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  5. "Εγώ έχω τους σκούφους."

"Εγώ έχω τους σκούφους."

Translation:I have the winter caps.

February 3, 2017

42 Comments
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https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thalia0712

Why is here τους? Where does it come from?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/D_..
Mod
  • 58

Τους is the plural accusative form of the definite article for masculine words. Σκούφους here is the object of verb, therefore both the noun and article are in the accusative. See declension tables here and here.

Edit: I completely missed that troll explains this below in a recent comment.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AniOhevYayin

Here's an instance in which ancient Gk helps, because I had no problem with τους being the definite article for an accusative plural, but I could see that it could throw someone off after we learned that τους is a possessive meaning "their," as in τα παιδία τους, their children. So it seems that context and syntax (word order) will help us figure out whether the definite article or possessive pronoun is meant.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/thalia0712

Yes! That's exactly where I went wrong.. I thought it meant "their" :/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jim368909

Dimitra, I can accept that καπελο is cap and σκουθος is winter cap. But there are other questions in this lesson where the translation of σκουφος is simply "cap". (See "Cap and scarf" questions.) Is the implication that σκουφος used with κασκολ means "winter" is implied?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dimitra956826

No. If you open the links I posted (so that people can also see what I'm talking about), you'll see that cap means a specific type of hat, that Greeks just call καπέλο. Σκούφος, even without κασκόλ, means winter cap. ^.^

(The difference between σκούφος and καπέλο in Greek is easy to spot. It's the actual English that makes this one seem a bit harder for learners.)

As I have also mentoned above , the reason why cap is still a tranlation for σκούφος in that specific sentence is because we can't change it without completely removing the sentence, which is something we might do. There will no be such confusion in the second tree.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve445395

I don't mean to be rude, but it has been a year and the misleading sentence is still in the lesson. I'me fine with any distinction the lesson wants to make, but if σκούφος is translated as "cap" in some sentences and "winter cap" in others then the lesson is failing to teach the word correctly and is actually providing more confusion then clarification.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fortynachos

+1 to this. The distinction between cap and winter cap is fine, but it needs to be consistent in the lesson, which it's currently not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/farran

In the lessons before this on possession, we were taught that τους is for third person possessive (I think?). Maybe the English should read "I have their caps" instead?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/troll1995
Mod
  • 227

Τους here is the acussative plural masculine article. Their caps would be τους σκούφους τους. Possessives always come after the object (unless you use δικός μου etc).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/farran

So τους is the accusative masculine form of οι, and plural masculine form of το? I've done some further reading and I think I understand it now. It would be really good if the "Tips and Notes" pages were visible in the Duo app. So much information is missed if you only use the app.

Ευχαριστώ, Τρολλ! ^^,


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/troll1995
Mod
  • 227

You're welcome! What do you mean the plural masculine form of το; I didn't quite get that... Το is the neuter article. Ο σκούφος is a masculine noun. Οι σκούφοι in plural nominative, τους σκούφους in plural accusative. Τους σκούφους τους=Their caps (in accusative-used if 'their caps' is the direct object of the sentence)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lfd
  • 798

This information did not appear in any ‘tips & notes’ as far as I remember.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HilaryFinc1

I get the difference with caps and winter caps, but then from nowhere berets appeared!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/macherb16

One more translation for σκούφους: beret. I entered as answer "I have the caps". (one of the suggestions) Surprisingly the result was "You used the wrong word"., the correct answer is "I have the berets". This correct answer was given during a strengthening session.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HJSX1

Where does it say winter caps? I put "I have the caps and it says it is wrong!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dimitra956826

Please check the comment right above, to undertand the different between a cap and a winter cap. ^.^


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RobStevens883992

Nobody yet has mentioned the given possible response of "skullcap". This is not commonly used in English. And "beret", well, I get that, 'cause I'm Canadian. But "beret" is a French word.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Chris870146

Every other question with σκούφους accepts caps as an answer, but not this one. I understand from reading the comments on this thread that it actually means winter cap, but this inconsistency is starting to put me off using this app.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Damien459451

And in a later exercise the correct translation is cap.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gay588730

This sentence needed ' berets' not caps. The next needed 'caps' not berets.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hank_Williams_Sr

If I want to say "I have their beanies", in Greek 'twill be "Έχω τους σκούφους τους"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/troll1995
Mod
  • 227

Yes, exactly. ;)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnYanouz

There are caps for all seasons!! Winter as well as summer, for rain and for snow, and and more.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gina975088

The sentence dose not say anything about winter.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AniOhevYayin

It's implied. In English a "stocking cap" = winter cap = cap. The adjectives simply clarify what type of cap it is. If we say in English, "nice cap," we know from sight whether it is a baseball cap or a winter stocking cap for cold weather, but online or in print it can help to add an adjective. English has this problem sometimes with other nouns, too, including the word "love." Greek often has different words (nouns) for the specific type of love, whereas English does not specify the type of love with the noun "love" and so must use an adjective to specify (familial love, friendship love, agapic love, romantic or erotic love, etc). So it's helpful to specify winter cap in this case to distinguish it from το καπέλο. At the beginning level, it's good to start getting a feel for the nuances of words, and DL does a nice job in this case helping us out.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vjeko13

Γιατί είναι "I have the caps" λανθασμένο;


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dimitra956826

Cap is not an exact translation to σκούφος, because we don't call these caps. For us, σκούφος is specifically a winter cap, a knit one. (I hope the links work.)

So, caps are καπέλα, winter caps are σκούφοι. ^.^


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vjeko13

Cap is used for σκούφος consistently throughout the Clothes lesson. Also, the problem here wasn't "caps", the app actually wanted me to write "I have GOT the caps" and rejected "I have the caps". But thanks for clarification about καπέλο (even though the clothes lesson translates καπέλο consistently as "hat")


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dimitra956826

Then something needs fixing. :P Thank you for pointing that out.^.^

As for hat, yes. Both cap and hat translate to καπέλο. We don't actually have a distinction for them in Greek. Cap is just a type of hat, and we use the same word that we would use for a sun hat, or a top hat.

(By the way, I just found out that the word "cap" is used for σκούφος in an original sentence just once. In all other cases, "cap" is just an alternative. That's a relief.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rosebud202

But here it also says "winter caps" which is just what the images on google show. Just like the moderator said. And from what I read they are making another "tree" to improve this one. Seriously I find that commendable.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rosebud202

I've been thinking that the fact that Duo lets courses make new trees they know that there will be inconsistencies. After all from what I've heard all the creators and moderators are volunteers and may not have done this kind of project before.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PaulBuckla3

I also got berets. Inconsistencies are becoming more and more frequent


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JohnYanouz

Cap is not winter only, there a summer caps also.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/slh123

Winter hats (or even I'd say just hats) should be accepted in place of winter caps


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Jason997955

Cap should be accepted. Where I live they are also called a toque. Some places, "stocking cap".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Gatu77

I think that grammar related to making plural form and Accusative cases is much more important than discussing whether it's beanie, winter cap/hat, beret etc. So far we didn't see how to form plural if nouns, only some words like κοριτσία, αγορία, γυναίκες, άντρες, but not in a systematic way.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JasminaRss

Why not also winter hats? I am not a native english speaker so that is also a factor. Just wondering if it really is wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JasminaRss

ευχαριστώ πολύ; :)

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