was input to be translated? But the worst for me, is that this tool was not only to learn languages, but also to socialize, to get friends, etc, etc. Those networks were broken in a minute, that is the saddest part of it. Anyway, thank you for everything Sandy, it was great while it was alive. I do not regret a single minute of my life translating so much good stuff. The best for you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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They have vanished, I had a huge number of them bookmarked and every one of them now returns 404!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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I know :(( I want to seize the chance to say BIG THANKS to all the collaborators and friends I have had the honor to meet during these years working on that great tool Immersion was. Gena, I hope we will keep contact somehow. Edouard, thanks for your kind words (by the way, I am Ana ;)) ). It has been a pleasure to me to share that awful amount of translating hours, too :))

I will wait for the Activity Roll to be back to try to say goodbye to all the incredible, nice, helpful, eager-to-work people I have crossed here. I hope I will not miss anyone, but they have been really so many.

And thanks, Duolingo. You came right in the middle of a terrible moment in my life and you helped me to overcome it in the best of the ways. I am really thankful for that. I wish you the best of luck.

(Edited to answer Boot2 reply: It was a real pleasure, Boot2, you were a nice collaborator and always eager to learn. I hope to meet you if such a good thing as a new Immersion "flowers" somewhere ! :) )

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/boot2
boot2
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I would like to thank you too and many others who patiently corrected my mistakes. Fare well and who knows, perhaps a new Immersion-phoenix will rise?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/edouardchapeaux

Sorry for my confusion, Ana, it was also my great pleasure to work with you an find good people that makes life easier and great. Duo came into my life at the moment I retired from work, and gave me a new virtual team, Adriana, Caro&Abuelo, Patricia, and so much more !! As I said, I do not regret a single minute dedicated to it.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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I hope that we will stay in contact too Ana :-))

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/quantifier
quantifier
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  • .... .- -. -.- / -.-- --- ..- / .- -. .- .-.-.- / .. / .-- .. .-.. .-.. / -- .. ... ... / -.-- --- ..- / ... --- / -- ..- -.-. .... .-.-.- / --.-
1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wideOlance

Goodbye W-cephei, JSstudent, John Haug, Splushkin, AnaArias19, Magalie48, and many others who helped me with translations! It was challenging and fun.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Splushkin
Splushkin
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It was a pleasure to work with you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Libertad54
Libertad54
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The same, Splushkin

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/20ckernaghan

Go Trump!!!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/johnhaug
johnhaug
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I have a good feeling we will all see each other again one day soon. Good luck & thanks for your help too.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Libertad54
Libertad54
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Hi John. Thank you for all your help improving my English. Hope you are right and we will meet again soon.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GarryCope
GarryCope
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Hi John, Thanks for all your help with my Spanish. It's not looking good, imho, for Duo. At least for us "old codgers" who loved it for the basics. And, as I am sure you are aware, I am no where near to being a "pre-teen" or "teen" :O) . For now I will hang my hat on your (good feeling) sense that there will be a place to continue immersion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/20ckernaghan

Go Trump!!!!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lindafraser
lindafraser
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It was indeed a pleasure to work with everyone, translating the wonderful articles that W-cephei found for us. I have learned so much from all of you and enjoyed the journey as well. I hope that, like John says, we can meet again some day soon. Thank you everybody and let's hope for that sunny day.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Magalie48

Goodbye wideOlance, W-cephei, JSstudent, John Haug, Splushkin, AnaArias19 and many others. I hope, from the bottom of my heart, we will see each other again on DL or somewhere else.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/carme2222
carme2222
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Best wishes for all the colleagues of duolingo hoping we could meet again soon

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Libertad54
Libertad54
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Hope the same. We will find a place and a method. See you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/20ckernaghan

Go Trump!!!!!!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/20ckernaghan

Go Trump!!!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lorel90
Lorel90
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I am profoundly saddened.

Luis I do not think you will read this, but anyway: you understand well the concept of Super Fans (Seth Godin and Tim Ferris), the problem with this decision is that you are saying Adios to many Super Fans, to people who really love Duolingo and promote it madly. You are saying adios to your most devoted users and fans.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Luis
LuisPlus
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[X-Post from another thread] Thank you very much for taking the time to write to us about this, and thank you to everybody who used a polite tone :) The decision to remove Immersion was not an easy one, but unfortunately we just don't have the resources to continue maintaining a system used by 0.05% of our users.

Our goal is not to have a site that's geared to pre-teens. In fact, from our own stats, only a small minority of our users are younger than 18. Our goal is to help as many people as possible learn a language, and the decisions we make are all geared towards that.

We have 45 engineers, who are developing and maintaining features that serve, literally, tens of millions of active users. Every day, my job is to prioritize what they work on, and unfortunately there is no way to only make decisions that everybody will agree with. If you see the responses to our Facebook posts, or even posts on this forum or on Reddit, you'll see that people want thousands of different things. Every time we announce a new language, there is a barrage of posts, some even insulting us, about us not yet having Japanese or Chinese. When we add a feature to our iOS app, we get complaints about why it's not on Android, and vice versa.

I hate that we can't support Immersion anymore, as it was a feature that I personally conceived of, but I have to do what I think is best for the project.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Hi Luis! I can understand your point and I am sure this decision is sad for everyone. Anyway, the fact only 0.05% were using immersion is that almost no user knew really about the feature. After the beginning of the A/B test, lots of new users were begging to be given the option to get to immersion. I have read somewhere that even an user created a Chrome Extension to gain access to it. I doubt people using Duo on mobile devices know there was once a place called Immersion and how useful it was for learning purposes. So, maybe those numbers are not telling the whole truth.

I think I am not the only one here that considers Immersion as the tool for advanced learning, as the trees are fantastic for beginners but not for further learning a language.

But, that I would have appreciated, is another kind of announcement, really. Just seizing the opportunity to close Immersion once and forever after a period of two days glitches without any previous announcement, without giving us the chance to download our work there for years. Some collaborators and I have made a lot of Wikipedia translations we would like to keep in order to publish them back there... I do not think this is that fair.

And I am saying this with all the due respect for your great gift (Duolingo). It was a pleasure to be part of it and to get to know so many nice people here, even new friends. I have learned so much with the help of so many native speakers. I won't never be able to express how grateful I am for it.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ID-007
ID-007
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Hello Luis,

Thank you for taking the time to read and respond to many of the concerns expressed by various users. In addition to letra_a’s points I wonder whether you would like to address/consider the following questions:

  1. Without Immersion available, how many of the language experts will continue to freely contribute to Duolingo’s various forums?

  2. Are you really saying that Immersion is no longer a vital feature to the long term strategy of Duolingo?

  3. Regarding the lack of resources, could you elaborate that point a little? What exact resources would Duolingo need to keep Immersion viable? If it is engineering or other staff (e.g., marketing), would you consider crowdsourcing? If it is financial, would placing ads and/or charging some monthly fees help?

Respectfully, Daniel.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GarryCope
GarryCope
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You're another guy I'm going to miss Daniel! Needed you help, and corrections, with my Spanish, and pushing 70 now I need all the help I can get. Thanks!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ID-007
ID-007
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Thank you Gary. You are very kind. I will keep you posted! You can find a group of ex-Duo translators at: http://communitytranslation.freeforums.net/

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/annika_a
annika_a
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How do you know the ages of your users?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Luis
LuisPlus
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Surveys and Comscore data.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/annika_a
annika_a
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OK, that sounds way better than what I was imagining...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/S0R0USH
S0R0USH
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"Are you over 18"

"yes."

I LIED

Is what I was imagining hehe

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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For clarity’s sake, was that system used by 0.05% of all users, or was that system used by 0.05% of those users taking a course on a device in which Immersion was both offered as an option and always available to those users?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vytah
vytah
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Also, who is counted within that 0.05%. Do I count, despite having used immersion only for a total of less than an hour two years ago?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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That was precisely my point on being provided a popularity statistic for a feature that wasn’t available to all users.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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I know this isn't perfect but two months ago I calculated that 72% of all learners were taking one of the original courses (based on pure addition since I have no way of doing it based on accounts), so I'm going to assume that's the percentage course-wise. If courses like English for Russian or Spanish for French had immersion, then that percentage is obviously higher and the end result lower. That would mean about 0,07% of people studying a correct course were using immersion. Now the device question is tougher because we don't have such recent numbers, so I'm going to go with the numbers they shared over three years ago. Back then 23% of users were web users. That would mean 0,3% of users taking a correct course on the web were using immersion. Even if we assume the AB test took it away from half of all users, not just the new ones, the number would still be only 0,6% which still seems very low to keep supporting it. Or am I missing something?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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If your estimates are accurate, then 0.6% would mean that 6 of every 1000 users use Immersion. That could still well be a low ratio, but how many daily users would that represent in absolute numbers? (I have no idea how many users are active each day.) If we take as a given that no new development would have happened with Immersion anyway, how many staff hours per week had been required to maintain Immersion? I’ve never used it, since it was never available for the Irish from English course, so I don’t know what sort of staff attention was required for maintaining it. (I’m presuming that volunteer moderators were taking care of e.g. trollish situations, similar to their functions in the discussion forums.) In summary, those of us who don’t work for Duolingo are all missing something, since we don’t have all of the information that determined why Immersion was ended.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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If we go by the tens of millions active users mentioned by Luis you can count that it's 60 000/every 10 million. I would imagine 300 000 (50 million) is overestimating it no matter what reasonable definition of active is used. And that 0,6% was being generous with the AB test numbers.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ozzychris
ozzychris
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I don't know where you access those sort of numbers but there most certainly are a great number of users in French immersion. And I'd say mostly very serious about it, like me, who devotes about 2 hours daily doing translations. I was getting close to reaching the illusive one million DL points which won't happen now as it would take me years to complete the final 100,000 doing the tree refurbs. I'll have to find a new hobby as 're-gilding' the tree gets boring in itself. I still do it as a diversion but I get far greater satisfaction in seeing my own progress through immersion (just like in real life).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Which number? The original 0,05% is from this very comment by Luis, the 72% was counted from the courses page (or the incubator if you like) and like I said, the 23% is from a three year old post by staff member. The rest is basic maths.

I'd like to know what you consider a great number of users? Is it 100, 1000, 10 000? If we assume one eighth of all users are active (Duo has advertised 150 million users before, now Luis talks about tens of millions of active ones, but I'm going to be kind and assume the number of total users has since risen to 160 million, and tens of millions means 20). That would translate to 5,8 million active French learners (if proportionate. Spa <-> Eng skews it one way, the others the other way) and using the 0,6% we had before, there would have to be about 35 000 French immersion users for the number to be greater than my calculation.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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"A great number of users" is a very vague impression backed up by... your own impression of the number of users.

Given that millions use Duolingo, it doesn't prove your point.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daffodil2015
daffodil2015
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Hi Luis, I was wondering, how about making Immersion a paid option instead of removing it altogether? Judging by the responses here, I think a lot of people would happily pay to have it back. That would also dissuade those who were in it just to get XPs. For me, like for many others who commented before, Immersion was the only reason to come back daily, as it provided a lot more vocabulary than the regular lessons... and it was FUN. After finishing the tree, coming back to it day in, day out, is fun for about a month, but after that... you start craving something more. Immersion provided the opportunity to interact with other users, to discover how language is actually used in "real-life" contexts (not just "the dogs drink milk" and "the elephants drink water"). And it really was the feature that made Duo stand out among other learning sites. Anyway, thank you for a wonderful experience and for helping me learn Spanish a lot faster than I would have otherwise. I can only hope that maybe you'll consider my suggestion (and that the math actually adds up) - I was looking forward to learning Italian, too :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/br0d4
br0d4
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Thank you VERY much for this explanation.

And I still hope, that - one day - you may turn back to this idea, one that has an immense educational value for persons who have completed their language trees. Then you may seriously consider re-implementing something similar to Immersion, but in a way that would work a more civilised, more social way, better protected from the activity of trolls, XP-hunters or tier-collectors. Maybe not gratified with any XP, but as a paid option, available only for, say, lvl20+ users...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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Greetings! I appreciate your taking the time to return to this thread.

I would ask you to to take into consideration the fact that although the numbers of users who will be lost to Duolingo through the withdrawal of immersion are numerically low, their withdrawal will have a negative impact on the experience of the majority of users on this site.

I am in the position where the practice of completing the trees is still of value to me; but it is of value because of the ability to discuss the answers with native speakers and learners of greater experience than myself. Such users now have little of value to their own language skill development on offer - a minority may wish to start a new language, but you cannot rely on this - so it is understandable that they will leave.

And without their feedback and input, the usefulness of the tree exercises, which form the core of the Duolingo experience, will themselves be diminished. There are limits to the flexibility of machine translation; it was the corps of experienced bilingual users who bridged the gap.

Of course, you could recruit more staff to fill the gap hitherto occupied by these willing, enthusiastic, unpaid volunteers, but I doubt that this is the more cost effective approach.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Wonderthing
Wonderthing
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Hi, Luis. Instead of just saying "we don't have the resources", would you please consider giving some numbers on the issue (the issue of resources, not that of the users of immersion)? It would clarify the matter greatly.

First of all, what exactly do you mean by "resources" here?

What resources do you have (quantitatively)?

What resources were used to keep immersion working by the time it was removed? Was it really necessary to delete it altogether? Maybe it could be still maintained in a kind of a "frozen" state until the required resources are found?

What resources do you think you would need in order to keep the immersion working in the future?

Did you try to "find" these lacking resources somewhere? What did you try?

Maybe there are people in the duolingo community who could find a solution to the problem? If the problem is just technical or financial, maybe some reach people or foundations interested in supporting free education projects could help? Maybe crowdfunding could be used?

Answering these questions should make it much clearer what the problem really is and if it is really so insurmountable. And it should put a lot of minds at ease.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vytah
vytah
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Thank you for keeping in mind the good of all Duolingo users and making tough decision when needed. The forums are a bit of an echo chamber and they do not represent the majority of Duolingo users – not that you don't know that, you obviously do, I'm saying that as a reminder to other forum readers. I find it laughable that people think you're trying to make this site geared for kids – apart from the school feature, none of the new features is actually like that. I think that's some sort of an elitism of some people who consider everything they don't like as kiddy stuff.

Otra vez, ¡gracias por todo vuestro trabajo!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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You think that the ability to send other users emojis is a a serious language learning tool for adults? That is the latest "improvement" to Duolingo that immersion is being retired to make room for.
Immersion was used by serious learners of all ages. I doubt the same can be said of "Clubs".

