"フォークとナイフをください。"

Translation:A fork and a knife, please.

May 25, 2017

32 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/testmoogle
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I know the question is written as "a fork and a knife" (or "forks and knives")...

However, here where I live in England anyway, we always say "a knife and fork" when referring to those two eating utensils as a pair.

The other way round—"a fork and knife"—would sound slightly strange however.

It's like, if you're at the beach and want a spade and also a bucket, you'd say "Can I get a bucket and spade?" rather than saying the two items separately. And it's always that way round; it's never "a spade and bucket".

Just my thoughts. Maybe I'm crazy and just imagining it? Maybe it's different elsewhere or in other countries?

But I know this one probably isn't going to be accepted in my sentence problem reports. It's just annoying that I type it as a pair almost every time without thinking and getting marked as incorrect. So I thought I'd see if people have opinions on this in here. ^^;

May 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/vytah
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It's called "Siamese twins" or "irreversible binomials": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siamese_twins_(linguistics)

May 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/testmoogle
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Thank you! I didn't know it was an actual thing. Was interesting to me to read that page.

I notice "knife and fork" is in the list on that page, but not "bucket and spade" (nor, thankfully, "spade and bucket").

I feel a bit more justified about having used the report function on that sentence now. I'm not completely crazy after all. ^^

May 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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I think you were justified. In the Dutch course, I think they only accept "supply and demand" for "vraag en aanbod," even though the later literally means "demand and supply."

EDIT: and in other sentences in the Japanese course, inversions of the given order in such cases are simply accepted, even apart from irreversible binomial considerations.

May 28, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/kelsi602
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Caught me out too. I've reported as "this answer should be accepted". British English aside, Japanese doesn't have articles so it should be acceptable.

Edit: Doing this question again "a fork and knife" is accepted. So the issue is the noun order. Formally, "and" is commutative in English.

May 29, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/kelsi602
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AND just to wind you up "pepper and salt" :-)

May 29, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/testmoogle
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"Pepper and salt" sounds sssooooo wrong! XD

May 29, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/impromptu_stdio

In the US it is definitely the other way around XD. Fork and knife is the natural way to say it while I dont think ive ever heard anyone refer to them as "knife and fork" before now.

August 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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There is reasonably strong evidence your experience is not representative of US English as a whole. "Knife and fork" is three times more common than "fork and knife" in the Corpus of Contemporary American English. Granted, the distinction does appear stronger in UK English than in US English. Google NGrams puts the "knife and fork" to "fork and knife" ratio at 7:1 for the US but 30:1 for the UK.

August 12, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/impromptu_stdio

That's very interesting! I had no idea there was such a resource. I can definitely see this, since the US is such a big place with many very different speech patterns depending on where you live. I wonder if "fork and knife" is just a midwest thing. The east and west coasts speak differently ("in line" vs "on line" etc.) and hold the largest population densities.

August 16, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/BJCUAl
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I'm on the west coast and either order sounds fine to me. Knife and fork seems to roll off my tongue just a tad easier.

Incidentally, for 'in line' vs 'on line', apparently New Yorkers are the only ones who say the latter.

November 23, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Rowen776697

100% agree. It would be like saying "pepper and salt" or "sugar and cream" rather than the other way around. Not technically wrong, but just not generally phrased that way.

January 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/CaseyAndre2

How is "Can I get a fork and knife please" considered wrong?

July 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Hieronymus636864

Yeah, doesn't ' ...ください ' mean '' please'' ?

August 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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The course is in beta. Plenty of valid options are missing. Just report it.

July 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/judyhux
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'May I please have a fork and knife' is also marked incorrect. Oh well, at least I'm not a well raised Siamese twin!

June 15, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/V2Blast
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Report it.

January 2, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/ayuri26

Knife and fork please? Is aso correct right?

September 1, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/YohanesSat2

yes it is.

October 6, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Brettah31
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I will purposefully get this wrong the first time round every time i see it just so that i can drive home the message that it should be written as "knife and fork" in English.

October 3, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Chris560472

Word order of fork and knife should not matter

June 21, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Nytheris

Issues that people raised in comments 4 months ago are still happening with these kind of questions. Is the course still being worked on?

October 20, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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4 months is nothing in Duolingo terms. The answer to your query is an unusually clear yes. It's just two or three days ago that typing in Japanese appeared on the web.

October 20, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/djhempy

"Fork and knife please." is considered wrong here even though it's a more direct translation than the preferred answer, "can I get a fork and knife?"
While "fork and knife please" could be considered poor grammar or abrupt in conversation, to me as a native English speaker, the "can I get--" is implied. You could easily substitute "could I get--" or "may I get--" or "may I have--" the latter of which would be the most grammatically correct in this situation since the speaker is not asking about his/her ability to obtain a fork and knife, but rather asking a favor of the person the statement is directed towards.

October 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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Responding to the last point, the intent of asking "may I have" would also not be to obtain information on whether or not one has permission to be in possession of utensils. I would not call the terms of discussion here "grammatical"; these formulations are all euphemistic in nature and equally illogical if viewed through the lens of what they mean word-by-word.

October 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/secret_sAndwich
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Duo suggests "Can i've a fork and knife, please?" as the proper answer.

I know I find myself saying "Can I've" just constantly. /s

February 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/piguy3
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Duolingo handles contractions via algorithm. Unfortunately, this algorithm has not been perfectly implemented. Get a screenshot next time it happens, and submit a bug report.

February 18, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/tate1650
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How do you know when do use と vs も for "and"?

June 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Beckyfever

In American English 'knife and fork' or 'fork and knife: are both commonly used.

June 24, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/mrvolans

I swear she says "Pork".

December 19, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Kerwin145007

Means the same thing

January 12, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/RuideSousa2

Why not: Give me a fork and a knife, please?

December 23, 2018
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