1. Forum
  2. >
  3. Topic: German
  4. >
  5. "Wir sind Ärzte geworden."

"Wir sind Ärzte geworden."

Translation:We have become doctors.

March 16, 2014

55 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

"We have become doctors." is accepted. However, "We have turned into doctors." as given here seems rather questionable. Any views on this?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/NhormChimpsky

Yes, it sounds very strange in English. Like most of the odd English alternatives asked about here, it would require of a lot of context to make sense, in this case likely something like a sci-fi of fantasy plot.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jaye16

Yes, indeed. Only sci-fi could account for that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Angelastic

❤❤❤❤❤❤, Jim, I'm a doctor, not a [whatever I was before the magical transformation]!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Missionary2

It would not be said that way in American English. We would say we have become doctors.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DayoTokyo

And since it is german past tense, it will be "We became doctors" which was correct when I entered it.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/chrismoorew

In English English too. Weird translation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MacaroniPenguin

As an English speaker, "...turned into doctors" makes it seem as if it happened by magic.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dijana.

I think, 'become' in this context would mean, we studied and graduated; while 'turned into', could mean e.g. a women delivered (gave birth to her baby) in unexpected circumstances, so we had to help her and thus became sort of doctors. (I am very good at English, but in German still very weak, so don't count this explanation for the German sentence though)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Unusual, but understandable. "become" is preferable. If I heard someone use the phrase " . . . turned into doctors" I would think that English is not their native language, but I would certainly understand what they mean.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/schlesselman

Wir sind Ärzte geworden = we have become doctors (and still are doctors) Wir sind Ärzte gewesen = we have been doctors (Perfekt) (and still are? or no longer are?) Wir werden Ärzte sein = we will be doctors (close to, but not exactly "we will become doctors") Wir werden Ärzte gewesen sein = we will have been doctors, so... Wir werden Ärzte geworden sein = we will have become doctors? (I'm assuming an audition for a punk band is not involved in any of these cases)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

I think in your second sentence, Wir sind Ärzte gewesen, it doesn't say anything about whether you still are doctors or not - only that you were at some point in the past. Just like "We were doctors" in English.

In English, using the 'present perfect' construction "We have been doctors" does imply that you still are doctors. Using 'present perfect' in German does not carry this meaning, as far as I know.

(And I guess the audition is only necessary if Wir wollen Die Ärzte sein!)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DanKieselbach

"Oh god, Frank. IT BIT ME, TOO!"

"Billy, I think we've turned into... doctors."

weeping


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Craig793562

Poor English translation. Please remove it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/bia933367

Sometimes it accepts "became" or "have become" and sometimes it insists on "turning into". Very frustrating.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SteffieSproat

Nobody would say that they'd turned into a Doctor. "They became Doctors" or "They had become Doctors" is correct. "Turned into" has different implications In more than one way. In Cinderella, the pumpkin turned into a stagecoach. Alternatively, a car can turn into a side road.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shirlgirl007

Yes, I agree. I don't even want to know these particular translations, since it is nonsense in English. And I think this whole thread proves the point already.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PopCultureTime

What they mean is that they became doctors as a job. They probably went through some medical training for that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Shirlgirl007

Oh, I understand what they were meaning to say, and yes, doctors require a lot of medical training and expertise.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DhananjayVarma

Why sind and not haben? Or does haben work too? Haven't checked.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexanderU3

Because of "geworden". Along with movement verbs (gehen, kommen, schwimmen etc), werden takes "sein" instead of "haben" for perfect forms.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JoelEbel

The tips for this lesson say that sein verbs must be intransitive except for a few special cases, but geworden takes an object and was not listed in the special cases. Perhaps the tips should include it as well?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AlexanderU3

Maybe it should. Werden is actually very special werb in German, along with sein and haben (it is used both in literal meaning and as the technical verb).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Axel591520

The translation We have turned into doctors made me laugh. Translated back to German this would be: Wir haben uns in Ärzte verwandelt. It evokes connotations of magic wands, shapeshifters, or - in a sci-fi context - aliens morphing into doctors.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/kyrrit

They are preparing us for Kafka-esque concepts.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/BillJim

Given the translations DL provides, how would you say "We are becoming doctors" or "We are turning into doctors"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/az_p

Present tense:
"We are becoming doctors" = Wir werden Ärzte
"We are turning into doctors" = Wir werden zu Ärzte

Past tense (Präteritum):
"We became doctors" = Wir wurden Ärzte
"We turned into doctors" = Wir wurden zu Ärzte

Past tense (Perfekt):
"We have become doctors" = Wir sind Ärzte geworden
"We have turned into doctors" = Wir sind zu Ärzte geworden

Future tense:
"We will become doctors" = Wir werden Ärzte werden
"We will turn into doctors" = Wir werden zu Ärzte werden


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/guntunge

your turn into translations should use Ärzten


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/margusoja

Seems that this is the way how DL is teaching us that German does not distinguish between "becoming someone" and "turning into someone". They are using the odd English translation on purpose, I guess.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/guntunge

