"今日は、その赤いネクタイをしめてはいけません。"

Translation:Today, you cannot put on that red tie.

June 15, 2017

63 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/ImJustinMa

What is implying "you" over "I" in this sentence? Is it the ~てはいけません construction?

June 15, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Ant2r3s

I think it is. てはいけません is used for telling someone that they can't do something, so "you" makes more sense in this context

June 16, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/HadiAljish

Nope. ていけません CAN be used when you're talking about yourself.

June 17, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/hiba226886
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Yeah...but how often do you say 'hey self, you may not wear that red tie today!'

June 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/sebastianjraw
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It means more, "One must not", but taking into account the fact that we don't live in the 1890s, "You cannot" is a better interpretation. In Japanese personal pronouns are almost always implied and not directly stated, as it is a high context language. This means you'll find a lot of sentences that aren't explicit in their meaning. Hope that helps!

June 29, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Medusa747

Maybe you're replying to your wife as she helps you find clothes for work that day. "Honey, no. I can't wear that red necktie today. I already wore it yesterday."

August 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesTWils
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I am not sure if that would require the sense of "must not" of forbidding that various people say this has in Japanese.

August 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesTWils
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Unfortunately, I spilled salad dressing on it, so I cannot wear that red necktie today. I do not see anything here that indicates the speaker is addressing herself.

June 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JoshuaLore9

While I agree with your point, I thought I should mention that -てはいけません wouldn't be used in the example you gave.

-てはいけません refers to not being allowed to do something, as opposed to not being able to do something; a subtle difference in English which commonly uses "can" for both situations, but uses different verb structures in Japanese.

July 4, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Thomas292098

In this situation using the following would be more common both meaning "I cannot wear that red tie" (feeling of...it just cannot be done)

その赤いネクタイを締めることができません

その赤いネクタイを締められません

With of course the many various polite/casual iterations being possible also.

One may argue if you spilled something on it that you COULD techincally still wear it and instead should use a sentence more reflecting the lack of desire..but...thats for another time.

March 27, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/lcsondes

I do that every day, i.e., not wearing red ties.

July 13, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Julie592508

If Im telling my wife because she wants me to wear and I'm telling her I can't today.

January 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/kazeshinimeyo

You are not going to use the polite form with yourself. It looks and sounds funny. いけない is better when talking about yourself.

January 2, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/MatODonnel

Duolingo seems to use 'you' in every lesson with this, which is at least consistant for answering purposes. But, you can use this for talking about yourself, also.

June 21, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/philallthethings
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I'm trying to imagine the context this sentence would be used in... the tie is damp so he can't wear it in time for work? His buddy is already wearing a red tie to a party and doesn't wanna match? lol

June 24, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/XRavishX

It could be tacky. Your wife says you cannot, therefore you cannot.

July 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/drane2
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maybe it's a gang colors thing.

July 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/AndreasONN

Yo CJ, we only wear green ties around here!

August 5, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/QueenNeferure
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Today is purple tie Tuesday.

September 3, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/CaleGibbard

The sense of "cannot" here is "not allowed to", rather than "not able to". Maybe a political reason?

July 8, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/daeiribu
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How about a funeral? There seem to be strict colour rules in these kinds of situations...

November 21, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Fukurotaku

It's generally considered poor taste to wear ties soaked in the blood of your enemies on weekends. Weekdays are fine, though.

December 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Medusa747

You wore that tie yesterday. You don't want to wear it two days in a row.

August 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/AdrianWill829460

We are holding Yamada-san's funeral at the office today, so you cannot wear that inappropriately jubulant red tie of yours

August 9, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/drane2
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I agree. Today it simply wouldn't be appropriate for me to wear that read tie.

August 9, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Josh418775

Roooooooxanne

Don't put on the red tie

September 20, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/hiba226886
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今日は、その赤いにわとりをしめてはいけません。

June 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/V2Blast
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It's a necktie, not a chicken...

