"There are three chairs in the room."
Translation:部屋に三つの椅子があります。
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Neat Fact: The Japanese automaker Mitsubishi uses this pronunciation of three in its name as 三（みつ）菱（びし）, meaning "Three Diamonds," hence the company's logo.
I love things like this, because now I'll never forget how to pronounce 三つ again! Thanks!
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There's a risk you'll end up thinking it's pronounced "mitsu", when in fact it's pronounced "mittsu".
三 looks suspiciously similar to ミ boom never have trouble with mi or 三つ and instant realization of the connection between kanji and katakana
I'm still waiting for someone to leave a four paragraph explanation on this
there are some set structures on how to count things in Japanese, in this case, duolingo is not leaving us to ignore the の particle in some sets of exercises while showing us at the same time you can do it in this particular exercise which is the exception for duolingo instead of the general rule
But in Japanese all these three are correct:
1) 部屋に・椅子が・三つ～あります
2) 部屋に・三つ椅子が・あります
3) 部屋に・三つの椅子が・あります
In this case duolingo is teaching you the one where is a different structure and you can skip the の particle as you would in casual speech (2nd example), if you try the same structure in the other exercises with the の particle (3rd example) duolingo will accept it as correct, yeah I know, annoying but they are the same thing. The 1st example is the one that duolingo regularly shows, also most people just skip the particle when using the second/third structure.
Here is an article someone else shared with me about this:
https://www.wasabi-jpn.com/japanese-grammar/how-japanese-counting-systems-work-in-a-sentence/
Thanks for all your hefty but easy to read explanations!
Any chance you could clarify one more thing for me? I was expecting this example to follow some of the others in the lesson and use 部屋には。 Is there a fundamental difference in meaning between this and just saying 部屋に？
I was wondering this myself. I know は marks the room (部屋) as the subject and I left it out on purpose to see if it was still ok not to use it. I wasnt expecting the suggested answer to only use に and not には.
Is it personal preference when to omit a は particle like this or are there times it would be wrong to omit it?
What I've gathered from other comments, it's about emphasis. The noun with が is always the subject but marking 部屋 as the topic with は brings more attention to it. 台所に椅子が一つあります。 でも、部屋には三つあります。 There is one chair in the kitchen. However, in the ROOM there are THREE chairs.
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I think it is because you are using ga to mark the chairs instead. Hopefully someone can elaborate further, such as for emphasising that the chairs are in the room and not just that there are chairs.
Thank you for such a quick response and clearing some things up! I know for the most part little grammatical slips won't destroy what I'm trying to say. So any Japanese I converse with will be forgiving as I am new haha
Thank you! Youre always very helpful.
I did also get the answer right with : 部屋には椅子が三つあります
Really appreciate your insight on this! I'm trying to understand は／が...
If someone had said there were three tables in the room and i wanted to emphasize that there are three desks in the room, kind of as a correction so the focus is on the desks, could i say the following:
三つの机は部屋にあります
Another baffling and wildly unfair move on Duolingo's part to suddenly not accept "[setting]に[thing]が[number]つあります" after multiple lessons of accepting it every time, and to offer literally zero guidance or warning on the change beforehand. This happens often enough that I'm considering cancelling Premium and going the げんき 1 & 2 route instead. I appreciate all the thorough explanation in this thread, though.
The lesson says that if a counter precedes a noun, の is introduced while in the correct translation we have 三ついす without の. The lesson is misleading. When exactly do we need to place の and when not?
一つ hitotsu 二つ futatsu 三つ mittsu 四つ yotsu 五つ itsutsu 六つ muttsu 七つ nanatsu 八つ yattsu 九つ kokonotsu
You better remember those
Elsewhere, Comment 30011199 for "There are three windows in the room" has には following room, whereas this phrase has only に. Why? The only difference I see is room spelled with katakana (へや) there vs. kanji (部屋) here. Is there more to it than this? Is it related to the fact that the windows are permanent parts of the room, whereas chairs are transient/moveable objects? Please advise. Thanks!
when you use には you are stressing that the room is the topic of the sentence, but in this case, although it is kinda implied that the room is the topic is not nearly as strong as the other one.
Something like:
「部屋に三つ椅子があります」"there are 3 chairs in the room".
「部屋には三つ椅子があります」"as for the inside of the room (and not somewhere else), there are 3 chairs".
In English is probably the same, but in Japanese is a subtle difference. Sometimes you do this if there is no context before you are saying the sentence, is kinda like the difference between telling someone out of nowhere that there are 3 chairs in the room and responding to someone that's asking about something related.
Both should be accepted though since there is no difference in the English one.
I believe both should be acceptable. Other than there is a space between 部屋 and に in your second answer. If you copied and pasted it and got it wrong that may be the reason.
No, it's a bit like saying 'In the room, there are chairs three' all the necessary bits are there to be able to understand it's just a weird way to structure the sentence. You can say '部屋に三ついすがあります' 'In the room, there are three chairs.