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vytah
vytah
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Clubs are a much smaller feature and require much less maintenance than immersion, so comparing them makes little sense.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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But that is the "exciting new feature" that we have received, and which was given as one of the reasons for retiring immersion. If you think that it is insignificant in comparison, I cannot but agree.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vytah
vytah
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Black clouds over immersion have been gathering for quite a while already. I was pretty much expecting this to happen for months. The A/B tests were pretty much a giveaway – if you're A/B testing something that was supposed to be your killer feature, maybe it's not such a killer feature in the first place.

But while I understand why they axed immersion (especially since I try to look at it from staff's point of view), I have no idea what the clubs are for. Maybe they want to increase engagement of casual learners. I've seen quite a bit of people creating and advertising their clubs, it seems it caught at least a bit of people's interest. Not that I think that the interest will last too long.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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@vytah: I agree with you about the warning signs. However I had, somewhat naively in retrospect, assumed that it would not be withdrawn until there was something ready to replace it, in terms of filling the same niche in the language learning process.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FloweringIris.
FloweringIris.
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Taking away immersion is taking many, many of the valuable users here. I'm really sad to see immersion go, but I'm more sadden to see awesome, helpful, and caring users who have been here longer than I, disappear because of no immersion. I wouldn't have finished my trees or done what I have done here without their kind motivation. I will miss immersion and the wonderful users who will go with immersion...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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This is a very important point. The more advanced users who made full use of immersion may be relatively few in comparison to the total number of users of the site, but it was their knowledge and experience that enriched the learning experience for the majority. When they leave, because Duolingo no longer has anything to offer them, this degrades the learning experience for all of us.

Duolingo relies on the contribution of a large number of volunteers who have freely given large amounts of their time to this project. It appears not just cynical but unrealistic to rely on their continuing to do so whilst getting nothing back.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Soybeba
Soybeba
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I agree with you. What will happen with the translated texts?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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As of Sunday evening, Duolingo has locked all access to them. The texts (and all the manhours of work that went into them) are lost. Please consider signing this petition for their authors to be permitted to retrieve their work. https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20374000$from_email=comment&comment_id=20406949

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Soybeba
Soybeba
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It is horrifying, and without an explanation! What happens is incomprehensible. I am going to see the request. Thank you very much, daughterofAlbion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DrWho100
DrWho100
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Luis, with immersion you had created excellence, a unique and effective tool to enhance and advance language learning, something for which you were recognized in Ted Talks. That Immersion works is demonstrated by my own progress at Duolingo: after 1150 days, over 1,000,000 XP and achieving Tier 126 in EN > GE and 171 GE > EN, that Immersion works is obvious. I can now tell you that without Immersion, Duolingo will have no further value for me.

In my journey with Doulingo I was able to help and learn from many others learning English form German and German from English - and this collaboration is the true value of Immersion. I am immensely saddened by your decision Thanks for being great at one point - I've enjoyed every one of my 1150 days.

James

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VStarTraveler

Well said, James.

While I didn't always have the time I would have liked for my language studies, I found Immersion to be a very important part of the process; most members of the Immersion community were friendly, cooperative, and helpful, particularly to those of us who were less skilled. Eliminating Immersion removes not only an important tool to the language learner but also strips away much of the sense of community that had been developed over the past few years.

Like James, I've greatly enjoyed my time on Duolingo; while I will likely continue for a while since I still see some usefulness, I fear that usefulness has been greatly reduced.

VST

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/quantifier
quantifier
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Hi VST. I will miss you, too. Perhaps I will complete a tree or two if I think it is useful.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VStarTraveler

Hi, quantifier. I appreciate all the help that you, Sandy, and others have given me and all that you've taught me. I'll miss you all and working with you, too.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/2014siri
2014siri
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Dear James, you made my journey with Duo bright ;-) thank you for being a friend and supporter! All the best for you! Siri

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/XD29
XD29
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Dear James, you have been one of my first Duo friends. I can't express how much I enjoyed working together with you on translations... cheering each other on upon reaching a new level or tier... It's been a great time , and I hope our paths in life will cross again some way or other. After all, there is a German saying: Man trifft sich immer zweimal im Leben.

"Thank you, for being a friend" ~ XD

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SportsOcean
SportsOcean
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Thanks for clearing up the Immersion part! My only question (and legitimate concern) is about the activity stream. Will you be bringing it back? It would be a lot easier to contact mods through the activity and personal stream. I would be a little bit more worried about cyberbullying and safety of Duo without them. It would be difficult to report users quickly (unless you introduced a report button, however it could be abused). Not to mention, it will be harder to talk to our friends that we made over Duo. Once again, thanks for the information. :-) - SportsOcean

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Danmoller
Danmoller
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So far, staff has told us that they're working on putting back all the features that they temporarily shut down due to server limitations that appeared recently.

So.... everything should come back in place as soon as they can solve the limitations. Activity streams will remain. So we have been told.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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They also told us that they weren't removing immersion .... See mstreeter's comment here https://www.duolingo.com/comment/13320933

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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Yes, 11 months ago they said that the disappearance that was at that time happening wasn't due to them removing (at that time) Immersion.
You can also find some discussions where they say that they had no plan to remove it (at the moment of their comment), but I don't remember them to say that "it'll never be removed".

Danmoller is speaking about current (less than a week) statements by staff, so not really comparable.


And, yes, things change and Duo changes its vision/goals about itself/its functionality. For example,

  • Immersion was their business model at the beginning, it was not anymore since long ago
  • they said there will not be ads, they tested some and start to put some.
  • I'm sure we can find others

You'll be able to find official statement saying the contrary: because they'll be old statements and things (unfortunately) change.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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My point was not so much that Activity will not return in the short term but I see no reason to feel optimistic about its future.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
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They did have a no activity A/B test a while back and then abandoned it, which hopefully would indicate that they're not trying to get rid of it yet... Although I do wonder if adding clubs is a first step in that direction.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Yet they continued with the AB test. Everytime it happened, the staff said it will back soon, never that they have decided to keep it. Features can disappear even when the test is not complete.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/20ckernaghan

hmu at connor_5484

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letter_s
letter_s
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Best of luck to you Duo. I will miss all of my friends here and hope to keep in contact with you some how. It has been a great experience translating with you and learning from you. I wish you all the best. It's been a great last few years. Take care everyone. Sandy

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/edouardchapeaux

Thanks Sandy !!!!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/EliederSousa
EliederSousa
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Even Duo is not believing

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ripcurlgirl
Ripcurlgirl
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Could we PLEASE have an update about what is happening with the activity streams? You had the perfect opportunity to mention it here but not a word. What's going on? Is that so difficult to answer?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
Francevw
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Bonjour à tous, je lance à tous cette idée « bouée de sauvetage ». En attendant mieux, je l’espère, et afin de pouvoir rester en contact avec nos amis, chacun pourrait décider de créer un compte sur Facebook commençant par EXDL+ son identité sur Duolingo + n’importe quoi derrière si cette identité existe déjà sur facebook. Par exemple EXDLfrancevw1234. Ceci permettrait de nous retrouver si toute communication entre nous via Duolingo n’est plus possible. Qu’en pensez-vous ?

Hi everybody and dear friends, I launch this idea of "lifeline". Waiting for better solution, and in order to stay in touch with our friends, everyone could decide to create an account on Facebook starting with EXDL + its identity on Duolingo + anything behind if that identity already exists on facebook. For example EXDLfrancevw1234. This would allow us keep in touch if any communication between us via Duolingo is no longer possible. What do you think of it?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GCHOTEAU

C'est une idée. Pour ma part, je pensais à échanger nos adresses eMail pour pouvoir communiquer sur des traductions. On peut parfaitement échanger des textes traduits par chacun et les corriger. Mais je crains que cela ne soit pas très facile à gérer. J'ai fait aussi quelques recherches sur le net pour trouver un éventuel "clone" de DL, mais malheureusement tous les sites d'apprentissage de langues (gratuits ou payants) sont consternants de simplisme. C'est apparemment ce que DL souhaite devenir...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
Francevw
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Facebook n'accepte pas les noms commençant par EXDL mais bien ceux commençant par Duo. Nous sommes aussi dans cette discussion : https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gabrielle28671
Gabrielle28671
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Bonjour France, https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474 Viens développer ton idée on essaie de se regrouper. Gianfranca, Gena, Jo, Mimie, François, Anne, Sylvie, Jean Michel, Florica etc... et tous ceux que j'oublie ce lien vous concerne aussi bien sûr

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
Francevw
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Sorry EXDL is not accepted by Facebook . You have to choose a name beginning with Duo + your name on Duolingo or something very close. Facebook n'accepte pas les noms commençant par EXDL mais bien ceux commençant par Duo.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CommeuneTexane

I guess letting the dust settle first... :( This would probably blow up the activity streams.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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That's what I was thinking too Rachel.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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We can't talk to each other so easily with Activity disabled!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ripcurlgirl
Ripcurlgirl
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Exactly Gena - smacks of intention doesn't it.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Yes Kim - Doesn't it just !

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/LasCicatrices

I'm extremely upset about this decision. I'm sorry Duolingo, but I have no use for this site anymore. Unless of course, I want to keep strengthening the words I've already strengthened time and time and time again. This thread is disappointing. Clubs are not as beneficial to learning as Immersion is. Neither are chatbots.

Helloooo Memrise!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ClimateCanary

It's the shabby way they have treated us that hurts the most: Immersion and Activity were shut down for several days without a word of explanation, getting us familiar with its absence and preventing us from communicating. Then, on a good day to bury bad news - Trumps's inauguration - they sneaked it into Discussion. It was far more than a foreign language tool for me, I enjoyed learning so much from the articles that I and others, translated. Translating the French way of saying something into an equivalent English way, figuring out a certain way of saying something, or searching for the right word was an enjoyable and valuable challenge for me, not least with my own mother tongue. Then, someone would find a better alternative and, like a light being switched on, extend my knowledge and understanding! It was fun, educational, interactive, addictive, always full of surprises. Yes, Dear Diary, there is yet another reason why 20/01/2017 is not a good day.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gabrielle28671
Gabrielle28671
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Fa viens nous rejoindre ici https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/itastudent
itastudent
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1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/semeraro61
semeraro61
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Hi Luis,

I think you took the worst decision you could take for Duolingo and its community.

Immersion is (was) what makes Duolingo different.

Without Immersion Duolingo becomes a mediocre language learning site, only useful for beginners.

It's a pity. We were a wonderful community of translators, but right now, I'm afraid we'll have to go elsewhere.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kaylee2300

Well... I was hoping that when my Immersion tab was gone that it was just a glitch. Sadly, I guess not. I understand that the Duolingo team needs to continue to improve but, Immersion will be missed. With that said, I have finished the tree for Spanish and was using Immersion to continue learning. What should I do now to keep learning?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Move on? Memrise, Lang-8, movies, music, books, news, tutor, language exchange…

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/WildSage
WildSage
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Don't forget actually talking to other human beings. It's funny how many people forget this idea.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
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This.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kaylee2300

See, I'm in high school and as a first year Spanish student I got put in a forth year class and I have been using Duolingo to learn and know at least a little bit of what my teacher was talking about. I really enjoyed Immersion because my teacher would make me translate things in front of the whole class. Talk about stressful.

Thank you for your advice! I will look into your suggestions! :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Most of us are already using these in any case. Furthermore, speaking for myself I have regular conversations with friends around the world who are native speakers of my target languages. Our dismay at losing immersion does not mean that we have been using Duo to the exclusion of all else.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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What should I do now to keep learning?

Here some ideas:

  • Take the reverse tree
  • Check every now and then if a new version of "Spanish for English speakers" hasn't been released.
  • Read Spanish speaking newspapers (online, for example) daily
  • Listen Spanish speaking radio
  • Watch Spanish speaking series or films, without subtitles or with SP subtitiles
1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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But if we've done the reverse trees jrkhal, what then? We have nowhere to go now on Duo, all the suggestions you make are elswhere. We have lost an essential part of our language learning toolkit.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Selket62
Selket62
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Ifphigenia, you are completely right. It was great for me to do the reverse tree and then go into immersion. I'm a German native speaker and immersion was so helpful for me. English native speakers carefully improved the many mistakes I made. Friendships all over the world have developed. Immersion on Duo was the only feature I know which could make this available. jrikhal, I can follow all of your suggestions, but I will never be sure whether I have correctly understood them. I will miss immersion painfully!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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Yes, all the other ones are outside of Duolingo: it's not the only resource available to practice our language skills and there is always a moment to "move on" to the next step. ;)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
Ifphigenia
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Sadly, I think that is what many of us will do, as it is clear that our continued learning will not be catered for any longer. This is a sad day for so many serious learners.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SuzaF
SuzaF
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Thanks for clarification, Jrikhal! However, I took and still take the moderators for (much valued) representatives of Duo and I still think that Ifphigenia's question deserves an answers beyond "Find your luck somewhere else" . But maybe you are the realistic one and I am mistaken. I have seen these developments on all sorts of other platforms and my plans to compile a handbook on how to ruin a promising project gain more plausibility (and I wish it wouldn't).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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But it is this "next step" that is the critical one. To move on from parrotting set phrases to dealing with real language is quite a step - immersion provided an arena for doing this, with plenty of feedback from native speakers as to one's mistakes. What alternative resource can you recommend that can provide this?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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Non-Duolingo ideas have already been offered plentifully, but if you're looking for reading/writing practice on Duolingo then I would recommend 1) the forum of the reverse tree (so, English for Russian or French or German speakers, from your top three badges) and 2) starting a thread in the forum of the language you want to practise entitled something along the lines of "Talk to me in X" (preferably written in said language.

I've done both these things in the past, and ended up with more reading and writing practice/corrections and advice from native speakers than I knew what to do with.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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@flootzavut: Thank you; I really do appreciate your attempt to contribute something constructive to the issue. Unfortunately it does not really solve the issue.
Duolingo, although it has been a wonderful resource in the past, has always been only one component of the language learning process. I have been in regular contact with native speakers of my top 3 languages for years (and frequently watch films, listen to music etc. in these languages). But since ordinary people have a sense of politeness that precludes them pointing out mistakes to a friend (unless they cannot understand at all), I am aware that my French and German grammar have deteriorated from when I last studied them formally (as university subsidiary courses). What made Duolingo distinctive, and attractive, was that alongside a set of grammar refresher exercises was a body of skilled volunteers, who could clarify abstruse matters.