August 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/chebal
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鶏を絞める/とりをしめる/ = "To chicken a chicken"

January 12, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/ElenMiao
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It is a command so more likely you are speaking to someone else. Either way you'd say it the same. Pronouns are not often used in Japanese.

June 23, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Kiwodaku

While the て-form can be used in a request, てはいけない is not an example of that.

October 3, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Carlos88126

What about the use of その? I think that pretty much implies you're talking to someone other than yourself who is either holding the tie or already wearing it. Am I right? Of course, it could be that said person is showing it to your as an option for you to wear, but I don't think that would be the first interpretation that comes to one's mind when reading the sentence.

June 26, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/drane2
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I'm in my room getting dressed for the day, my gf is helping me, pointing out different ties I could wear. She points to one on a tie rack (adjust distance in your imagination to work with sono vs ano), "what about that red tie?" 「その赤いネクタイ?はどう?」I say to her 「今日は、その赤いネクタイをしめてはいけません。」I then explain to her that I can't wear that red tie today because I will be working at a career fair of a university who's main rival's color happens to be red, and it would be frowned upon. 「だって、今日はバークレーのキャリヤフォーラムに行く。そこで赤い服はだめだよ」

August 9, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/drane2
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Above should be adjusted so the formality levels line up, but otherwise seems sound to me.

August 14, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Cherain2

今日は、その赤いネクタイを締めてはいけません

September 13, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/ZombieNeith

You ain't the boss of me.

September 11, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/AnthonySan012

If I were talking to myself about not wearing that tie later today, tomorrow, etc. as a reminder, can this sentence still be used? Of course ,今日 will have to be changed to fit the scenario.

August 8, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JoshuaLore9

Yes? But only if you were being very adamant to yourself. It sounds odd that someone's internal monologue would be in such formal terms.

I'm not a native speaker, but I imagine that a Japanese person would normally remind themselves by saying something more like 「今日、その赤いネクタイはダメ」 or 「今日、その赤いネクタイはいけない」

August 10, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/LukeJanson

Eh

September 10, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JackRussian

Can one translate this sentence as: You MUST not... as well as You CANNOT...?

Thanks....

October 29, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Ohad333620
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Unless there's something physically preventing you from wearing it, you certainly CAN wear it. I'd say that "must not" ought to be an accepted answer.

September 12, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/loren.lalonde

Would "Today, that red tie is not allowed," be equivalent?

November 28, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Lloyd76445

you don't want to look like the president of the USA now, do you?

February 10, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/adezero

Isn't 締める pretty esoteric? Especially without the kanji, it's pretty hard to understand. I would rather use 着る, with kanji

August 14, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/IanCunning16

I was marked incorrect for putting 'You cannot wear a red tie today.' Does しめて only mean 'put on' rather than 'wear'?

September 15, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Alcedo-Atthis
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'wear' would be fine too. My guess is that they marked this as incorrect because you didn't translate その: "that". (it's not just "a(ny)" red tie, but a particular one)

September 16, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/Ryan32186
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There shouldn't be any difference. I agree, you should be correct

September 22, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/sledz2
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~Roxanne.... today you cannot put on that red tie, you walk the streets for money, you don't care what is wrong and what is right~

December 5, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/chartsman
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Is "shimeru" yet another verb for "putting on"? We've already had several of them...

January 25, 2019

https://www.duolingo.com/kisuke3

It can be either "you" or "I". The only reason it is "you" is because that is the only word box in the options. The translation that sounds most natural to me is "I'm not able to wear that red necktie today."

June 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Alcedo-Atthis
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A ~てはいけません construction has nothing to do with "being able to". It's "shouldn't" more than anything else. Yes, you can (if you want to get nitpicky) wear a red tie, but it's a "no go" (行けません = cannot go).

Therefore, such things are generally not said to oneself. If you want to say "I can't wear a red tie" it'd be 赤いネクタイをしめられない or some variation.

