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  5. "さようなら"

"さようなら"

Translation:goodbye

June 5, 2017

91 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HugoZw
  • 1610

Isn't さようなら supposed to be used like farewell for an extended period of time?

It is not to be used like an english day to day (good)bye


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RadekKoziol

It can certainly be used on a day to day basis. There are more casual ways of saying it (like how in English you can say "see ya" or "later"), but there's nothing wrong with saying さようなら as a simple "goodbye".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ErwinRommel69

In Japan though, if you try to say さようなら to someone like when leaving school or something, they will think you're weird. さようなら sounds more like "I'm breaking up with you." or generally "Goodbye forever" than "Bye!". If you are in 小学校 (elementary school) then you would be taught to say 先生さようなら (goodbye teacher). However, when you get older, you use 失礼 します (excuse me) formally, or またね(see you later), じゃあまたね (well, see you later) じゃあまた,じゃあ, or それじゃあ (for guys mainly). If you're going to see someone tomorrow, like a classmate, then you could say また明日 (see you tomorrow, or literally, again tomorrow). Don't say さようなら please.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fabiana719337

i would just like to correct the 'see you later'. what you wrote is said as: matawa . which means: or, choice between A or B everything else looks fine to me! thank you for explaining! (even though this was written a year ago)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gpikkio

How would you say "goodbye" in a formal way, for example when you leave a restaurant?

Once I used sayonara when leaving a restaurant in Japan and a friend of mine told me that it sounds old fashion. Also, I never heard anyone use it while I was in Japan.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

"Sayonara" is a somber, long-term "farewell". You might never see the other person again, and it's very sad. It's not the thing you say when you part company with strangers.

https://www.fluentu.com/blog/japanese/how-to-say-goodbye-in-japanese/
Option 3 is probably what you're looking for.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/gpikkio

Thanks for the reply, but it is still unclear. Your example is about leaving work where there are people that I know. I am talking about a more general 'goodbye'.

Is it ok to say お先に失礼します when I want to say goodbye when leaving a shop or a restaurant?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

I'm having trouble finding information that covers your exact situation. Just because they use office life as their examples doesn't mean that's the only place you can use them. Thanking people for their work seemed appropriate. Perhaps option 8 or 10 over here?
https://www.fluentin3months.com/goodbye-in-japanese/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/trukook9597

Can matana be used?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Jaa mata or mata ne are very casual and informal, like a breezy "See ya later!"

Sayounara is a serious, long-term "farewell".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/John_981

Bye was consideres wrong..?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Wrong register. Sayonara is more formal, bye is more informal.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Mr.Max_Man

Right. For a simple " 'bye " you may want to use "またね”(matane), which means "see you later."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rinchamaa

here's a few more ways of saying bye/later/see you later. じゃね(see you later) また明日/またあした(See you tomorrow/Again tomorrow)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KateFahr

Makes me wonder what the Japanese equivalents of "See ya; wouldn't wanna be ya!" and "Smell you later!" are.

Culturally, I mean; I'm sure they don't use those exact phrases cuz, like, they couldn't possibly rhyme the way they do in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MidnightLo

Also またね、 じゃあ、また後で、 ect. I personally think the list is endless because new ways are like made up everyday


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/352M3

Sayonara is what a samurai would say when going into battle or committing ritual suicide. It wouldn't be used in everyday situations. It's like, you say farewell when you don't expect to see that person ever again or at least for an extended period of time.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/-_-wot-_-

They accept the answer "farewell" cuz in my japanese textbook sayounara is "farewell"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tanjirokam

Farewell is just a formal term of goodbye


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

The important distinction with "farewell" is not formality. It's a very somber, long-term "goodbye".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JesseGaronP

'Goodbye' originates from 'God be with ye'. - in other words it expresses the sentiment that God should look after the person to whom it is said.

'Fare' is verb of declining usage meaning to perform/do in a particular way, so 'farewell' literally expresses the sentiment that the person should perform well (e.g. in terms of health).

I would say the Japanese is closer to the latter in meaning, as, for one thing, it does not make reference to a deity.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Yes, "farewell" is the best translation of さようなら.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmVeddii

Like how sayonara is semi adopted into English and usually used when you're not gonna see the person again


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/William_Meade

Yes you are right about that


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CloudiaCaroline

Could also use またね!which means see you next time! If i remember correctly さようなら! Is used for when you are not going to see that person again.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/s13579

またね used when you say it to a friend if you see them in short time. さようなら is the polite form and also used when you won't see someone for a long time. And it is true that さようなら also means farewell.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Robin539971

Since this is formal, does that mean you would say it to Someone Like A Boss, A co-worker, a teacher, Etc. and not a friend or family member?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Not formal in that sense. "Sayonara" is closer to "farewell". It's a more long-term, serious good-bye, rather than a "see you next week" good-bye.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EugeneTiffany

Good answer. Actually, in some instances "Sayonara" could be an extrenely unhappy thing to hear


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmmanuelBu11

Too be safe, when you have to leave the house, use 行ってきます to ensure that you are coming back. When with friends, use じゃあね to sound open-hearted, rather than using さようなら。


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kimiko_Sensei

Ittekimasu is only used as an expression when you are leaving your house and someone is home "waiting" for your return. Ittekimasu literally means to go and come back. But used in the same context as the English expression "I'll be home soon/I'll be back soon."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MeemoKiks

I was taught that the word for "back soon" or "return" was "kaerimasu." Is there some distinction between the two?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

We haven't covered the "te-form" yet and probably won't for a little while. The te-form is basically how you put two verbs together in a "do x and do y" construction.