Immersion on Duolingo is rather a misnomer. By itself, it certainly does not provide an immersive learning experience. But its unique feature was a collaborative translation environment. There is a large gap between any taught course, and the sort of specialised document that you need or want to read for its own sake. A collaborative environment to bridge the gap is invaluable.
Further practice in colloquial language is relatively easy to obtain. Assistance in other registers is a much rarer resource. I think I have found a viable solution in Russian for myself - but it relies on friendships made here in the past. I wish I knew of a more generally applicable resource that I could share.
If you do, please post details.about it. Since this is a service that Duolingo has decided to no longer provide, I do not think it counts as "advertising the competitor" to do so,

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SuzaF
SuzaF
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I guess all adults on the site know that there is a world outside and some of us are even visiting it frequently. However, I am surprised to see that Duo is advising users to leave the platform. I thought we were discussing the development of Duo - leaving it and using other ressources is obviously an option, which makes this debate superfluous.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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However, I am surprised to see that Duo is advising users to leave the platform.

I didn't see Duo doing it.
Just in case, a little clarification: forum moderators (green ring around profile picture) aren't Duo employees (=blue ring), they are users to whom staff(=Duo employees) gave some moderation tools.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kaylee2300

Thank you so much for your suggestions! I think I'm going to try listening to Spanish speaking radio. I think that will really help me. Thank you again!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Lrtward
Lrtward
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I really like RTVE.es channel five. It's interviews, news, special interest stories, and lots of talk. Great for listening practice.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JillLefrancois

I play the Facebook game "Criminal Case" in French, it's brilliant for learning dialogue and loads of fun to play :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kaylee2300

Thank you!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/kaca2903
kaca2903
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Dear developers of Duolingo, Please bring back the Activity on profiles. Now that there is no activity feed on the profiles, it makes it more difficult to connect to other users, which is bad since the languages are best and the most easily learned with other people! I am learning Danish, and know French, and just met a person who knew Danish and was learning French. Just when we were to exchange contact info on our profiles so that we could Skype and better our language skills further, you deleted all the activity! What ?! Please give us back the activity. Duolingo is growing, and the people liked it as it was. When you have a growing project, you need to be very careful - first sustain it and make it accessible to a large number of people interested in it, then take cautious steps. Why not just give us a platform we can work and collaborate on and let it grow and see what people make of it? Just like Reddit for example.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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you deleted all the activity

... temporarily, they said.

What ?! Please give us back the activity.

That's what they plan to do, ASAP. To be precise, they shared with the community:

We are doing our best to bring them back as quickly as possible without compromising site performance.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/b05aplmun.ca
b05aplmun.ca
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Uh, jrikhal, here is the quote again with somewhat more context: "This means that some features may be disabled for improved stability. We are doing our best to bring them back as quickly as possible without compromising site performance."

Although the phrase "some features" is rather vague, I think a reasonable person might, in context, very well interpret it as including both the activity stream and Immersion and expect that they would both return eventually.

We've just been told that we should not, in fact, expect Immersion to return, which, I think, raises reasonable questions about whether the activity stream will.

If they expected to return Immersion and then changed their minds, they might also change their minds about the activity stream. Alternatively, if "some features" never was intended to reference Immersion, perhaps the activity stream is also not referenced.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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Except that Immersion is/were a case apart: contrarily to the other (pushed lived) features, it wasn't available for most of the accounts as, for months, no new account were granted it and, as far as I remember about users complaints in the past, part of "older" users who had it lost it when then started the "A/B test".

So I don't think Immersion had to be considered as being in the same situations as any other features: it had for long started to be "withdrew" (in the sense that the percentage of users having it was decreasing with new users arriving: no other features were/are in this case, afaik). The Immersion were already mostly "disabled" long before they disabled some features "for improved stability". Yes they also disabled the few "rests of Immersion" (=from the few users still having it) for improved stability but main of it was for long "disabled".

I think a reasonable person might, in context, very well interpret it as including both the activity stream and Immersion and expect that they would both return eventually.
We've just been told that we should not, in fact, expect Immersion to return

That's, hence, not my understanding/interpretation of what have been stated/said. ;)

Alternatively, if "some features" never was intended to reference Immersion, perhaps the activity stream is also not referenced.

I can confirm you it does refer in particular to Activity stream: as, in a mail exchange with me, staff specifically mentioned Activity stream when they mentioned features that have been put down temporarily (and they don't mention any other specifically) and they explicitly wrote that the streams are temporarily down and that they will bring it back asap.
Don't worry! ;)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/b05aplmun.ca
b05aplmun.ca
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Thanks for the information about what staff told you. That's useful to know.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/kaca2903
kaca2903
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Great news. Thanks! Edit: Duo has truly been a gift for me. Many more people are interested, and I keep rediscovering that the people I know and the ones I meet both use it and recommend it greatly. Please remember that site crashing due to large traffic isn't a bad thing - it's a sign your plan to help people learn languages easily is being accomplished more and more each day.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Aria487
Aria487
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Immersion was absent from the beginning for many, and they won't miss it. There are many dedicated learners among these people.(Maybe the number of these people is greater than the people who had immersion, but the number alone isn't that important)
Besides, we shouldn't just assume that the users that aren't serious now, won't be serious tomorrow. Or that new dedicated users won't arrive after this point.

However, I know I'm repeating this, but, the current state of things aren't as educating as immersion.(This from a user who hasn't had or used immersion at all)
Clubs are merely a private leaderboard, and I (as an Android or web user) don't even know what Chatbots are. They're "machines" after all, only they respond to you in a more friendly way than, say, Bing Translator does.

I kindly ask users such as Ifphigenia not to discount the effect their knowledge, their dedication, and their patience can have on the community. Not to leave.

Duolingo team should think twice before dedicating the resources of immersion to chatbots and alike. I trust they do this, but things aren't very promising right now.

If this really means more quality courses and more improvements on the existing in-house courses (like changing the voice of e.g. Spanish course to a native speaker's), I agree with your decision, regardless of new possible features.

p.s. The estimates for translating Wikipedia from English to Spanish with a 100,000 users was 5 weeks in the original TED talk. I know documents were allowed from anywhere (except of late), but did that plan really work? I'm guessing it didn't, and I'd like to be enlightened on the success rate.

p.p.s It's a very selfish thing to say, but it hasn't been mentioned here: I, and Irish learner with no immersion from the beginning, follow an Italian learner whose XP every week was above 1500 due to translating a lot, whereas I could only learn XP by doing lessons and feel a little helpless afterwards! I'm not in the least happy that my friend won't be translating here anymore, but the thing is, XP competitions will be fairer from this point forward. I know it's a very insignificant point, but it's still an unmentioned result of disabling Immersion.

(Edited to add two paragraphs)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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I doubt that many of the people who valued immersion were interested in collecting XP. (And yes, I know that one of its flaws was that it could be "farmed" - not that I am in any way implying that your friend was doing that!) If the rate of acquisition of XP through immersion was an issue, I am sure most serious users would happily forego the XP awards and use it regardless.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Agreed, if they just decided to get rid of all XP and translation tiers so that there are no rewards for abusing it, I would use immersion just the same and so would most/all of the people I translate with.

P.S. I sent you a friend request on lang-8. Same username and profile picture.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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Duly accepted, my friend. I hope others will join us. It is an imperfect medium, but an improvement on the current situation!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Aria487
Aria487
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I didn't mean otherwise. It's very clear that many users are sad to let go of a useful tool such as immersion, and of the relationships that were formed in that translation process. XP is nothing compared to that. All I'm saying is, that way of acquiring XP is no longer open and thus competitions are more fair.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GCHOTEAU

Duolingo has no more interest for me. Unfortinately, you broke a great tool. How could you replace it with Clubs and Chatbots ? Duolingo is knackered...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TheGirlOverThere
TheGirlOverThere
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No...! :'(

Well, life can go on, and that may mean someone better will come. Already no immersion has made me finish strengthening all of my weakened skills that I just didn't want to do. So maybe that it is gone, I can truly focus on learning. It did make me pretty upset that a bunch of people with huge streaks and finished trees leave. I can see their point- but think of the people who never had immersion. I never did, and until 3/4 months ago I found the link to create my own, which I never really REALLY used until about 1 or 2 months ago.

Anyways, I deeply saddened that immersion is gone and that it will never return. I've had so many memories and learning new words that were always above my level of Spanish. And I just got into french immersion.

I do want to say if there no chats anymore? or stream?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Cam_and_Alex
Cam_and_Alex
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"So maybe that it is gone, I can truly focus on learning."

That was an amazing form OF learning. Applying the learning in that way was one of the best ways to actually learn on this site! The trees are great, but the Immersion capabilities, at least in my opinion, were quite helpful! And I find it quite sad that I only started using it two weeks ago and it is already being taken from me. =(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/TheGirlOverThere
TheGirlOverThere
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Yes. I didn't word it that well, but I would like to "correctly" learn- meaning mostly by grammar, past and future tense. I haven't finished the tree, in fact, I am only just understanding past tense. Immersion was going ahead of my level and distracted me from my tree. Now I can work on my tree. Sorry about that. I loved immersion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Cam_and_Alex
Cam_and_Alex
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Okay. That makes more sense. I'll be willing to help you when--if--profile and activity streams return if you ever need a practice partner. =)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Loumeland
Loumeland
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Immersion will be missed. It was the most effective way to apply what one learnt on Duolingo in a real-life setting without having to interact with preteens or people who want to use you to get into your country (or get college grants).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/quantifier
quantifier
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I am sad to hear this. I have enjoyed working with everyone. I will miss you all. I am saying good-bye. Q.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IvoryLizzy1

Wasn't expecting this! I never really used Immersion, so I do not have that much feelings for it. But to the people who do use it: We should support Duo's decisions. Duolingo has given us so much,and we should appreciate that. Duolingo is free. It's hard to have this much on a program , and keep it free at the same time. Even though I hope the Activity button comes back soon, we should appreciate what they are doing. (Not sure why the down-votes though)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/RumiByNight

It seems there is a small number of people downvoting anyone who disagrees with them. I like your attitude. Gratitude is something few people have these days.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ElCoronelEsponja

Hear, hear!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IvoryLizzy1

I assumed that there would be down-voters. But I agree, fewer and fewer have gratitude these days

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DeadOwlSociety

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AussieCraig
AussieCraig
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Throwing away the fine china and silverware in favour of paper plates and plastic cutlery leaves you with a poor looking table setting though doesn't it. (And minus the human element: i.e. to a chatbot, this English sentence would have no meaning in relation to this post).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ECS9JD

Yes, I miss the activity button and the ability to interact with others personally, albeit maybe publicly than I do Immerision.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SusannaG1
SusannaG1
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Even though I would have liked to have had immersion, I can't wait to see what new opportunities Duolingo has to offer.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rspreng

"We simply don’t have the resources required to develop or maintain Immersion in a satisfactory way."

How many of you ranting against Duo for this decision read this sentence in Luis's statement?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/vwlj
vwlj
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I, like so many others, am sad to see the end of Immersion. It had become as much a part of my mornings as a cup of coffee. That said, I'm grateful to Duolingo for giving me the opportunity, via Immersion, to vastly increase my Spanish vocabulary, to read topics that normally would not come my way, to be heartened that there are still those who care about using English correctly. Thank-you to both Duolingo and the many who gently corrected and improved my work.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/senyb
senyb
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Duolingo has officially jumped the shark. Dumbed down lessons, social features, but no translation support? Many of us were content to use Immersion with almost NO support because, as lacking as it was, it was useful. How should one expect learn a language without constant immersion? Poorly. I guess in the end it's not really about learning, just user engagement, money and metrics. We are not going to play in your sandbox anymore, Luis. Time to find new grounds.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PixelDrift

This is a huge shame. I'd actually only just started using Immersion a few days ago after getting to the point where I feel comfortable actually translating things with confidence.

That being said, the fact I got to that point is all thanks to Duolingo, so I'm still very thankful for everything you provide, for free no less.

Thank you for everything, and I'm sure the upcoming developments to the site will improve the site further.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/W-Cephei

Worst decision ever made by Duolingo.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scottgif
scottgif
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Agreed! I learned more from Immersion and working with fellow collaborators/friends than I have from any other language learning resource. Sad and disheartened to see it go. Andrés, thanks for including me on many of the articles you posted. I will miss working with so many talented people from all over the world. Perhaps we can do so again on a future website.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/W-Cephei

Hi Scott, good to see you, yes, it's a pity but it is what it is... If you want you can leave me your email somewhere so I can tell you if I find something like Immersion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mosfet07

It's amazing how easily the work of thousands of people was buried by pressing a button. Could we at least have read-only copies?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Just in case you want to add your voice here Mosfet07 :) https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20382789

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pancake84

well good by immersion you were a great feature

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/wdilly

When I found Duolingo a few years ago immersion was one of the features that excited me. You could learn quickly and then apply your new knowledge to real translations that deepened your learning. It's one of the reasons I've recommended Duolingo to friends over the years. Without it, it feels more like Rosetta Stone, which didn't work well for me. I'm sad that just as I started using the site again you removed one of the most rewarding features.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Alf42
Alf42
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I felt that way about Rosetta Stone for the first decade or so that it was around, but in the last 5 years or so it has improved tremendously. It's still way too expensive, but it does now have collaborative components that are very helpful.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gabrielle28671
Gabrielle28671
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Comment pouvez-vous nous laisser tomber de cette façon ? Vous parlez des clubs et de l'application non mais vous êtes sérieux là ? J'utilise l'application avec une tablette ou mon téléphone tous les jours pour des raisons de déplacements. J'ai donc l'option "club" mais c'est à mourir de rire cette "option". Pour ceux qui ne l'ont pas (ils ne errent rien) je la resume. On peut y voir les leçons que je révise s'afficher et ceux qui font parti de mon "club" peuvent cliquer sur des dessins comme "cool" ou "un smiley" et attention le scoop vous pouvez même cliquer sur un petit "cœur". non mais j'ai passé l'âge de ces conneries et en quoi un petit cœur va répondre à mes questions sur les langues ? C'est quoi l'intérêt pour nous de rester sur Duo ? J'ai terminé 2 arbres complètement et à moitié fait un 3ème et sans l'aide des amis/ies et avec les traductions et activité, il est impossible pour quiconque de parler, comprendre, ou même lire une langue apprise sur Duolingo grâce aux arbres seulement c'est un mensonge de vous faire croire cela. Nous allons tous partir et il ne vous restera que quelques gamins joueurs qui abandonneront après un mois ou deux. Je pense que vous savez déjà tout cela et que vous avez d'autres projets. J'invite ceux qui utilisent DL depuis plus d'un an à voter pour noter cette application et de lui donner la plus mauvaise note. On verra combien de temps elle va résister sans notre soutien. Vous êtes un sale père Noël, vous nous avez offert le jouet dont nous rêvions et vous avez décidé de nous le reprendre. Vous êtes décevant !