Not really.
become - werden (with jobs)
turn into - wandeln/ verwandeln/ umwandeln/ einbiegen
and also "zu etwas werden" but it has also that magic, fantasy and curse tone like in English when used with Ärzte.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/megcasmith

"have become," not "turned into" -- I am with jaye16 on this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Seattle_Scott

I agree with the others. In English if you turn into something it’s because a witch, or a green owl, cast a magic spell on you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ThomasRones

In the last example geworden could also be gotten. We have gotten doctors and we have become doctors have different meanings. That being said we have gotten doctors sounds very redneck-ish


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eclectic1234

No. No English speaker would ever say "We have gotten doctors," just as in German you would never say "Wir sind Ärzte bekommen." It makes no sense, unless some doctors were sent to you. You might say "We have got(ten) some mail," meaning "We have received some mail." "Receive" is one of the meanings of "get," a word with many, many meanings. I realize this comment is three years old, but for anyone else reading it, German and English speakers sometimes get confused with translating the verbs "bekommen" and "werden" into English. "Bekommen" and "become" sound alike but have different meanings.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Danielle997860

This is not a good translation


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Hannah881931

Does anyone know, how do you know when to use "haben" at the beginning of the sentence, vs "sind"...... I get the haben because it sounds right but not sure about sind??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/zengator

Typically one uses sein when the main verb concerns movement. Z.B., "sind sie heute laufen?" oder "bist du zum Markt gegangen?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eclectic1234

It's also used with "sein" and "werden," which have to do with states of being. English used to make this distinction too. In older translations of religious texts, for instance, "The Lord is come" and "The Lord is risen." (And "I am become Death...."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eclectic1234

Fortunately, "We have become doctors" is also accepted.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PopSixSquish

Could the sentence 'Wir sind Ärzte geworden' also mean 'we were doctors' or would that be phrased differently? Can 'geworden' mean either 'became' or 'were'? If so, how can you tell which is meant?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Axel591520

No, "we were doctors" would be phrased differently: "Wir waren Ärzte." The verb "werden" refers to a process, whereas "sein" refers to a state. The distinction is clearer in the present tense:

Wir sind Ärzte. - We are doctors.
Wir werden Ärzte. - We are becoming doctors.
(We aren't doctors, yet.)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JinChang2

How do I know the difference between writing wir haben become doctors and wir sind become doctors?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paijeehobbs

I don't understand your question. Could you try rephrasing it? I think you may be asking if your are to use the auxiliary verb 'haben' or 'sein' when speaking using the 'Perfekt' to express the past in German.

With the verb 'werden' you will always use 'sein' Ergo...

Ich bin Arzt geworden. <-- Correct

You never say...

Ich habe Arzt geworden. <-- Incorrect


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eclectic1234

In current English, all perfect tenses use "have," but in German, some verbs take "haben" and some "sein." Most take "haben." Verbs of motion use "sein" -- "Wir sind gekommen." (In English, we would say "We have come" (or just "We came," since we use the present perfect less often than German). Also use "sein" with the verbs "sein" and "werden," which I think of as verbs of being. "Wir sind Ärzte geworden" doesn't involve physical movement, but it involves a change of condition. We weren't doctors, but now we are: We have become doctors. "Wir sind Ärzte gewesen" would mean "We have been doctors/We were doctors." (When Duolingo uses the present perfect tense in German, go ahead and translate it into the present perfect in English, even though English would only use that in specific contexts.) With practice, it will become natural to use either "haben" or "sind."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JBHayven

Is the audio correct? I think there's no umlaut in Ärzte where it should be so please correct me if I'm wrong.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paijeehobbs

It's correct.

Arzt <-- singular masculine

Ärztin <-- singular feminine

Ärtze <-- Plural masculine

Ärztinnen <-- Plural feminine


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tomasprats02

Perke soc judio a q si


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnotherDryu

Some doctors have borders, These doctors do not.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Steve34747

The official English translation communicates a meaning which is not correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Vassala

I'm just imagining were-doctors. "No! A full moon! Jessica don't look! Agh! Horrible bone breaking transformation noises I'm... I'm a were-doctor. May i take your temperature?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/paijeehobbs

Bibbity bobbity boo! 'We became doctors' wäre besser gewesen.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Uberdonutmonster

It displeases me greatly that I cannot write as I speak. For I speak proper, though archaic, English. Just as our German cousin does here "Wir sind geworden," proper English does the same, "We are become." Hence why one may find phrases within the Bible, such as "The Lord is come." Or the famous line from the Bhagavad Gita "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds..."

I would like it if I could write this as I would say it, especially because I am breaking no rules of English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Eclectic1234

Languages evolve. It is interesting to know the history of English and to understand older texts, but why would you want to speak or write archaic English? What was "proper" once is no longer the standard. "Archaic" does not mean "proper."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AelienFelis

Ahhh, one day - dreaming


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/sduckwor

It's called workfare in the UK.

Learn German in just 5 minutes a day. For free.