July 13, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesTWils
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It may not typically be said to oneself, but why could it not be said of oneself? My wife might very well want me to wear a tie she had bought me, and I might reply "Today, I cannot [should not, must not] put on that red tie."

July 13, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/JoshuaLore9

Just to point out to you and Steven, the ~てはいけません construction is used to indicate that doing something is "not permitted", and doesn't mean "should not".

In your example (which I think is a perfectly acceptable situation to use this sentence in, if you like using ます form with your wife :/), if you wanted to say "should not", you would say 締めない方がいい (lit. "it's better if you don't") or 締めるべきじゃない

August 10, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Mr.rM
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I don't get it. Maybe these sentences just express the same meaning with different nuance? “better not”, “must not”, “should not”, “not allowed”, “no good”… & subjectively or objectively? Is it possible that the nuance is not substantial to make a difference in some situations? I think I need a complete list of examples to fully understand it.

July 6, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JoshuaLore9

Well, first of all, I personally think all language is subjective anyway. For example, if I say something seemingly straightforward like "dog", you have your own image of what a typically dog is like (and even your own interpretation of how far something can vary away from that image until it's no longer called "dog").

That said, this is my interpretation of the differences between these words, which is by no means a complete list, and for the most part, I believe the differences are substantial enough to affect real communication in both languages, and definitely translation.

  • "must not"/"not allowed" ~して(は)いけません / ~して(は)いけない / ~してはダメです / ~しちゃダメ (in order of descending formality) indicates that an action is strongly prohibited, typically backed by some rule/law and/or authority, e.g. "you must not smoke anywhere in this aircraft"
  • "should not" ~するべきではありません / ~するべきではない indicates that an action is morally or socially disapproved of, e.g. "you shouldn't smoke in the house if you have children"
  • "better not"/"it's better if you don't" ~しない方がいい(です) indicates that an action might result in unfavorable or undesirable outcomes, e.g. "you had better not start smoking; quitting is much harder"
  • "cannot" ~できません / ~できない indicates that an action is not able to be performed due to some constraint/limitation, either physical or practical, e.g. "you cannot smoke underwater". To anyone who isn't super pedantic, both in English and Japanese, this idea of "constraint" is often broadened to include judicial (i.e. rules/laws), social, and moral constraints which overlaps with all the previous phrases and causes the ambiguitiy in these definitions.

That said (x2), I think that non-verbal communication is a huge part of communication and getting that right is more important than the exact words you choose to you, but nonetheless wording also has a not-insignificant impart, so ignoring or dismissing this nuance as "not substantial" may be detrimental to your ability to communicate effectively, in any language.

September 25, 2018

https://www.duolingo.com/JamesTWils
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Thanks. That definitely makes a social difference.

August 10, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/duovivo
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It's not a sentence that can only be said to oneself. If the speaker is explaining to another person a reason that the speaker is not permitted to perform a given action then the above sentence would be "Today I cannot put on that red tie."

December 9, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/drane2
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One thing no one has mentioned yet... Japanese has ambiguity「曖昧」built into it, more than other languages, which relies on context to resolve unspoken words. Without more context (a picture e.g.) I don't see how "I cannot" can be declared incorrect. It should be accepted as an alternative.

July 4, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/CaleGibbard

I agree.

July 8, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/Boettius

isn't the First word Hello 今日は?

June 25, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/somebody959678

こんにちは is never written in kanji. 今日 is always pronounced きょう.

July 5, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/rbenfield3
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Also, the pronunciation is different. When you are saying 'today', [今日は] is pronounce 'kyou wa' (きょうは). 'Hello' [今日は] is pronounced 'konnichi wa' (こんにちは).

June 28, 2017

https://www.duolingo.com/hiba226886
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Yes and no...they are both spelled the same but one way means today the other means hello. Context...and sometimes women spell hello like... '今日わ' when they're trying to be cute.

June 25, 2017
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