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SussexSoleil

Voilà! Bien dit, Gabrielle.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Gabrielle28671
Gabrielle28671
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SussexSoleil viens nous rejoindre ici https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jotten00
jotten00
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Hmmm...

Removing Immersion is like removing one leg of a three-legged stool. If there was something obvious to replace Immersion, then I could see some justification if the actual reason is that Duolingo doesn't "have the resources required." But, I don't see Clubs and Chatbots as a valid replacement, especially since I don't even see where on the Duolingo site they are offered! (I don't count Discussion as a club or chatbot.)

I may still use Duolingo - I spent about 30% of my time in Immersion. But, I certainly will not have the same kind of motivation to visit the site (the daily streak has less appeal as time goes on). It will be interesting to see if Duolingo can stay viable, but I think you have just alienated a large number of your users and supporters.

Was there some kind of poll of the users that I missed? It seems like this decision was made in a vacuum.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bobgray92

Immersion has given me deeper knowledge of a language than other learning tools (both within Duo and on other language training systems). For people still interested in translating, I recommend translating articles for Wikipedia. Wikipedia encourages translations between languages because different languages lack articles that appear in other languages. The unfortunate thing is I don't think that Wikipedia supports the kind of collaboration that Duolingo has. Perhaps Duolingo can look into helping Wikipedia have a better translation system.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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This suggestion, of Duolingo partnering with Wikipédia, is the best one I've seen on this thread.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Prol3psis
Prol3psis
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For me, the exciting year, as far as DuoLingo goes, has ended here, as immersion was the only exciting and valuable tool this site had to offer. I am utterly speechless at the fact that you have decided to throw this little gem away, just like that, and to leave so many of your most dedicated users out in the cold.

It would have been commendable if DL staff had actually tried to consult with its user community to see if there was any possibility to keep immersion alive. There were, in fact, many options. You could have turned immersion into a crowdfunding project or a donation program. You could have restricted the access so as to make immersion available to advanced learners only. Sadly, I have to say that communication has never been one of DL's strong points.

Seeing that you are determined to go through with this, I say goodbye to you sir and your site. It is unfortunate, but all good things have to come to an end. A big thank you to all the people I had the privilege of working with. It was a pleasure. I hope to see you on another platform.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Jamo953
Jamo953
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I can only say that I do not know what will become Duolingo now, since immersion was the tool that most attracted me and with which I was more immersed in learning.

I do not understand... :(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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It's maybe related to founding, I guess this feature wasn't paying the high costs that Duolingo has to pay. I can't see any other reasons, since it was this feature that made Duolingo unique among other sites or apps. They think they'll have less money problem with clubs, but it'll just make Duolingo looks like a bunch of other apps or sites, nothing more. Clubs seems to be to attract very young people, Duolingo focussing on beginners level only, consitant with the removing of the immersion. Their choice...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KarenTaylo7

What a sad day this is. I'm both a language teacher (English) and learner (Italian). For me and my students the immersion function has been a truly useful tool in beginning to understand the grammar, sentence structure and the use of the various verb forms of the target language. I do understand the difficulty of maintaining Immersion, and yes, I've sometimes found it really annoying seeing my translations to English messed up by others who are not native speakers - but equally it's been great to see something I've translated into Italian, that I've known wasn't quite right, be improved upon by a native speaker - I've learnt a lot from that. So thank you - and now I'll go and find my immersion elsewhere, via online news sites etc.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/golicar
golicar
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There are countless comments that express exactly what I feel right now, but I'll be another one saying the same thing.

My main motivation to be here was the immersion tool, which begs the question: why stay with Duolingo after all?

I'm greatly disapointed and seriously considered leaving Duolingo for good after this.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Well, Duo has mostly lost me with this decision. Immersion was far and away the most useful part of the site for me. The only reason I'd stay would be to keep in touch with the friends I've made here. If activity isn't available I can't even do that; hopefully that will come back soon but if not that will be the last straw.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Anneysha7
Anneysha7
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Thank you, Duolingo. I couldn’t have asked for anything better.
Now I cannot learn languages the way I could and have to find an alternative for this.

I am ‘new’ to Duolingo. I joined on 18.07.2015. You might be wondering how ‘new’ a one and half-year-old experience is. I’m sure that you’ll be able to understand me by the time I end my comment. I had just one goal when I joined Duolingo- to learn French. The fact that I loved the gamified way of learning and that language was no longer a burden to me made me stay on Duolingo. All that I did on Duolingo then was to complete my French skills. Gradually, I lost my interest and left Duolingo for a while. When I returned, I ‘re-discovered’ Duolingo. I didn’t know what Immersion was even though I had seen the immersion topics on the discussion stream. I never dared to ask anyone.

Discovering the Immersion was like opening a gift to me. I was unaware of Immersion before and later came to know about it slowly and as I unwrapped the present, I found a huge surprise – the way to learn French faster. I have always been an introvert and not interactive in language sessions. I also wanted someone to check my French without them knowing who I am. Duolingo with its Immersion helped me learn languages in my way. Oh, and the rewards of doing Immersion always made me come back and do a ‘little more Immersion’ – XP, level ups, lingots, upvotes, comments, and valuable suggestions to improve my French.

I wouldn’t say that I was unaware of the fact that Immersion was going to be removed. I just ignored it. I kept on hoping that ‘Immersion would be available for the next day’ every day. I also hoped that I would be able to explore Immersion further this year because I resolved to learn more languages. Spanish, Portuguese, Italian...

The only thing I feel glad about this decision is that there is no ‘test’ anymore. And that all the profiles are the same. Only the skills and a tree to learn. At least, this will reduce the number of ‘Immersion’ discussions. And how I hope that there are features introduced on all the platforms that somehow try to replace Immersion! I appreciate all your efforts to make Duolingo better than ever. :)

There was a feature called 'Duels' before on Duolingo. Duolingo seems to have removed it. I am not sure about what it actually is and how it worked, I found it when I was looking for some Wiki articles. There have been so many changes on Duolingo, enough to make me feel that I'm new to this website.

I am now worried about the stream now, it shouldn't disappear the way Immersion did! When the stream returns, I'll give it a tight hug and make sure that it doesn't disappear. Just because I love learning languages through 'Immersion'.

Now that Immersion is gone with 2016, I will have to formulate a new plan to learn languages the fun way, and the Immersion way. This will take a while. For now, I will just return to learning the Non-Immersion Languages.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/WarriorCleberz
WarriorCleberz
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I am very disappointed with this situation, and I'm not seeing one year too attractive with this changes. Duolingo was a site for all ages, and then? Now is just for teenagers, at least it's what seems to be. Sad. Very sad.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Don_Cristian
Don_Cristian
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Yeah I understand that Duolingo team has to do hard decisions like always in companies. I just hate this decision, the immersion was probably the most important single feature in any language learning app, which helped me to improve and expand my vocabulary and knowledge of a language. So disappointed, I hope that the new features will become something nearly as effective and good.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SerEng72

Hello, in this sad situation I have very few words to spend. I only wish to warn you that sometimes people together take unfortunate decisions. Sorry, but I'm sure that this one is one of them. Now, without "Immersion", and much more than before, I'm convinced that I'll very hardly be able to find the time to browse to the platform, unfortunately. I wish you all the best, but please remember that in some cases your fortune must be helped in some way, even by changing your mind. Sergio

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/FrankKool
FrankKool
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DuoLingo has lost the key element that made it superior to all other language learning sites. Such a pity, I was looking forward to getting started on Italian immersion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/darkjedioverlord

That's unfortunate. Immersion was one of the only things keeping me on the site. The small exercises were fine at the beginning, but, after finishing my primary and reverse tree, immersion was the only thing that provided me any reason to keep coming back. It was also the only thing on the site that felt like it was helping me progress in my learning. I guess it's time to leave this site. Thank you for the boost you gave me. Your site was the only thing that helped me stick with my goal of learning a new language and was part of my daily life for over 2.5 years. I'll be sad to leave.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/SamadhiGil

Hi, Luis. First, I would like to congratulate. If I can write in English now, even with errors, it is because of Duo too. If I can do my Phd course with more quality, reading fluently is because of Duo too. The Duo have a pretty and very important mission. But I feel that the mission of Duo is getting lost for advanced learners with this decision. But I understand. Reach more people is good and the right thing to do. But, do not leave anybody forever. I suggest that you think about and try to create, in the future, other instruments, like immersion, for advanced learners. It can be other app, other site. Why don't dreaming? Lastly, I would like to order something. I would like to download some translations that I made. It would be reasonable that immersion menu become available, only for download, for some days. It would be very fair In view of the fact that we were not advised in advance of the withdrawal of immersion. My best regards.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/CatherinGregory
CatherinGregory
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Duolingo has been dumbing down for ages. Lost immersion cinches it, like a lack of upper levels, and what am I doing with 7734 lingots? It's all gone bad. The chats and the clubs are for babies. So sad, it could have been really good. It was a good run ... now I'm done at 1100 days.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tknit
tknit
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So agree with you. I was so impressed by the vast vocabulary I learned doing immersion, which duolingo could see the value!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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I read that Duolingo made tests, and that immersion has proved to have no real value for learning...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JillLefrancois

more nastiness

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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??? Are you trolling every comments or what you write has a meaning?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tknit
tknit
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So very sad to see this decision. Immersion provides a continuing usage tooL that relieves you from the tedious daily exercises. I look at the many users with 800 and 1000 continuous usage days and know they did no do this simply with rote exercises. Even more sad, is when you think that the daily exercises have not been expanded quickly or widely enough to make up for this loss of immersion. BRING IMMERSION BACK!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/feanarosurion

I've invested so much into Duolingo I'm not going to leave. But I'm turning towards other resources geared more towards advanced learners. Your attempt to find the lowest common denominator of language learner is alienating people like me who want to go in depth in their language learning. Things have gotten worse since I joined and I'm disappointed.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/brewkob
brewkob
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It really seems like you're moving in the wrong direction, Duo.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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Livemocha did the same.. Maybe they have been secretly bought by Rosetta Stone or Babbel?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/EricBainbr
EricBainbr
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Luis, you may want to reconsider this decision. I understand that you are dealing with specific technological limitations for your site and that this may (at first blush) be a quick fix, but a review of the comments on this thread may tell you something entirely different. At the very least, I would have hoped to have seen some sort of questionnaire from Duo to a portion of the users to determine through data what your best course of action would be. Chatbox is extraordinarily limited in its communication and does not provide for any viable real world usage (seriously, I'm not assisting in a salon or zoo any time soon) whereas the Immersion process enables us to see specific nuance in the language. You have provided a wonderful and enlightening tool to the world; don't waste this because you didn't utilize data!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MrSilbarit
MrSilbarit
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Seems like an absolutely appalling decision to take, to remove an active and highly frequented part of your community features on the premises of "limited resources". If your concern is with looking good as a company, there are better ways than antagonizing your user-base by simply removing what you deem inefficient.

If as a company you are falling to keep up with operational costs, I can understand that actions need to be taken, but it just makes no sense to me how knocking down immersion could help you achieve that.

You say the changes you are taking aim to further the social an interactive aspects of your platform, yet from a user point of view it only seems this is a move funded out of either corporate greed or ineptitude.

If advancing the learning experience is in your mind, why make a move that detracts from it and not do anything to compensate? Was retiring immersion such a priority that you could not delay it until whatever you plan on doing in the future to actually make learning on your platform better was released, or at least even announced?

And your chatbots and clubs are all fine and dandy, I appreciate new features being added, except that to me, as an android user who is not using this platform in family or friends, none of these do anything to improve my "learning experience". From my point of view of a user like me, the latest updates have not improved it in any way besides a leaderboard with two people on it who are not planning in competing anyway while in the meantime managing to hinder it by removing a handy tool for learning grammar and structures.

In short, I will be deeply disappointed if the changes you are undertaking are for nothing. I hope you know when you are going from here because this first step was definitely a false one.

Oh and it seems rather crude for you to say your thanks to the community in a language that has been requested by them for years, even if it is understandable that course in such language can be particularly challenging.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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In comparison to the site as a whole, Immersion wasn't particularly highly trafficked. Even if you doubt the veracity of Luis' numbers, just looking at the number of people learning a given language versus the regular users of Immersion will show that a relatively tiny percentage of users ever used it in a serious fashion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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Given that Immersion wasn’t available through the apps, wasn’t available for courses that came from the Incubator, and wasn’t available for users on the wrong side of the A/B test, one shouldn’t be surprised that Immersion wasn’t particularly highly trafficked.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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Also - not available for new users, or those who lived within the EU.
I'd like to know what proportion of the subset of Duolingo users who actually had access to immersion made use of it...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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Those who lived within the EU - does that include the UK? I'm in the UK and I had immersion.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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A conflict with EU law - because I translated some articles online? Seriously? My understanding was there was a potential conflict only if they were trying to make money from selling translations, and that idea as far as I know had been abandoned long ago. Certainly I never worked on any of the commercial translations.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/b05aplmun.ca
b05aplmun.ca
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In theory, you weren't supposed to use it, even though you had the button, as there was a conflict with EU law.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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There's "not highly trafficked" and then there's "barely used"...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/scilling
scilling
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“Wasn’t particularly highly trafficked” were your words, not mine. If that wasn’t what you’d meant, then write what you mean instead.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MrSilbarit
MrSilbarit
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No, I believe the numbers he's quoting. I don't think he'd published them when I wrote this, or at last I hadn't read them. And while, it makes me understand his position a bit better, the number alone still doesn't make me comfortable. For instance, does that number take into account users on all platforms, as Scilling said, or only on PC? Does that number take into account active and inactive users, people who made an account but never made use of it? And for that matter, what percentage of the userbase even knew about the feature?

