"We have become doctors." is accepted. However, "We have turned into doctors." as given here seems rather questionable. Any views on this?
Yes, it sounds very strange in English. Like most of the odd English alternatives asked about here, it would require of a lot of context to make sense, in this case likely something like a sci-fi of fantasy plot.
❤❤❤❤❤❤, Jim, I'm a doctor, not a [whatever I was before the magical transformation]!
It would not be said that way in American English. We would say we have become doctors.
And since it is german past tense, it will be "We became doctors" which was correct when I entered it.
I think, 'become' in this context would mean, we studied and graduated; while 'turned into', could mean e.g. a women delivered (gave birth to her baby) in unexpected circumstances, so we had to help her and thus became sort of doctors. (I am very good at English, but in German still very weak, so don't count this explanation for the German sentence though)
As an English speaker, "...turned into doctors" makes it seem as if it happened by magic.
Unusual, but understandable. "become" is preferable. If I heard someone use the phrase " . . . turned into doctors" I would think that English is not their native language, but I would certainly understand what they mean.
Wir sind Ärzte geworden = we have become doctors (and still are doctors) Wir sind Ärzte gewesen = we have been doctors (Perfekt) (and still are? or no longer are?) Wir werden Ärzte sein = we will be doctors (close to, but not exactly "we will become doctors") Wir werden Ärzte gewesen sein = we will have been doctors, so... Wir werden Ärzte geworden sein = we will have become doctors? (I'm assuming an audition for a punk band is not involved in any of these cases)
I think in your second sentence, Wir sind Ärzte gewesen, it doesn't say anything about whether you still are doctors or not - only that you were at some point in the past. Just like "We were doctors" in English.
In English, using the 'present perfect' construction "We have been doctors" does imply that you still are doctors. Using 'present perfect' in German does not carry this meaning, as far as I know.
(And I guess the audition is only necessary if Wir wollen Die Ärzte sein!)
Sometimes it accepts "became" or "have become" and sometimes it insists on "turning into". Very frustrating.
"Oh god, Frank. IT BIT ME, TOO!"
"Billy, I think we've turned into... doctors."
Because of "geworden". Along with movement verbs (gehen, kommen, schwimmen etc), werden takes "sein" instead of "haben" for perfect forms.
Maybe it should. Werden is actually very special werb in German, along with sein and haben (it is used both in literal meaning and as the technical verb).
Nobody would say that they'd turned into a Doctor. "They became Doctors" or "They had become Doctors" is correct. "Turned into" has different implications In more than one way. In Cinderella, the pumpkin turned into a stagecoach. Alternatively, a car can turn into a side road.
Yes, I agree. I don't even want to know these particular translations, since it is nonsense in English. And I think this whole thread proves the point already.
What they mean is that they became doctors as a job. They probably went through some medical training for that.
Oh, I understand what they were meaning to say, and yes, doctors require a lot of medical training and expertise.
Given the translations DL provides, how would you say "We are becoming doctors" or "We are turning into doctors"?
"We are becoming doctors" = Wir werden Ärzte
"We are turning into doctors" = Wir werden zu Ärzte
Past tense (Präteritum):
"We became doctors" = Wir wurden Ärzte
"We turned into doctors" = Wir wurden zu Ärzte
Past tense (Perfekt):
"We have become doctors" = Wir sind Ärzte geworden
"We have turned into doctors" = Wir sind zu Ärzte geworden
"We will become doctors" = Wir werden Ärzte werden
"We will turn into doctors" = Wir werden zu Ärzte werden
Seems that this is the way how DL is teaching us that German does not distinguish between "becoming someone" and "turning into someone". They are using the odd English translation on purpose, I guess.
become - werden (with jobs)
turn into - wandeln/ verwandeln/ umwandeln/ einbiegen
and also "zu etwas werden" but it has also that magic, fantasy and curse tone like in English when used with Ärzte.
In the last example geworden could also be gotten. We have gotten doctors and we have become doctors have different meanings. That being said we have gotten doctors sounds very redneck-ish
The translation We have turned into doctors made me laugh. Translated back to German this would be: Wir haben uns in Ärzte verwandelt. It evokes connotations of magic wands, shapeshifters, or - in a sci-fi context - aliens morphing into doctors.
Does anyone know, how do you know when to use "haben" at the beginning of the sentence, vs "sind"...... I get the haben because it sounds right but not sure about sind??
Typically one uses sein when the main verb concerns movement. Z.B., "sind sie heute laufen?" oder "bist du zum Markt gegangen?"
I agree with the others. In English if you turn into something it’s because a witch, or a green owl, cast a magic spell on you.
It displeases me greatly that I cannot write as I speak. For I speak proper, though archaic, English. Just as our German cousin does here "Wir sind geworden," proper English does the same, "We are become." Hence why one may find phrases within the Bible, such as "The Lord is come." Or the famous line from the Bhagavad Gita "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds..."
I would like it if I could write this as I would say it, especially because I am breaking no rules of English.
Is the audio correct? I think there's no umlaut in Ärzte where it should be so please correct me if I'm wrong.