行く (iku) is "to go" and 帰る (kaeru) is "to return/come back". Conjugating them together into 行ってきます (ittekimasu) is literally "I'll go and come back", but is more closely equivalent to "See you later."

https://cotoacademy.com/ittekimasu/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tomas.linper

Difference between さようなら and またね ?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kimiko_Sensei

Sayounara is a formal good bye for a long period of time or when your pathes will cross again a long time from now.

Mata ne is like saying "see you again" but is informal and should only be used with friends and family members.

To make it more formal, you can say Mata aimashou. Which basically means "lets meet again soon"

Mata means "again."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PhillipDow

Would the long 'a' vowel sounds blend in Mata aimashou?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

It looks like the answer is no. If one word ends in a sound and the next word begins with the same sound, they are pronounced separately, not blended together.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

That's a good question. I'm going to ask it in the general discussion forum. But my gut instinct says no, you pronounce it twice distinctly, because gemination is phonemic.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/lauren757qt

How come Sayonara leaves out the "u"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

sayounara is the exact Romanization of the hiragana spelling.
sayonara is the way we spell it in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Andrew-Lin

This phrase has a very special etymology comparing to "Au revoir." or "Auf wiedersehen." It is shortening for earlier/archaic Japanese word "さようならば," meaning "If that's the way it is."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Panchete1

Sayonara is always remembered as the famous "Hasta la vista, baby" by Schwarzenegger, in the spanish version. It would have been pointless to use a spanish sentence in the spanish version (nobody would get the joke). Not sure why, but Spain changed it for a japanese version .https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxobpBKInFw


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Pisces63818

So the "う" is only extending the "よ" sound longer?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Not the よ per se. Any syllable that ends with o lengthens (diphthongizes) with u. Any syllable that ends with e lengthens (diphthongizes) with i. Other vowels lengthen without becoming diphthongs.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/tomoya_love

We also say, "ばいばい"→byebye. I can't speak English well.sorry.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/silva297

In a whole month in Japan, I have only heard one person ever say "sayounara". Prevalently used was "baibai" and "ki o tsukete". I think "sayounara" is actually a VERY uncommon way of saying goodbye in Japan.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

"Sayonara" is a somber, long-term "farewell". I'm not surprised you didn't come across it very much.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Tila176825

Have you seen this when you spell さようなら, ら is spelled like "ra" and when you say only ら (not into a word) it is spelled more like "la".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

The sound in Japanese is really the tap (a.k.a. flap), but it can sometimes sound like an American R or an L. A native Japanese speaker does not distinguish between these sounds.

A tap/flap is the sound in the middle of "water". It's not /t/ and it's not /d/. But we interpret it as like /d/ because the tap/flap is not a core sound in English.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Dark_Brown

I always say SAYONARA but here it had the U. So is it SAYOUNARA or SAYONARA.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PrismVelocity

The 'ou' combination in Japanese is whats called a "long vowel". The added 'u' is supposed to be a signal to extend the length of time that you pronounce that 'o'. At that point it often becomes a dipthong. So, "sayoonara" (notice the doubled 'o') or "sayounara" (which is apparantly more common) works, but not "sayonara" because that is too short an 'o'.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Inumaki-kun

“Sayonara America … Sayonara New York, but I’m not going to say” sayonara to you …. Ash."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JudAbuLeil

I how many letters are in Japan


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Are you asking about how many characters are in the Japanese writing system? Because they use 4 systems all told, and only rōmaji (the Roman alphabet they borrowed) is an alphabet with letters (26).

There's also hiragana and katakana, which are twin syllabaries that have 46 base syllables each. (The sound values are the same, but the characters are not interchangeable. There are rules regarding when to use which system.) We're learning hiragana right now.

Then there's kanji, which is a logographic system borrowed from Chinese. There are about 2,000-3,000 in common use in Japan.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/RianZafe

Why does it have う if it is only 4 syllables?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

It extends the "o" sound of "yo" into a long vowel -- a diphthong just like the long "o" in English. They spell it out explicitly in Japanese.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/PrismVelocity

Depending on how you look at it, the word is NOT 4 syllables long, but actually 5 syllables; OR it IS four syllables but the second syllable is pronounced with twice the duration of the others. It's a good idea to familiarize yourself with long vowels https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw0s7wUoQZg and double consonants https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oNgRjzc_-fc before you continue.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Idraote

It's four syllables and five moras


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lennart_BE

They both look like a '5'. How do you keep them apart? ちら


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

さ - sa

ち - chi

ら - ra

It's the two opposite-facing ones with the top stroke crossing the vertical stroke I have trouble remembering the difference between. The other one, none of the strokes intersect.