I can't blame Luis if there was no other possible option, but this could definetly have been handled better, as it is, it just makes me feel dissapointed.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ozzychris
ozzychris
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Very disappointing. I trust that you will quickly fill the void with something other than basic language for beginners. The translation format has been instrumental for maintaining my language skills as well as for keeping abreast of current affairs around the world. Not sure if I'll keep using DL now - of course depending on whether you do replace it with something similar.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/the3lusive
the3lusive
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How about you get rid of clubs and bring back immersion ?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/KevanSF
KevanSF
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Yes!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Fritz90703
Fritz90703
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Yes that is also my wish

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Macjory
Macjory
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Luis (may I call you that? seems many people do think they are on a first-name basis with you) I can't begin to tell you how much I appreciate Duolingo, and the fact that I was able to learn Portuguese, French, Spanish and a bit of Irish with it. At the same time, I am very deeply saddened to learn of your decision about Immersion. As a 300+ tier member in Spanish, I used Immersion to deepen my ability to read and understand Spanish: enough so that I can now read primary materials written in Spanish! I even began learning how to write Spanish: a real test of how well you understand Spanish grammar. I also met an amazing community of fellow learners, and enjoyed interacting with them as we sought to improve the translation of an article or piece of literature. As far as I am concerned, there is nothing like Immersion on the Internet. I am surprised that you made the decision to remove it without considering other sources of support: e.g., a subscription option that would allow learners to continue to use Immersion. I am sure there are hundreds, if not thousands, of users who would consider paying for the privilege of using your platform to continue their learning and to continue participating in the community they found in Immersion. May I ask: is your decision final? Is there anything that I -- and my fellow learners -- can do to persuade you to reconsider it?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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I imagine (though it's just a guess) that Duolingo would feel making immersion a paid option is simply creating a two-tier system which disadvantages those who cannot afford it. That's opposite to the notion of free language education for all, and it seems very much not what Duolingo is about.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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Money is important. Nothing can be made without it. This business model fails, but with partnership and creativity, a lot of creative business model can be found.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/iToochPlayer

Immersion was fun and enjoyable while it lasted.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Finally! I think it's been over a year since test started.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/danliebman

I am really shocked and saddened by this. I am just getting started but its quite obvious that was unique is this particular aspect of community that made our site special. Please respectfully reconsider or at least pose to the community options that could keep it going.. Thank you for everything as always!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/anitafunny3
anitafunny3
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Immersion was a motivation and to more learn also with the community. No more Immersion, no motivation, then, I think, I'll forget Duolingo forever! Sorry!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ViejaMary
ViejaMary
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Remember that just last week the CEO was promising that immersion would be right back. Abandoning their higher-level learners was not a thoughtful strategic decision. It was a panic response to severe operational problems. Let's continue to gracefully make it known that panic is not the way to conduct business and hopefully when the panic ends they will reconsider.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Luscinda
Luscinda
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Or else someone was lying through his teeth...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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They did bring it back pretty quickly after he said that so there aren't really grounds for making that kind of an accusation.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JillLefrancois

told you, nothing but nasty, ungrateful people

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Strawberryslug

I wish there was a choice for each Duolingo user - to use this site, without Immersion, or to use the old site, and run the risk of a stranger looking at your translation. Could you please make that a choice? I bet many other Duolingo users will agree. I am wondering if the makers of Duolingo will make that possible. Vote up / give lingot to show that you're in favor with me, if you are (I don't mind if you only vote up, but show if you're in favor or not by (at least) voting)!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Strawberryslug

This means I can never get another translation tier. I was so proud that I had actually gotten and tier, then another, and another, and was hoping for a fourth. Never will I ever get another tier unless the makers of Duolingo do something.

I feel that something has gone seriously wrong. Duolingo, you are probably losing many people from this. Why did you do this?

It is hard to understand authorities sometimes, even though they have their explanation in the article.

Goodbye, Duo! It was nice to have you, but I can't help but leave, only to visit once in a while, because of this.

There are no words to express my disappointment and sadness.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jabenpor
jabenpor
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godbye immersion?, goodbye duolingo

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/catygr
catygr
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I am profoundly saddened and disappointed at this news. Not only no more Immersion which I found really helpful in my language learning, but Activity seems to be lost too. These were the two outstanding features of Duolingo for me. And no way to ask simple questions, or keep in touch with the friends I have made on here in the process. Restore Immersion and I would stay.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Activity is down only temporarily.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GeoffPenn
GeoffPenn
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Duolingo is a very good tool for a beginner. I would have liked to see improvements that would help intermediate to advanced learners, so eliminating Immersion seems like a step in the wrong direction. From a business perspective, blowing off your most engaged community, the community most committed for the long term, seems like a mistake.

No matter. Duolingo management has the right to make decisions as they see fit. Given that Duolingo is free, we can't complain about being ripped off. I expect to complete the Italian tree and maintain my German and Spanish trees, at least for now. When I am ready to begin another language I will consider using Duolingo to get started. But I will also gradually shift my efforts to other tools more suited to my needs. That's the way it goes; you find something that works for you, you stick with it, over time something changes and you need to find something else.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/marissamor996461

Is anything going to be put in place of Immersion?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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The replacement are the silly "clubs" that no adult would ever use.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JillLefrancois

wow, appealing to their target market. How dare they.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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I was forgetting Duolingo is owned by you and you know very well their business model, you know WHO is their target. You know everything. I suggest you take Luis' job.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/drjsoundsgood

If you wanted to save on resources, you should have gotten rid of Clubs. We don't learn anything from clubs. It isn't even a good incentive to 'keep practicing'. Immersion helped me evaluate my progress; how many sentences can I translate given what I know at this point?

If you want to make Duolingo better, optimize on your resources, and make users happier, ask us what we want.

In my opinion, you need to improve/bring back:

Immersion - I already made my point above Duels with friends - this is good practice and more valuable than those lame clubs Lingot store - this is incentive to keep practicing and earning lingots

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JillLefrancois

I see lots of people asking how to keep learning without Immersion. I play the Facebook game "Criminal Case" in French. It's brilliant for learning conversations, and there is lots of repetition of nouns spotting hidden objects. I am amazed how much more I understand after ten days!! Loads of games have language options, it's really worth trying :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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First and only one message I see from you, without insults and with positive things.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tpamm
tpamm
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Sorry. Clubs and discussions are not for me. The immersion tool was one of the major reasons I was using Duolingo. Have not necessarily decided to quit, but I am considering doing so very strongly.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Marymacincv

I am very sad to hear that immersion is gone for good. I have been an enthusiastic supporter of Duolingo for 2 years and have told numerous friends and family about it. I really do not see much point in my staying on Duolingo now. I completed my tree and reached level 25. Doing translations was all that was left. I think that Duolingo is making a big mistake in this decision. What am I going to do with 1175 Lingots? :(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Mystical_Ame

You just got rid of one of your best features. Just fail. The site is worthless to non beginners now.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/WahahaDrills
WahahaDrills
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It always was. Immersion wasn't run by teachers but by people around your level.
You have to move on to bigger and better things, or at least add something different.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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"It always was". No, I meet people from all level in Duolingo. When I'm really advanced in one language, I help users, and have been helped by very advanced users in languages I learn. I am myself a former teacher. I met advanced users on immersion too. So "by people around your level": no. Immersion was the only thing really interesting for advanced users, and creative for beginners. There is no other creative way to use what you've just learn now. it's all mechanical and robotical. We though one time that advanced level trees would develop, but it was a false hope.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ivolindbergh

Dear Luis: the learning tree is very good for beginning, but doesn't make you go further. Immersion is the only tool that makes us really improve and go beyond the basic. Please reconsider.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/pmagnuson
pmagnuson
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I am very sad to see this go. I feel it's one of the most helpful ways to use DL for me - and if used well, with students. Just redoing non-contextualized sentences not very justifiable for anything past intermediate use. Thank you for the time you did have it. Good luck.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/GCHOTEAU

I feel like three years of my life were rubbed out in one instant...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/territrades
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I have to agree to Luis - Immersion was a good idea, but the execution was not well-made. Most of the time you were fighting with far too long sentences from wikipedia and other translators who downvoted you because your translation was not 'direct' enough (not to speak of the trolls).

You all have to remember that Luis' vision of Duolingo was purely Immersion, people translating the Internet while learning a new language. The trees were only meant to give an introduction into the language before the real work begins. This vision did not come true, and I dare say it was hardest for Luis himself to let Immersion go.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mosfet07

All that they had to do was to give the uploader an ability to restrict access to the article to trusted users only.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/territrades
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So that only you and a few selected friends can view it? That contradicts the idea of offering education to everybody. Furthermore, if you want to practise by translating texts with your friends, you can still do this, you don't need Duolingo for that. Use Google Docs for example.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daffodil2015
daffodil2015
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Immersion was a GREAT idea and honestly I would have happily given up the XPs and translation tiers (and with it the incentive for trolls) - the thing is, right now there's little to no incentive for me (and probably for many advanced learners as well) to come back. I know the Spanish tree by heart and to be honest some of the Memrise courses taught me a lot more than the tree. Yet I stayed with Duo and not Memrise for close to two years now BECAUSE of Immersion. I realize it's a free resource and, as such, you don't get to complain about what's being offered, but as far as I'm concerned, Duo just downgraded from being THE language learning site to being just one of many, with nothing to make it stand out. The site I've come to love and visit every single day, sometimes for hours on end, has lost its magic. I've had days when I made 1500-1800 XP while on tier 1 just on translating entire articles - and those were the days I felt I learned the most. (I would have loved to at least have to possibility to save that before it was gone forever.) To now go back to "the elephant drinks milk" and "I eat apples, you eat bread" seems like a cruel joke.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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How is it not for everybody? ANYBODY can form a group and start translating.

Google Docs is only a viable technique for a relatively small team.
Don't downplay the unique aspects of Duolingo's (misnamed) immersion facility: it was the real-time notifications combined with instantaneous updates that enabled people from all over the world to work together - and if that isn't empowering, i don't know what is!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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It's not such a bad idea, the "trusted users". The private clubs they try to build: their clubs could be "translating clubs", so that is the trusted users... A team working on a specific text together.

And no, that's not true, you can't pratice translations alone or with your friend the way it is on this site. I can learn languages elsewhere too, but it's not the same thing than here. And if I don't have any online or real friends? If nobody of my friends learn the same language? If nobody of my friends like to translate. Why do you think immersion will be regreted and people come here if it's so easy that you make a gathering with your friend and start to translate random texts?? How will I gamify? By allowing good translaters to have a cup of tea with cakes, and bad ones being deprived of dessert? Seriously....

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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I would prefer a not perfect immersion, with a lot of frustration, that a perfect nothing with no frustration. That's sure the clubs will not frustrate anyone, but they are also totally useless, so... If it was not well build, it can be re-build!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/icklepet

I'm really sad that the immersion feature is gone as I've already completed the tree and now I'm just doomed to endless repeats of the same exercises, or waiting until a new bot pops up. Do you think you'll bring it back at some point? It was a valuable tool for learners. Thanks anyways.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PetersonLiz

I'm very very very sorry to see Immersion go. That's what I learn most from. It has saved hours of time and effort because you don't have to look up every unfamiliar word in the dictionary. It's a natural way to catch on to grammar. One of my Duolingo friends from France has been reading huge lumps of classical American and English short stories asking me for help only about once every two weeks. All this will now stop unless you can tell us another place to go to get similar help with translating. But thanks so much for what you have done in the past. It has given my language learning a huge boost. I guess that this is goodbye.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Neon_Iceberg
Neon_Iceberg
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A petition for the restoration of Immersion. Please sign in:

https://www.change.org/p/luis-von-ahn-don-t-turn-duolingo-into-a-game

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VeledaLorakeet
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Signed

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/becky3086
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Well, in all the time I have been here, I never did figure out how to use Immersion so am not going to miss it. I don't use the groups because I hear they are useless and I have android so no Bots for me. I miss my activity stream but never really talked to anyone on it either just left comments on it where others won't bother me about them like on the forum. Whatever, keep learning...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/robsaidthat

Well, you just said good-bye to me. No need to bookmark this site anymore.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lisa4duolingo
lisa4duolingo
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Well, after the funny, yet snarky, cartoon you once posted for me, I will be sad to see you go. And I really mean that. Anyone on this site who can end a minor disagreement with humor (as you did) is someone we need here at Duolingo. Though the black hole that Immersion seems to have been sucked up into was a good-bye for you, Duolingo will always be waiting for you with the open, soft, feathery wings of a bright green owl should you decide to return. Until then, best wishes to you, robsaidthat.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Merrowmic
Merrowmic
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I never even had the opportunity to experience Immersion, but I had hoped that it would be available to subscribers like me.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PotatoSanta
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120 downvotes so far, I don't think I have ever seen such an unpopular post. I just hope you replace it with something good or there will be a lot of disappointed users. Duolingo might even lose some.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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Replacement: clubs.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Ian.Worthington
Ian.Worthington
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Killing immersion seems to kill off the stated business goal, viz translating the internet. Has then DL changed direction into simply being a cheap provider of language certification?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
jrikhal
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he stated business goal, viz translating the internet. Has then DL changed direction

Yes, they have changed it and abandoned Immersion has being part of their business plan long ago

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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So what is the NEW business plan. We have the right to know. I think it is linked to premium gift or feature in clubs.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DavidOldacre

Sorry to hear that. This was a useful tool for me to learn French - but now it is gone, there are only somewhat less than useful lessons. Good luck in the future. I will probably stop using your system soon.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/a507
a507
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È solo una questione di soldi? Potevi inserire un banner pubblicitario, o chiedere una offerta di iscrizione, tutti saremmo stati contenti di contribuire. Addio Duolingo.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/EricBainbr
EricBainbr
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Sono d'accordo. Almeno ho potuto incontrarmi con voi su questo sito e sarà in grado di mantenere il contatto con voi. Duolingo sta facendo un grande errore qui.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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Money is everything. Can't do nothing without it. You, me, everyone. But it's probably a lot more hard to do that some ads banners, because they would already do it if it was the case.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Strawberryslug

I'm almost certain I'm going to abandon Duolingo... except for the occasional skill refresh.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Koogla1

Good idea. It was too hard anyway. Can we have a function where we can blow each other kisses, or make the page full of sparkles?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/lisa4duolingo
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I can see all sorts of problems ensuing with this idea. If this is ever added, please allow users to opt out of it.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bc_colacino
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It's interesting you use the word "evolving" when it's clear the app is headed backwards. Wasn't the whole purpose of Duolingo to translate the web from and to every language? Wasn't immersion the way to do that? What we are left with is a very colorful and robotic way to learn the basics -- and ONLY the basics. Chatbots are only useful if your idea of language fluency is seeing the question "Is the cat gray?" and answering, "Yes, the cat is gray." I just don't see how that's progress in any definition of the word.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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Yes, translating the web WAS the purpose back when they thought it could be a reliable revenue source. This has not been the case for a couple of years.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/bc_colacino
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Don, you're right, and I think you touched on the sad reality of the app in 2017 -- and that it is entirely driven by profit and not for greater social good. I realize that we live and work in a mostly capitalist market, but at one time it was refreshing to see an organization that seemed like they just wanted to help people communicate. Now that's gone, replaced by a revenue-driven model that has taken what was once a noble pursuit and turned it into a slightly less useless version of Candy Crush. I'm being dramatic, I know, but it's a disappointing decision and the app creators should be aware of that.