It's an example of adverbial usage of '三つ' which doesn't accept が after itself. There's also different accent with this usage, but that's another topic.
I believe both would be accepted but they slightly change the emphasis on the room. Using just に is like saying "There are 3 chairs in the room." VS using には would be closer to "As for the room, there are 3 chairs."
As far as I know, both are OK, but には is used more when you want to specify the room as the main topic. Also, には is more common when making a negative statement as well.
Please correct me if I am wrong.
Some one needs to really explain this grammar rule. When does it come into play? This is opposite of everything duolingo has been teaching us. I know japanese pretty well and im pretty sure the subject almost always goes first in the sentence ( and marked by は or が, though subjects that are already understood can and probably will be ommitted)
Nope. Unless chairs are doing something. Like: 部屋で三つの椅子が踊っている (There are three dancing chairs in th room)
That is what I was thinking since there is no action referring to the location.
I think counters are supposed to be placed before the noun referred to. And i think it's the same as in Chinese.
As for the 'room', japanese seems to require setting the location / timeframe of a simple statement before anything else.
Do you have any specific questions that haven't been answered on this page?
We can't help if we don't know what you need help with
The seemingly arbitrary requirement for the の particle in this exercise is ridiculously confusing. This was by far the worst lesson I've done on Duolingo to date.
The explanation here is clear and seems authoritative: http://www.yesjapan.com/YJ6/question/959/is-it-common-to-use-the-no-particle-with-counters
Actually, according to Japanese grammar you have to use の if counter is used as a modifer, but you don't use it if it's used as an adverb (副詞). In more simple words: if counter goes before the noun it counts - you use の; if it's right before the verb - you don't put anything; if it's before です - you also don't put anything (because there's nothing to modify, or because です is considered as a helping verb)
"椅子が部屋に三つあります" was marked wrong. Is there a rule, perhaps, that location phrases must be placed before subject marker phrases?
I believe your sentence is a valid one, but the phrasing feels like you're stressing the chairs rather than what's in the room. (Which may be what you're after.) Yours sounds like: "As for chairs, in the room there are three of them." Duo's is more like: "In the room there are [the] three chairs."
Duolingo's translation seems to use a fixed list behind the scenes, so variations in phrasing -- even correct ones -- may or may not be accepted. Getting marked wrong doesn't mean you're wrong. (We can only hope, I guess, that the opposite isn't also true.)
Why is this happen?, When 部屋に 椅子が 三つあります Is correct, and sometimes is this 部屋には 椅子が三つあります Also correct. What's that には supposed to?
I know that へやに三ついすがあります。is the answer, but i've been writing へやにいすが三つあります。and that is also accepted. Is there any actual difference between the two?
In Japanese when you are counting things you can do it by using an extension of the verb like「Aが・3つ～ある」or you can be specific about the number of things that exists as「3つのAが・ある」and there is usually no difference between both, but you can only express delimitation with the second structure. For example in the movie「七人の侍」"The seven samurai" the specifics of this group can only be expressed by the second structure because these are not any seven samurais, they are these seven ones and not more, not others.
「部屋に三つ椅子があります」is that kind of structure with a の being omitted「部屋に三つの椅子があります」. Without context, it would mean the same as the other structure.
Why do you put には when writing something like 部屋には椅子が四つあります。but just put に when the counter is directly after the "place"
Why are there sooo many different ways to say this sentence? Its confusing when they dont explain it throught the whole lesson and then I'm expected to know that i need a の in my sentence instead of a は and that the number comes first suddenly? Tbh its not only this lesson but all of them. Duolingo got some quirks to iron out still, only 10 years old as an app :/
Tranlated that means “chairs, three”. It’s not a sentence as at is and has no grammatical construct. みつの椅子があります、or 椅子がみつあります
三つ 【みっつ】just mean three things, ～つ is the counter for things as you are counting chairs. The system is called Wago while the other one you probably has seen as in いち、に、さん、よん is the Kango system
Here is a good article about this:
It says the right answer is "へやに三ついすがあります” but that doesn't seem right... 三つ椅子? I thought that structure would need the の particle?
One of the comments I was replying to has a great explanation! TyrantRC breaks it down nicely. Basically this is a more informal version of the speech, omitting the の particle. :) so Duolingo is showing us an exception rather than a rule. Which confused the absolute hell out of me lol.
Why is 部屋に椅子は三つあります wrong? "Speaking of chairs in the room, there are three." - wouldn't it be this and therefore acceptable?
it's not really wrong but you are stressing a contrast between the chairs that are in the room and other possible items, this sounds weird for Japanese people unless there is some context behind.
Whenever you are using ある to indicate possession or existence, the usual thing is to mark the "be-er" with が in this case the thing that's being in the room is the chairs. Since the Japanese ear is expecting a が there, if you use は the contrast is more apparent and while this can be done on purpose on certain sentences, this one sounds generic enough to me to not be needed.