It's a bit like remembering the difference between p d g q. Practice, practice, practice.


https://s3.amazonaws.com/cdn.innovativelanguage.com/sns/em/content/lp/kana/hiragana_chart.jpg


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lennart_BE

Ok I see. How come there are two o's?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

を should be labeled as "wo". See how it's in the W column?

It's a historical quirk. These days, を is used exclusively as a grammar particle (it marks the direct object of the verb) and is never used when spelling words.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/h08l5

in ra (the 2nd one) the horizontal line is above the rest of the character (?) and in chi (the 1st one) thelines, umm, they cross

Thats kinda hard to explain, i hope you understand and i could help


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/K-Yennie

is there a simpler way to say goodbye?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

I'm not sure what you mean by "simpler". さようなら is a somber long-term good-bye. You can't substitute something like またね or じゃあね because it's too casual.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AntonioSou45770

This last letter when only has the sound of "DA", but in the phrase Sayonara it has a sound of "RA".

Are these sounds being pronounced correctly or not? Thank you.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

English ears hear "D" because the actual sound, the alveolar tap /ɾ/, is not a core sound in our language. We have it, but only as a variation on D and T, so we don't perceive it accurately.

In Japanese, the alveolar tap is a core sound of their language, and its variants are R and L. This is why Japanese speakers have trouble with the English R and L.

http://www.ipachart.com/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Anime_suki

Why is u used in the word, can't it just be sa-yo-na-ra. Why it is sa-yo-u-na-ra?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

In Japanese, the difference between pronouncing vowels and consonants for normal, short, and extra time makes all the difference in the meaning of the word, so they need to indicate this when they spell the words.

In Japanese as in English, /o/ pronounced long becomes the diphthong /oʊ/ and /e/ pronounced long becomes the diphthong /eɪ/.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KateFahr

The '-o' in 'yo' is extended; the 'u' indicates this.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/JoseMoreno539355

Why is there not an "I" after "sa" in sa-yo-u-na-ra but there is a "U" after "Yo"?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

In Japanese as in English, long え diphthongizes into えい and long お diphthongizes into おう. Unlike in English, this is directly reflected in how they spell the words.

The "a" in "sa" is not long.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/oSw9NE68

Is ら pronounced "da" or "ra"? When I hover over the character in the exercise I hear "da" but when I hear the word it sounds like "ra". In my hiragana printout it also says "ra" under the character.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
Mod
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  • 2612

We Anglicize it as "ra" but it's really the alveolar tap, which to our ears sounds very similar to /d/.

http://www.ipachart.com/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/EmVeddii

Pretty sure the sound made is sort of a mix between. It isn't rr or d. Those are Latin/Roman sounds


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Sumofadotdotdot

Couple questions I could use some help on.

First --nevermind that first one. I scanned through and saw an answer to it.

Secondly, when I hear an "r" sound it sounds like the person is rolling an l into an r. Is that how they say "r" sounds? I was trying to say an r in different ways and, for me at least, it sounds like sticking your tongue on the roof of your mouth then leading into whatever syllable. (re, ra ri) to list a few examples. Is that how you are supposed to say those syllables then?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

We Anglicize it as "ra" but it's really the alveolar tap, which to our ears sounds very similar to /d/.

http://www.ipachart.com/


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fabiana719337

yes, the r sound is supposed to sound like that. it's a bit tricky but if you train your mouth to say it you'll get it down in no time!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Max_The_Geek

I'm pretty sure you only want to use "さようなら" when talking to a boss or teacher, or when leaving for extended periods of time; with somebody you don't know. You should use しつれ します (Shitsure shimasu.) when talking to family or friends.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/cyanna.xoxo

-sobs in banana fish-


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ricardo782174

Why is there a う should it not be ちよなら


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

Nope, ちようなら is correct. Japanese has long and short sounds, and the spelling reflects that.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ricardo782174

Is う always used to prolong sounds (i know some romanji but im very new to hiragana)


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rae.F
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  • 2612

う is U and is only used to make お O long.
い is I and is only used to make え E long.

We do the same thing in English, we just don't usually write it. Say "no" and really draw it out. That's a diphthong--it starts with one vowel and ends with another. Say "play", nice and slowly. Same idea.

https://americanipachart.com/
Scroll down to "DIPHTHONGS: THE 5 VOWEL CLUSTERS OF STANDARD AMERICAN" and play /oʊ/ and /eɪ/.

https://www.tofugu.com/japanese/learn-hiragana/
http://www.easyjapanese.org/kana_img.html
http://japanese-lesson.com/characters/hiragana/hiragana_drill/index.html

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