I appreciate the reply.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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It has nothing to do with capitalism. You can't work and being fed by the air around you, you need money to buy food, clothes, your rent, as people in Duolingo. They can't work for free even if it's for an educational purpose. Teachers are not capitalist, but they worried about money sometimes!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/spelaeus
spelaeus
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And if you reply 'the cat is grey' it complains anyhow!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/macaalmada

Dear Luis, im so sad you had to take that decision. Immersion was the best tool of Duo, and now, wtihout it, i feel i lost many hours there. Hopefully you can solve it and put it back, we need it!

Despite all, i wish your new tools will be so interesting and successful than Immersion

Best of luck!

Macarena. Argentina.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/XD29
XD29
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I haven't read everyone else's comments. All I'd like to add is that I am deeply saddened by this decision. Duolingo is not nearly as much fun as it used to be. I hope we will at least get our activity streams back, so I can tell my Duo friends goodbye :'(

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/81cheney
81cheney
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Don't worry about the activity streams, it's just an A/B test. I still have mine, good luck in the future.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/XD29
XD29
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Thank you for your reply. The streams came back after I had posted. They were disabled due to server problems, it was not an A/B test. Meanwhile my Duo friends and I have found other possibilities to stay in touch. Good luck to you, too!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ecrowley2

I can only say how disappointed I am with this decision. I now have no reason to stay with Duolingo. I joined about one and a half years ago and have earned a 567 day streak. I really enjoyed learning and I'm very sad to say 'Adieu!'

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/IanShales
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In my opinion you made a big mistake getting rid of Immersion!!!!!! You got rid of the Immersion feature and you will soon start losing Duolingo users.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BCEagle
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I'm just really sad about this. This was a feature I really enjoyed and used regularly. There's not much else valuable about Duolingo to me. This will leave a hole in my leisure time as I don't know of any other sites that work the same way. But on the up side, I'll spend more time with my kids and have more time to do translations I actually get paid for so it's probably better for me in the long run...

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/MaryClevel

I'd be willing to pay to continue immersion. Is that a possibility?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Starlight2011

I hope so, Immersion was a GREAT feature.......;/

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/phaeluis
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618 comments until now! Should be the champion topic of comments and also the saddest! I stayed for over an hour reading the reviews and did not go through 10%. I will continue later, but from what I read, the great regret is not only mine and it seems to be the majority!

What makes me sad is that I've been "dating" IMMERSION for months. At the end of last year I decided that I would start the translations this year, but I decided to finish the last missing tree (Portuguese) as a criterion to finally start the immersion! In a week I estimate that I would complete this tree, but ... How unlucky that on the 19th of this month (January), this tool was subtracted!

That Luis guy, who seems to own the Duo, was not very polite in announcing this cut. It was very shallow, spoke in a difficult decision but did not justify the unilateral measure minimally. He made promises of new tools and improvements but gave no example or explanation!

From the comments of colleagues, it seems that IMERSÃO was the main differential of Duo compared to other learning applications.

In my opinion, the Duo has already started the year very badly. I hope Luis gets sensitized with the reports of the galera and go back in this decision a priori nonsense!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Linda_from_NJ

Exactly! What is the improvement? I looked for clubs and couldn't find them. Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm not sure why there are even different clubs. If "clubs" are like Facebook, however, then I'm not interested. It was the learning and collaborative aspect of Immersion that I liked, and I don't start to consider people to be friends until I can see them face to face.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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I don't think that "Luis" is not very polite. He is, but it was certainly hard to manage. The thing I can reproache them is that they lie a little about a feature they knew would be removed, by diplomacy. And also, that their communication is very poor. Not Luis'fault.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/annika_a
annika_a
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Re: diplomacy and communication... They've been trying to get a bit better at these lately.

But I would argue that as CEO and co-founder, Luis is responsible for both the good and the bad here.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/AlmogL
AlmogL
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I am very sad about this. I understand that you have to make tough decisions. I got so much out of Duolingo, and for free and I know that you need to survive as a business. But at the point where I am now, immersion was the only thing keeping me on Duolingo and now I have no reason to stay.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mosfet07

By the way, this topic in one day got more downvotes than the topic about Clubs got upvotes in 3 weeks!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Mariajo2345
Mariajo2345
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To work as a team has been for me more than a learning of languages. I also have made good friends, I have had many good time...I am sad and disappointed .

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/WCGB
WCGB
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I am speaking to represent all web-only users.

Hello, this decision greatly limits what you can do with the web version. You have increasingly gave all of your time to the apps, not knowing what this would mean for the web users who don't have access to the new features. This immersion retirement is a devastating blow to the quality of the site. And might I remind you that the original goal of Duolingo was to translate the web, which you have now gotten rid of. Also, a lot of users used Immersion regularly to keep their streak going, because it was fast and easy for the limited amount of time that they had. I have made the successful transition to using practice to get XP, but a lot of users don't have the time. I would imagine that a lot of the original users, who came here to translate the web, have gilded all of their trees, and don't want to learn any more languages because they have already learned 5 or 6 would switch to another site due to this decision. Of course the number of users that leave might not be very many, but it would represent a turning point in the use of Duolingo.

Thank you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/xaghtaersis
xaghtaersis
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That is a lot of downvotes. Luis. This negativity is not good for duolingo. Removing immersion was not a good move.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JohnWycliffe
JohnWycliffe
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What specifically were you lacking in terms of resources required to maintain immersion? Last I heard, you had tens of millions of dollars from Google and others that you didn't know what to do with. Granted, immersion wasn't perfect - many uploads were poor quality and a lot of sentences were translated incorrectly without getting noticed/corrected by the community - but it was an important tool for learning more complex, real-world sentences and forcing you to think abstractly.

I wish I had used it more before it disappeared. I guess I was focusing too much on the trees thinking immersion would be there when I was done, since you guys had talked about getting rid of it for a long time without doing anything. I have to say, though I spent little time on it, I vastly preferred translating stories such as Hansel Gretel or articles about LotR to disconnected single sentences with no context or purpose.

At the very least, are there plans to replace it with something similar but easier to maintain? Maybe you could make is so users have to have a certain translation tier before they can upload documents over a certain size to prevent spamming of content? Or perhaps only mods and admins can submit articles, but anyone can translate? Maybe they could be on separate servers to reduce the traffic load to duolingo, thus preventing slowdowns?

P.S. - You've never gotten anywhere near that many down-votes before, maybe you should listen? Speaking of down-votes, are you still sure only 0.05% of Duo users use immersion? Maybe that's only on a daily basis or in the last 24hrs or something. I highly doubt it's that low overall.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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There are currently nearly 600 downvotes. The least trafficked course for English speakers on this site has 46.4 thousand users. Assuming all these votes were from people doing the Romanian course, that would still only account for less than 0.13 of users.

Spanish from English has almost 78 million users. A paltry 600 downvotes is nothing to get excited about.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JohnWycliffe
JohnWycliffe
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It's not 600 down-votes, it's 600 more down-votes than up-votes. Take that into consideration. And now it's almost 700. Plus the fact that most users don't even check the discussions, and those that do don't always up-vote or down-vote posts, so it truly represents the sentiments of tens if not hundreds of thousands of users at a minimum.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ID-007
ID-007
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John, for a short term solution, check out:

http://communitytranslation.freeforums.net/

See ya!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/VeledaLorakeet
VeledaLorakeet
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Not everybody gets to the point where they are able to use immersion. Most people on here only have a few courses in the higher numbers. So I do not think the comparison is fair, or that the 0.5% justification for that matter is fair.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BarbaraMorris
BarbaraMorris
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That's a great point about the 0.5% justification not being justified.

I don't think it was really necessary to reach some highish level before being able to use Immersion. When I started, I got my first "You can now translate 0.1% of articles" invitation to participate in Immersion quite early on in the tree, maybe even before reaching the first milestone. I remember it vividly. I spent over an hour translating one fairly short sentence, finding translation sites (but not finding the word I was looking for), finding Spanish-language sites that did have the word, and struggling to understand those sites (using Google Translate) until I finally had a translation that made sense. It was thrilling. And what was also thrilling was that I somehow had a marked improvement in my ability to retain new words in the lessons. That jump in ability happened frequently after extended bouts of Immersion during my first trip down the tree.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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There was the possibility to translate only very short and easy sentences in easy text, to upload your own texts, to be sure it was easy enough, like little stories for kids, etc and to make a great number of mistakes if you need, with no consequences. So, I wonder, why do you think you had to reach a very good level to use immersion?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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I think you are misunderstanding Veleda's point. They are not saying that immersion was useful to only a few people.
But it is true that an absolute beginner will not use it at first, so in calculating the percentage of the user base who were using it, it is misleading to include the total number of users in a measure of how "few" people were using it, as that includes those who were not yet ready to do so.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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I understood that the exact opposite way. Thayk you.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
flootzavutPlus
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I'm saying that 600 downvotes as compared to even a small fraction of Duolingo's user base is minuscule. That's just a fact, it's in the maths. You can argue about who does and doesn't get immersion and when people start to use it, but like I say, in the context of 78 million, 600 is not a large number. 'Cause it's really not. If you're going to argue reasons to keep immersion, this is a very poor one and doesn't help your case.

Even if I was to assume that only ten percent of people got to the point of using immersion, even based on a tiny language like Romanian, that would still be just over 1%. That's a tiny proportion of one of the least trafficked courses. It isn't making your point when most of the course's count users in the millions, quite literally.

There are arguments for keeping I'immersion, good ones. This is not one of them.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
Theron126
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I strongly suspect the 78 million number is spurious. What is that, the total number of accounts - including sockpuppets, people who created an account, reached level 5 and never came back, and so forth? I'd be very surprised if the number of active learners is anywhere near the cited 78 million.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/gizzard123
gizzard123
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78 million? I'd be surprised if there are 20 million active users. Most people drop out after a few weeks and don't bother canceling their account. Out of about 15 of my friends who signed up in the last two years, there is only one that is active. Six hundred downvotes in 3 days is a lot! For each one of those downvotes, there are probably a hundred who won't bother to say or do anything.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Just try to find another Duolingo comment with so many downvotes. That is the real comparison, in my opinon, as most of Duo users have no access to the forum (from mobile devices), :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mpbraendle
mpbraendlePlus
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I agree with you that there are better arguments to keep immersion. But your argument is flawed, too. How many of these 78 million users did visit this thread? It's as with voting in politics: Only those count that have voted (either pro or against). You don't know what is the opinion of those who did not vote or visit this thread. If it's 606 downvotes against 6 up votes, it's 99% to 1%. If it is 39000300 downvotes against 38999700 upvotes, its 50.0004% against 49.9996% - but still a majority.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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Don't spend your time in silly maths with silly conclusions. Your way to calculate has nothing at all that is a bit science-like. Why on earth would you compare the numbers of people who learn Romanian with the number of persons who vote or downvotes? That's totally silly ! Most of the people who take the lessons (even if they were all active !) probably never use the forum. If you want to compare numbers in a meaningful way, not a silly one, take the number of votes on the thread that had the more votes in the forum history, and compare with this thread ! Don't try to be a statistician.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesJWRobinson

This is a decision akin to a driving school announcing they're no longer going to provide any practical lessons on the roads

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DavidOldacre

Have you thought about charging for the Immersion feature. I recognize that you need income to stay in business - but I for one would be willing to pay a reasonable annual fee for that feature?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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I don't know if they are allowed to make the user pay directly a kind of subscription in their business model

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/EugeneTiffany

Sad news. I was planning to have the book, Romo Elizabeth, I am working on, translated in Immersions.

I can't for the life of me understand what purpose the Clubs would serve toward the learning of a language or even how they could function. Like, say, I wasn't a loner INTP and I wanted to feel I belonged so wanted to join one of clubs. What clubs? Which clubs? Whoes clubs? This idea has not been well thought out.

The missing personal messages on the Profile page is a great loss. Many students have asked me to help them out with some particular thing, and I have gotten help myself through the use of personal messages. The Clubs can't serve this use.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
DonFiore
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The personal messages, if you want to call them personal, will be back. The staff have confirmed this.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/EugeneTiffany

Cool. That, at least, is good news. Thanks for the intel.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/xMira_
xMira_
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Ha, yeah. right.

7 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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I hope the one I didn't read won't be lost.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PatsyDunning

I will be leaving Duolingo. I have been through the available program three times and practice a little every day, but Immersion was the reason I stuck around. Goodby to my friends.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/em7ec
em7ecPlus
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Then why should someone stick around after learning the basics? How Duo worked before, we learn the basics of a language by mastering the skill tree, maybe doing a little translating now and then, and then we could continue practicing on /real/ examples of the language -- and translating real German or real French could also contribute to leveling up, maintaining streaks, etc.

Now, once someone has learned a language, are we supposed to maintain it by practicing sentences like "I am eating a potato" over and over again? Sure, there are unlimited other resources for practice, but they're not Duolingo, and they don't affect our numbers on Duolingo (which, be honest, is a lot of the reason why people stick around), so why shouldn't we just delete Duolingo?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Rainbowrebellion

I am so sad. Can't believe.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/iwc2ufan
iwc2ufan
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Even though I saw it coming, that is a real pity. I hadn't used it recently, but only because it wasn't available for the languages I'm focusing on. It was invaluable for me for Portuguese and Spanish a few years ago.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/burramys

Dear Luis, I will miss it greatly. I LOVED translating - it made French seem very real to me and I loved learning about new people/things via the translating. I admit it was getting a bit bogged down in incomplete translations. Perhaps one day in the future you will find a way to have a comparable activity - I'm not one for chat rooms! All the very best to you all and thank you a hundred times over for all you do. Duolingo is truly amazing. Judy

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Dear Luis, I am sorry to have to insist on the question about translations already done, but we would appreciate any kind of answer about this issue https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20382789.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/filbertkm
filbertkmPlus
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Agree. I would like to at least be able to view translations I was working on and maybe can continue working on them elsewhere.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
letra_a
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Filbertkm, it seems there is no answer to that question after more than a week. We are only asking for accessing Immersion in read mode one more month to download our work, but ...

I just want to tell you you can still retrieve your completed translations through the mails Duo sent to you (those which the subject "A document you uploaded has received some attention" or similar in other languages). There is a link in those mails to retrieve a .txt version of the translated document. Anyway, uncompleted translations cannot be downloaded. I hope this will be of any help :)

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/filbertkm
filbertkmPlus
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There were things I was working on translating. It is disappointing to not be able to continue and also not even able to view these anymore.

Translation is useful for more advanced learners and to keep users engaged.

