"I am sitting behind my parents."

Translation:Mi sidas malantaĆ­ miaj gepatroj.

1 year ago

7 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/karykeion
karykeion
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Wouldn't "Mi sidas malantaĆ­ miaj patroj" actually be correct if you're talking about a same-sex couple of dads? Or is it always "gepatroj" for any set of parents?

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/salivanto
salivanto
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"Ge-" suggests mixed-sex. I would argue that if you have two dads, you're sitting behind your dads. We don't usually say "siblings" for a group of sisters, so why would we say "my parents" for a pair of dads?

(This isn't to say that turning it around isn't OK - "bring all your siblings" can mean "bring your sisters". "Bring both your parents" can mean "bring both your dads.")

I would apply the same logic to my Esperanto.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/karykeion
karykeion
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Thanks! I guess the way I was thinking about it, one of my friends has moms, and we all (him included) refer to them as his parents, so I'm not sure if I'd call them his gepatroj or his patrinoj in EO.

I'm curious now to know if any other EO speakers have run into this situation.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/salivanto
salivanto
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To me, calling a two-dad couple "miaj gepatroj" is kind of like addressing a women's meeting as "ladies and gentlemen." It has that same sense of specifically mixed-sex parents.

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/mizinamo
mizinamo
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I haven't come across that situation in Esperanto, but as salivanto says, ge- is specifically about "mixed genders", so "my mothers" or "my fathers" could be "my parents" in English (no gender) but not miaj gepatroj (specifically-mixed gender).

1 year ago

https://www.duolingo.com/StephieRice
StephieRice
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This is actually something that really irks me in the Duolingo course.

"Gepatroj" is not at all equivalent to "parents" and yet it is constantly translated that way here. Obviously the topic of parents must be discussed to allow learners to learn, but the way it is taught is a failure. Without context "gepatroj", "patroj" and "patrinoj" are all equally valid translations of "parents" and while I have not tested if the course accepts them I know it certainly has no way of actually explaining well what is going on in those translations.

However, the language could easily support (and completely without reform) adding an affix which represents gender neutrality. This would solve so many issues, particularly in keeping the language understandable while allowing the topic.

For instance, you are in a country where homosexuality is illegal (we are talking about an international language after all) and you cannot reveal your parents to be same sex for fear of punishment (jail time, execution). Currently it seems the only practical solution is to use "gepatroj" even though it is wrong, but in doing so you communicate the wrong information and imply that you have at least one mother and at least one father. This is my only complaint with the language as well. It seems so short sighted by Zamenhof to design an international language in a way that communicates useless information which, as cultures diverge, creates a problem preventing users from accurately communicating. The very base of creating such a language seems logically to ensure that ONLY the needed information is ever used. And there is almost never a situation where the gender of someone's parents is relevant information to a conversation.

Sorry I rant Salivanto, my heart just yearns for a simple affix to solve the issue and create a real translation of the word "parents" which includes the entire meaning without forcing alteration, one that can actually communicate the concept of a parent without a gender attached.

8 months ago

https://www.duolingo.com/salivanto
salivanto
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"Not at all equivalent" is certainly an exaggeration. Everybody has one father and one mother, even if those people were never involved in their lives. I don't really have a lot to say about any thought which begins "the language could" - even if I agree with the social pressure behind that thought. "The language could" suggests that Esperanto is still a project, and not a language with a history.

I still have a huge backlog of notifications from the month or so that I took off from Duolingo and Facebook (to work on other Esperanto projects)... which is why I'm replying a month later. I would have left you to rant in peace, but you mentioned me by name... so I felt I had to say something.

7 months ago
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