If you are still confused, take for example the sentence「椅子がある」this is the most basic sentences you can do with ～がある、it means "there are chairs", then you add a counter to be specific to how many ones you have「3つの椅子がある」this means "there are chairs to the point of three", then you add the location or topic to be explicit on what you are talking about「部屋に3つの椅子がある」"in the room, there are chairs to the point of three".
「椅子は部屋に3つあります」means "as for chairs (and not other things) there are three in the room" and it gives the feeling that maybe you just counted the tables or something else.
My answer was 部屋に三つの椅子があります. And it was accepted. I found out about how to use の, when I search on google translate what is 6 things in Japanese and it answered 六つのこと, whatever koto is.
For anyone who's having trouble with this; here's my way to understand this.
(Heya Ni) In The Room (Mitsu No) Three Exist (Isu Ga) The Chairs I Am Referring To (Arimasu) There Are
部屋に椅子が三つあります。was accepted for me which I feel is also right but compared to the other answer の was used. I guess I need to practice more to understand genuinely when の would be best used since in this case I did not use it.
Always learning boys.
why does "I Su" come after "no"? Especially after doing these "x in room" sentences for a while without using "no" at all.
To the best of my knowledge, で (when talking about a location) is used to talk about a location where an action is taking place. Existing isn't considered an action so you don't use で. If somebody can explain it more clearly that would be great. https://japanese.stackexchange.com/questions/60/particles-%E3%81%AB-vs-%E3%81%A7
In all questions it was with Room being the first, the subject the second in this case the "chairs" and after that the number. Why the other way around this time? Or is it simply supposed to show an alternative way, because that confused me. Soory if it has already been answered and I'm just being a blind fish.
If you it as "heya ni isu ga hitsu no arimasu" how does become wrong? Can anyone pls tell me?
One time leaving out の was wrong, next time without の it was correct. As both were correct, is there a slight difference in meaning? 部屋 三つ 椅子か あります。 部屋 三つ の 椅子か あります。
why is " isu no heya ga mitsu arimasu" wrong? i did that structure given there was no "niwa" as an option
That says something like "three chair rooms exist"
の is a genitive particle that links nouns together
椅子の部屋 then becomes the noun phrase "the chair room" or "the room of chairs" with "chair" modifying "room"
が then marks the do-er or be-er of an action, so it marks "the chair room" as the subject that exists
In the given answer at the top of this page:
部屋に三つの椅子があります
に marks a location of existence
部屋に - in the room
の links the quantity to the noun it is describing "three chairs"
が then marks "three chairs" as the subject
三つの椅子が - three chairs
あります - exist
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Since there was a の available I started to type an answer it might have accepted and then scrolled up and saw that was the answer it wanted.
It might not have had a には but it should still have had a に which you would need to play after 部屋 to say that it is in the room that you are talking about.
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If using の as "of" then it would be reversed and so "chairs of three" (which is kinda understandable). Like 私の妹 is "my little sister"/"my sister".
To simplify things: ～つ can be used almost for anything, like real objects, abstract ideas etc. The only pitfall is that using つ you can count up to 10 only . ～個 counter also can be used for a lot of things, though in general preferable usage is with real objects. Also, it's often used as a 'default' counter when other counters don't fit. For example, you have 枚 for flat things, 本 for long cylindrical things, but what if you have something round? In that case you can use 個
Why is "there are 3 windows in this room" = "heya niwa mado ga mitsu arimasu" (room in the window three are?) but "there are 3 chairs in the room" = "heya ni mitsu no isu ga arimasu" (room in three chairs there are?)? Have I missed something? Why is "three" before the object instead of after here?
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It is another way of writing it. If you attach it to the noun then you need to also include の otherwise you put it at the end.
Why does one time i think it accepts 'isu no mitsu ga' but now they corrected it with 'mitsu no isu ga' ??? Can someone please helpme.
'isu no mitsu ga' would be grammatically incorrect.
There are two structures for counting things;
- Where you use the counter adverbially. This goes after the noun being counted and before the verb.
Subject が Amount Verb
椅子が三つあります
が follows 'chairs' because 'chairs' is the thing doing the verb of 'exist' here.
三つ (mittsu) as a counter is an adverb directly modifying the existence verb.
This is more literally something like "Chairs [exist as an amount of three]
- Modifying the noun directly through the use of genitive particle の
Amount の Subject が Verb
三つの椅子があります
が still follows "chairs" because that is still the thing existing.
Here though the counter is directly modifying the noun "chairs" instead of the verb through the use of the particle の.Remember in an AのB phrase, B is your root word and A is the modifier. "A's B" or "B of A". In 三つの椅子 the quantity "three" is modifying the noun "chairs". Swapping them would not make sense.
More literally "[An amount of three chairs] exist"
いくつ is the question word "How many" which is not present in this sentence.