PS. I haven't found the club feature useful yet. It would only be useful if I can be in a group with other users at my level. Translation is more useful for engaging with other advanced users in learning.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/BarbaraMorris
BarbaraMorris
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I've only read a bit about the Club feature, but it seems like it would mostly (only?) be people we already knew. The great thing about Immersion was that we'd encounter people we didn't know before.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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Not that you know, because you can give your code on a forum, but limited to always the same 15 persons.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Andrea_Palumbo

This is very disappointing. I am seriously questioning the value of this site to me. Immersion was really the only thing keeping me here, since I completed the Spanish tree and there hasn't been any effort to add content for intermediate - advanced learners.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/piscean59
piscean59
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so sad. to see abandoning of immersion

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ejm_etherwork

very disappointed....

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/tontonjl
tontonjl
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What a pity! I'm really hardly disappointed sorry to see Duolingo becoming now just a primary school level course. By Duolingo.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/shackamaxonista

Talk about "throwing the baby out with the bathwater" . . . .?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/langbron

Please don't do this.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/caljas
caljas
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So, I log in today to do immersion, surprise! it's gone very sad only just discovered it about a month ago. The regular features after a while get boring and it was nice to use immersion to practice, vocabulary and syntax and see how others would turn a phrase. I hope Duo makes a separate app that can focus solely on immersion. I do not like the "clubs" attention Duo: not everybody connects with their "friends" online.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Chema913526

it's a sad news, the best part of Duolingo was the tab "Inmersion", it's a matter of fact, anyway, we have to assume it although we don't like this. I hope that you can change your mind.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PatsyDunning

By the way, did you think of making a small charge for Immersion. I would have paid it; maybe others would too.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Marymacincv

Good idea Patsy! I would have gladly paid a small charge for the chance to translate real news articles I think they are throwing the baby out with the bath water!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/john_treehugger
john_treehugger
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Very disappointed. Not feeling this is a very nice day at all.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/rcatlett
rcatlett
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I am disappointed that immersion is no longer a part of Duolingo. Use of immersion with the feedback from the immersion participants helped me to better appreciate the nuances of the languages that I translated. I hope that the immersion tool will be resurrected whether through Duolingo or by an independent group. Duolingo will still be a valuable tool for me - unfortunately not as valuable as with the immersion tool.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Roger_Burke

I am very disappointed because "Immersion" was real content and it drew me (and I am sure others) forward through the act of discovery. Even the voting it down was disappointing as it had been blocked at -514. Hopefully some of your new functionality will take it its place, but it would have been smarter to have that up and running before taking "Immersion down."

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Kim464633
Kim464633
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I guess you will have your reasons for this decision, but for me immersion will be sorely missed. After having completed the Italian tree up and down twice, it was only the immersion section that kept me going on duolingo and gave me the opportunity to practice and improve my italian. I agree with others that duolingo seems now to be only for the beginners.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/Marymacincv

I am going to post daily how discouraged I am by your decision to eliminate immersion. Maybe you will listen to all of us and bring it back. I do not want to leave Duolingo. I would be willing to pay a fee to have immersion as a useful learning tool. Please bring it back!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/ElijahCFGolpe
ElijahCFGolpe
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I personally never got to use Immersion, I always wanted to but I never understood where to find it or where it went, so this isn't too much to me, but what is frustrating is how much Duolingo has changed since I joined it.

It was great for a long time, and updates were totally exciting, but to not get updates for Android users, to get rid of Discussion Streams on every sentence on the mobile app (which were, and still are, wildly helpful), etc. It's disappointing. I was excited for lots of updates, but now it just seems like less content is available to me and other Android users especially. If you're going to take away Immersion, at least leave Discussion Streams available on the mobile app for both devices and I don't think it'd kill anyone if you guys tried to add Tips And Notes to each Skill that contains it on the mobile apps. If you're going to try and get this product out there again and keep being #1 with language, then please stop taking off features or at least, add some that could be useful on the mobile apps. I get that this website and app can be hard to manage, but something as simple as adding Tips and Notes, or reinviting Discussion Streams (we Android users already had them and they were recently taken out for god knows why), etc. I just feel like this website is going downhill with all these updates and mobile limitations.

I use Duolingo mostly on my phone for the reason that it's better to access/use via mobile. It feels a lot more personal and easy that way. To take away Community stuff, Discussion Streams on Mobile, and possibly Activity stuff and making it more, local, friend-based, it seems like all this app is good for, is learning a language to pass notes with immature friends in class. Which is fun, but we aren't practicing speaking, listening, notecards (especially the poor Android users such as moi lol), etc. and I just feel like I'm no longer learning, just guessing and guessing. There's no longer help from natives, just help from those in the club that are farther in the tree. I have to get on a computer which is frequently used by others and longer to set up, etc.

If you're going to take away immersion, I'm just hoping you guys fix the mobile stuff up again. I don't think it'd be too hard to manage compared to Immersion. But I think that's a good compromise. Also, it'd be nice to see these Apple Apps in the Android Store soon. C'est tout, merci pour la lecture et je souhaite à tout le monde "Bon Courage" avec ton apprenant de langue(s). Et, s'il vous plaît, excusez mes erreurs avec mon Français. Mdr

• • •

Also, as someone who's finished the English to French tree and did the reverse French To English, and is almost done with English to Spanish, I will have to say that I personally believe Sentence Discussions were the most helpful thing in the world on Duolingo. I would plead for it back on the apps everyday if I wanted to, but hopefully once is enough. At the end of the trees or when going through a confusing skill (sometimes with no Tips & Notes both on-app or online), to be able to see sentence discussions through the app (and I dunno if they took it off online, hopefully not, but maybe so), those were probably the things that helped me most understand and feel included in the Duo community. Although, I have to agree that Duolingo isn't a Starting and End Point for languages, if anything, it's only the Starting Point.

I would love to use Immersion, I never got to, but at the same time, I am really excited for something like the ChatBots. However, to be quite frank with everyone, Duo Clubs seem very strange to me. I get the whole, "friends learning languages together" thing, but it seems more like a game than learning. What will happen to the club when someone has a question in it, but no one answers because they're just as stumped on the question? They could make a discussion online, sure. But sentence discussions frequently already explained those questions and stuff.

And to have to go online to look at Tips & Notes all the time, to not get to use the Flashcards either, etc. I'm just really hoping that the decision to remove Immersion actually does something positive for mobile users (especially Android).

Es todo para ahora. Gracias para leyendo de nuevo. Duo había hacerme mucho, y es muy útil y bueno. Sólo es muy triste ahora, porque de estas "reasons" (hahaha, sorry my Spanish is even worse than my French). Thanks for listening/reading!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
daughterofAlbion
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Thank you for your perspective on this. There is a perception among website users that we are losing features because Duolingo has decided to concentrate on its mobile users, so it is very interesting to hear that from your perspective Android users are also losing features rather than gaining. Bonne chance avec tes études mon confrère!

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
PERCE_NEIGE
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I took a 2-years break from Duolingo, I came back recently, and the site is really poorer it was 2 years ago. I think Duolingo is certainly in crisis, and maybe will close. 2 years ago, we were full of projects and hope. 2 years later, projects never came to realization, few languages had been added in compaison to the hope, some languages were already in the incubator last time I came here, the same mistakes in the lessons are always here, despite having reported continuously, etc. It's the same site but with fewer and less working things.

1 year ago

[deactivated user]

    Thank you Mr. Von Anh. When will the activity feed come back? I really miss it. :(

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Zeitschleifer
    Zeitschleifer
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    I had never had Immersion since my day one here. Was it the beginning of the end?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
    PERCE_NEIGE
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    You are only level 10. Wait to be level 20 or 24, and we will see if you don't need to practice your skills.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Snowymemories

    Bye Immersion :(!!!!! It was nice know how awesome it was to use u!!!

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/JessePaedia
    JessePaedia
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    Does this mean Duolingo now has to rely on ads?

    29/11/11:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyzJ2Qq9Abs

    "No ads, no hidden fees, no subscriptions, just free".

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/jrikhal
    jrikhal
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    Ads already arrived on Duolingo (for some months).

    It's not "relying" on them, but uses them as one tool among others to "pay the bill". (It's not the exact wording of Duolingo in the few discussions where they officially talked about it, but it's more or less the idea of their statements).

    UPDATE
    Some links where they speak about/around it:

    "pay the bill" is phrased in the two more recent ones.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/JessePaedia
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    Okay. It just seems so weird for Duolingo to abandon the initial concept that started the website. Obviously, they need to pay the bill somewhere. I just hope they don't the idea of 'free education' and start charging us.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Luscinda
    Luscinda
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    Especially when you consider the extent to which people gave their time, energy and talent to develop the free product on the understanding that this original initial concept was the deal. Now Duolingo wants to profit from their efforts on an entirely different basis, once they've had the work out of the volunteers.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Gabrielle28671
    Gabrielle28671
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    Luscinda viens nous rejoindre ici https://www.duolingo.com/comment/20347474

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ian.Worthington
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    This is bau in many open projects. To their credit DL have never pretended to be anything else than a business.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ian.Worthington
    Ian.Worthington
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    DL is good, but it is NOT (yet?) anywhere near good enough to pay for.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
    PERCE_NEIGE
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    Seriously? It's better than many paid app. Which one would you consider better? (at the time of the immersion feature)?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    I don't know if you once tried to have you own firm in real life. You have a business model, and when your business model fails, you have to find another one or to shut your service. It's as simple as that.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/JessePaedia
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    I know how business models work but it's just sad to see one of original ideas that started duolingo be removed. I know it wasn't economical for them to keep it.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    I agree, and my concern is: won't they loss a lot of money trying to save it?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/francesmercy
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    How sad ! I never even had the opportunity to experience Immersion...

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Margaret_S

    This is so sad. It was an excellent resource and one that I had not found on other places. Perhaps you could allow it in some smaller way. I noticed you had thousands of open topics.... I was under the impression that the translation was being used to improve Wikipedia. Were you not submitting the translations to Wikipedia for entry?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/DonFiore
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    Not the staff, no. Maybe if users wrote new articles based on the translations. Years ago (2013-2014, maybe) they translated CNN and Buzzfeed articles but there were problems with something (quality, speed, I don't know).

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/BarbaraMorris
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    Quality, I bet. People tend not to get more than half-way through articles, and after they gamified Immersion, there was way too much of people blazing through articles pasting in the duobot "translation". Me, I never wanted to work on an article that was almost completely translated, since I liked a mix of improving and doing the first translation of a sentence.

    Also, at least with the Buzzfeed articles, many of them were so slangy and riddled with puns that it would be challenging even for someone completely fluent in both languages to get close to the spirit of the original English. When I was doing the Spanish->English tree, I tried making some corrections in cases where the Spanish-speakers needed help with the slang, but people kept reverting to their incorrect literal translations.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    They were pure bliss to translate, very hard, but I loved the puns. I was very disappointed when it was not understood by translater, but hey, it's the game...

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/.Hiyoribo.

    I don't think your decision is not good for member in Duolingo.

    For Example, my English from Vietnamese course, the lesson is so easy, and I can do all it in 1 time I test. So that, I want to have a immersion to improve my translate. I'm very need it now. I am going to write if I translate well.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/TygerOfFlames

    Luis, I have a question. I understand the decision to remove Immersion, despite the fact I dislike it, but what about Activity and streams? Communication with other users is vital, and if you removed Activity and Streams, communication would shrink to nearly nonexistant. Discussion is difficult and clunky to use most of the time, and Activity lets you see what your friends have commented on or learned recently, therefore allowing you more ability to help others learn. If you permanently took away Sentence Discussions, streams, Activity, and Immersion all at once, many many many users would quit, because there'd be little point using Duolingo any more. -Juliette

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
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    We are being assured that this is temporary. If not that will definitely be the end of me.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    I don't trust the "temporary". Not the first time they don't tell us the truth. They were saying that immersion was just expericing a bug, for instance....

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Theron126
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    Activity is back now though.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    I suspect they want to let activity inside your group. You would have to join a club to see that.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/hanjini
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    B-r-o-k-e-n h-e-a-r-t-e-d = loved loved Immersion

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Starlight2011

    ;(

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/purplewater

    I used immersion probably twice for Spanish but it would have been nice to use it for Esperanto. I really hope you all have something better up your sleeves since you're throwing away something that many people here value. It appears you are hinting towards Japanese. I hope that is the next language.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    Hints about Japanese? Which ones?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/kyburg
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    I am thankful for the learning so far, but Utterly Disappointed by the decision to take away immersion. Immersion is the very reason I spend time on Duo every day. it is what for me, and I am sure, for others as well, ensured continuation, language in context, and many a time knowledge expansion often beyond foreign language skills.

    It is a BIG Shame.

    Can the Immersion be made available to the public in open platform so the Duo users themselves can work on it? Please - Thank you

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/VeledaLorakeet
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    Not quite sure how long I have been here, how many hours I spend here learning.

    I am pretty sure it is not going to be much longer after immersion is gone. As a web user, there only is the tree and for a couple of languages it is full, probably going to finish some other trees and in the meantime I will be looking for another place.

    There are more places, I have seen several being mentioned here in the comments.

    It is a pretty sad affair. I will stop recommending duolingo to friends. And I will decouple my account with my FB account not to encourage people.

    Deeply deeply disappointed

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/yaffavered
    yaffavered
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    Immersion had an important role in motivating me to continue with Duolingo. I agree with all the comments sent by other people. Immersion is/was a wonderful tool for language training. Immersion helped in learning the real everday language . I am also considering to end my relations with Duolingo. I advise you reconsider your decision about Immersion.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/effyleven
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    What a terrible mistake! It seems now is the age of making horrible mistakes.... in one case I could mention, a dramatically WORLD CHANGING mistake. I used to come here as a refuge from even thinking about him. Now what do I do?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/ViejaMary
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    Upon further thinking of this from a business perspective I now understand that we are the problem.

    Duolingo has 110 million registered users - apparently a great success. The fact that 109 million of them don't actually use it, don't use it regularly, or use it only in trivial ways does not matter when the objective is for it to appear to be a great success. Unfortunately the 55 thousand who use it intensely are the problem. We eat up server capacity and bandwidth, the two resources behind the recent collapse of the system. The non-strategic and easiest way to fix the problem is to get rid of the intense users. Looking at my own profile, since the elimination of immersion, my personal usage has dropped from more than 1000 XP per day to about 50. I imagine that is the case for most prior immersion users. Problem identified - problem solved.

    To get immersion back we need to provide Luis with additional resources, in money, volunteer time and perhaps some professional management advice. He is a person with great ideas but also one who has sold his great ideas rather than leading the resulting businesses. Duolingo surely has many users with great experience and expertise. I would be glad to contribute time, money and consultation to make this what it can be.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/CommeuneTexane

    Perhaps I am just feeling too jaded and cynical at this point, but I doubt that our opinions and ideas count for very much... I hope I'm wrong.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/ViejaMary
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    One additional comment. If the goal is to reduce bandwidth and server capacity usage, the Words function is an easy one to eliminate. There is close to zero value derived from tracking and scoreing each individual's frequency of using specific words. I have actually looked at this functionality on multiple occasions to see if there is any possible use for it and have found none.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
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    I think the tracking of this information is an integral part of the algorithm that determines which sentences you are given as you complete or 'strengthen' a lesson. Whether the information in the Words tab is of interest to the user is a separate issue; the fact that Duolingo has not included it in any of the newer languages suggests that the administration may agree that this is not useful.
    Since the tracking of the information is integral to how the lessons function, this is unlikely to stop. Removing its display is unlikely to release significant bandwidth.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/lisa4duolingo
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    Some may believe that the Words tab is not useful, but if all you ever do is translate from target language to native language and/or vice versa, you never get practice with building sentences of your own, which, in my opinion, goes a long way toward building fluency. Sure, you could create your own list, one sentence at a time, using a notebook or electronic spreadsheet of some sort, but no need for the extra work if you've got a Words tab.

    For those courses that don't have it, some have created word lists and placed them on spreadsheets with a link for others to access them. (I think one of the Turkish moderators did this for Turkish ... quite nice of them to do this actually.)

    I'm not currently using the Words tab in the way that I know would be good for me -- seeking out weakest words and using them to build my own sentences -- but I plan to return to that practice. In the meantime, I check the tab every day just to see what my total word count is. It motivates me to watch it grow.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/gizzard123
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    There may be 110 million users, but how many are active users? Out of 15 friends who signed up because of me, only one is still active (~7%). The others dropped out a long time ago. I'll be extremely generous and say 20% are active users. That is around 22 million. In your other comment, you eliminating the "Words" function. I think it's an excellent idea! Whoever uses that function? I used it a few times, but there are other free programs to improve your vocabulary that are much better. imo

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/tara668
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    So many people saying goodbye in this thread, it pains me to see all the missed opportunities to type (#)owlfwiedersehen. Clearly I am spending too much time on Twitter.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/adder3
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    The major problem with this Luis post is that it is an oxymoron. He states, "Ultimately we are committed to bringing the best learning experience to all Duolingo users across all platforms and communities". "All users" should mean all users. To withdraw immersion does not allow "all users" or indeed any users (unfortunately the majority of users have had Immersion withheld from them: the "Duolingo CEO announced in June 2015 that they have stopped developing immersion. The last course to gain an Immersion tab was the English for Romanian speakers course (which reached beta phase on 2014/02/04: nearly three years ago). And around December 2015, Duolingo started an A/B test to evaluate Immersion" (in which immersion was withheld from many new signers on) also Immersion was not available on phone apps ). Immersion was a fantastic tool. I was one of the lucky ones who had immersion, as I started on Duolingo nearly three years ago, studying Spanish. When I was working on my tree I kept getting messages from Duolingo encouraging me to start Immersion, many a time I would click on the Immersion button and have a look at the articles that were there but it all seemed too difficult to me. On the tree it was very controlled, very safe and regulated. I was given one tense at a time and on each branch I knew which tense I was working on or which subject the new words were about, all of which felt very safe and did not stretch me, but on immersion the tenses were mixed, the idioms were real and the vocabulary was so much more advanced. I kept sneaking a peak but never had the confidence to try it. However after I finished my tree I did pluck up the confidence to have a go. I looked for articles which appealed to me and at first tried to find sentences which I thought I understood and translated a few with trepidation, then surprise surprise as I saw how my sentences were voted and, or modified by people who I did not know but shared a common interest with, gradually my translation skills, vocabulary and confidence began to grow. Especially when other users started to help me. I felt stretched, I started to try more complex sentences, much longer than any Duolingo offers on the tree. I found that as well as learning Spanish, I was improving my English (mother tongue) keeping abreast of current events and learning about a wide variety of subjects, besides making new friends, all this made learning Spanish much more interesting and enjoyable and even addictive. I know I was not the only one who got so much out of this feature. I only have to read all the posts here as confirmation that I was not the only one. Flash cards, bots and clubs can not offer the depth of learning and comprehension of a language that immersion offered. I am surprised that some people "supporting" the withdrawal of immersion in this post have advised people to "move on" from Duolingo. How does that support Luis's commitment "to give the best learning experience to all users"? Please tell me, if Duolingo's mission is bringing the best learning experience to all Duolingo users across all platforms and communities, how is the withdrawal of such a useful tool which is able to encourage learning in a way that no other feature on the site does, help his mission to be accomplished?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/CommeuneTexane

    Beautifully stated, and I couldn't agree more. You could be describing my own experience with immersion...

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Splushkin
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    I absolutely agree with you. Immersion helped to improve my English a lot, as well as Spanish, French, Portuguese and Italian. Whatever the reasons are, removing Immersion was the worst decision made by Duolingo.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/catherineschipul
    catherineschipul
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    I agree completely. It is a sad time for all of us.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/letra_a
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    I find your opinion has been so well expressed and I agree totally :)

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/S0R0USH
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    Meh. Gonna have to go against popular opinion here.

    I rarely used the immersion feature anyway. It won't affect me as I use other resources to learn languages.

    The point of this website is to teach languages. A lot of people here don't seem to understand that and think duolingo is about activity streams and immersion features. You can find similar things using other websites and social media, if you put your mind to it ! Where there's a will, there's a way.

    I've learned more , and mentally translated more Turkish in the facebook duolingo Turkish group than I did here with other languages.

    And is this really an unpopular decision ? So many people use duolingo app without knowing that a website exists in which there is a translation tab. Sorry, there WAS a translation tab. I think it is not a bad business decision. It only affects those that were loyal to the specific feature of immersion. Evolution is about what you can do but still keep the website running. Duolingo is evolving, and that means removing the immersion feature unfortunately :(.

    I hope you have plans of bringing more advanced grammatical or modern expressions and slang to duolingo! People here can agree that variety is what is needed. Not a set of template sentences that span across different courses and make us feel unfulfilled. A second tree even.

    Some examples of other resources you can use:

    edit: sorry about my typos... I typed this when I just woke up haha

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/johnhaug
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    To suggest that those are alternatives tells us you have no idea of how different and better immersion really was. But as you say, "I rarely used the immersion feature anyway. It won't affect me as I use other resources to learn languages." Good luck learning languages on lyricstraining.com.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/S0R0USH
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    To suggest that those are alternatives tells us you have no idea of how different and better immersion really was. But as you say, "I rarely used the immersion feature anyway. It won't affect me as I use other resources to learn languages." Good luck learning languages on lyricstraining.com.

    I have listed more than just that website. If you did in fact try any of the alternatives I mentioned, or even your own alternative websites, please let me know in what way they weren't better than Duolingo's immersion. Remember that the word "immersion" has a more broad definition than the Duolingo sense of the word.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
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    Well, 1. It's a little difficult to use a website to learn a language that is not covered there! 2. Some people are interested in acquiring a vocabulary different from that of song lyrics 3. Although I listen to a lot of music in my target languages (well, mainly in Russian) to improve listening comprehension, lyrics are an extremely bad way to learn languages, since the grammatical rules for sentence construction are quite different.

    But the most important difference with immersion here was the ability to collaborate on translation, with real-time debate over interpretation. To suggest that it can be equated to a solo translate+peer review model is an extremely naive view of the translation process.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/S0R0USH
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    I've seen immersion articles with bad grammar in the target language. Duolingo collaboration usually doesn't have native speakers solely keeping things in check. So it's more blind leading the blind if anything. But my concern isn't just translation. It's immersion. Being able to listen to music and have a general idea of what is being sung is one skill to improve. Improving grammar may require you to go to some news website and then read the articles there. There is always an answer to everything if you have a concern about the way you're learning languages, but the answer does come with its drawbacks.

    Let's say the answers were the following: 1. Take a class: Nah, costs too much money. 2. Go to a country to learn your target language: Too much stress, money, culture shock issues etc. 3. Lyricstraining.com? The grammar is often wrong in order to fit musical devices like rhyme and rhythm and may often be dialectical and slang rather than standardized.

    etc.

    So, I agree with you that suggesting one model is ideal over another is indeed naive. And that's exactly my point. One should be as resourceful as they can. What I listed originally were merely suggestions. There are TONS more.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/daughterofAlbion
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    You are missing the point. Successful language learning involves applying a variety of strategies, and exposing oneself to as varied range of input as possible.
    Type A + Type B + Type C is better than any one of these independently.
    To say: "Hey, you can't do Type A any more, but here replace it with Type C" doesn't cut it.

    It is insulting to assume (incorrectly) that the people who value Type A aren't already using Type C as well.

    If you genuinely wish to be helpful, then please suggest some of these "TONS" of alternatives that provide the features that I listed.

    Edit: yes, I have seen the immersion feature here abused. I can see many ways in which it could have been improved, but I understand why Duolingo does not feel it cost-effective to put more effort into improving it. The point is that as it stood it provided a useful, and, as far as I can see, unique learning tool..

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/JessePaedia
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    Lyricstraining is really good. You can print out lyrics of your favourite songs there too.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/S0R0USH
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    Indeed, as I am musically inclined, it really matches one of my best learning styles. :) Too bad MY favourite songs aren't there, despite them being very popular to the speakers of the target languages.

    So I just added the songs and lyrics to the website myself ;)

    http://lyricstraining.com/search?user=S0R0USH

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/estudianteMTI3

    Yes thank you! That is exactly the way it is for me I functioned just fine without immersion. I plan to finish the tree and absorb as much as I possibly can from Duolingo. Then I will move on to using other resources to take me to a functional fluency. I won't miss immersion at all.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/CoolKat222
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    Noooooooooo................

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/iheartbieber
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    Just a reminder guys, just because because they removed Immersion doesn't mean that you can't find your own articles to translate.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
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    We can translate to our heart's content but without the collaborative aspects between native and none native speakers we will not know how accurate our translations are and will learn considerably less.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
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    I noticed an excellent suggestion above which is to use Google docs. That seems like a very feasible and workable idea for those who have been fortunate enough to find a good translation group to work with.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/BarbaraMorris
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    Finding a good translation group is the key piece that Duolingo's Immersion took care of. With Immersion, it wasn't necessary to have a group, we automatically joined whatever group was working on a given article.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
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    I gather that worked for some people, in my experience that was the hard bit, tbh.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
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    This is actively being pursued, see here http://communitytranslation.freeforums.net/ but it won't do anything to help stop the leakage of those users who only did immersion but were active in the forums helping out the beginners.

    I know,that you have always helped the inexperienced and that you don'r use immersion, so don't misunderstand me, I'm not suggesting for one minute that the only advanced learners who are actively helpful were the immersion users but the loss of any active, helpful advanced user, is a loss for the community as a whole.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/flootzavut
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    I was just passing on something that seems like a sensible, excellent (and vitally, workable!) idea :) regardless of where it happens, I'm all for encouraging any kind of language learning, so if I see a good idea, imma pass it on :) That's all it was, not a judgement of your post, simply me passing on what seemed like a good idea :)

    (While I'm at it, I suggested this to someone else but it bears repeating and also would be easily replicated elsewhere: when I posted threads in reverse tree forums and even in the course forums saying essentially "talk to me in..." (preferably in the target language!) I got literally more reading/writing practice than I knew what to do with - to the point I couldn't keep up. Even just just joining preexisting threads in "English for speakers of..." forums was a rich experience. No, it's not the same as immersion, but it has many of the same benefits, so I think it's a useful idea to mention. Not least because non-English threads would be an easy thing to create in any new forum or similar environment :))

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ifphigenia
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    No, don't worry I didn't think you were doing anything other than that :-) I'm just concerned about the fact that there will be a lot of experience lost and at the moment the extent of the loss is unquantifiable.

    At the moment, because people are largely working onsite they are more likely to notice requests for help, whereas if they are on another site they just won't be aware of the need.

    Your suggestion of using other language forums for conversation type practice is great and speaking for myself, all useful suggestions are extremely welcome but as you say it's not immersion where, among other things, whole books were translated one chapter at a time. With the best will in the world, we can't swamp the forums with that quantity of text, the posts would either be deleted or we'd end up with immersion by the back door drowning out the legitimate questions. Difficult! :-)))

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    Not feasible. People would joing the team, and when be busy with their life. With Duolingo, you don't have frozen team, so if 10 persons are busy, 10 other come to work. Good luck in gathering even 10 people who word on a Google doc, without gamification, motivation, a software to help them, and come everyday!

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/LasCicatrices

    I don't believe it is only the translation articles that people are mad about. I believe it's mostly the social aspect of it. Learning a language takes the time and effort of more than one person. People were able to get feedback on their translations and have them corrected if they were wrong, as well as meet and speak with other learners of their target language.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Margaret_S

    That's a good site.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Ian.Worthington
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    I'm not a huge fan of memrise. If I'm going to just use flashcards I'll use Anki.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/lisa4duolingo
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    I've seen many post comments suggesting Anki, but have yet to dabble with it. Why do you prefer Anki over Memrise?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
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    Bonjour à tous, je lance à tous cette idée « bouée de sauvetage ». En attendant mieux, je l’espère, et afin de pouvoir rester en contact avec nos amis, chacun pourrait décider de créer un compte sur Facebook commençant par EXDL+ son identité sur Duolingo + n’importe quoi derrière si cette identité existe déjà sur facebook. Par exemple EXDLfrancevw1234. Ceci permettrait de nous retrouver si toute communication entre nous via Duolongo n’est plus possible. Qu’en pensez-vous ?

    Hi everybody and dear friends, I launch this idea of "lifeline".Waiting for better solution, and in order to stay in touch with our friends, everyone could decide to create an account on Facebook starting with EXDL + its identity on Duolingo + anything behind if that identity already exists on facebook. For example EXDLfrancevw1234. This would allow us keep in touch if any communication between us via Duolongo is no longer possible. What do you think of it?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/Francevw
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    Sorry EXDL is not accepted by Facebook . You have to choose a name beginning with Duo + your name on Duolingo or something very close.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/PERCE_NEIGE
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    Il n'est pas toujours possible de créer plusieurs comptes Facebook, car ils te demandent un numéro de tél à rattacher à ton compte. La façon la plus simple de le faire, c'est simplement de créer un forum dédié ou si tu veux rester sur Facebook: un groupe Facebook.

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/anonymous1342

    NOT FAir :@((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/carefulnow

    Well I can see that this community has been bulldozed. So, has anyone got any recommendations for any other sites that do offer a similar immersion feature?

    1 year ago

    https://www.duolingo.com/boot2
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    https://www.duolingo.com/tknit
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    Does anyone know of a site that would be a nice replacement for the duolingo immersion?

    1 year ago