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"I study with my friend on Sundays."

Translation:日曜日は友達と勉強します。

June 26, 2017

71 Comments


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/burnsbs

What does the し do?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/fukai20

It's from the verb する (to do), but in ます form. So you have べんきょう, which I understand isn't a verb, and put the する after it and kind of make it a verb. I know it's used with a lot of foreign words, but I'm not sure how often it's used with others.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

If it is an action noun, it will have a high chance that you can put する after it to make it as a verb.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/borffffff

Why is it "勉強します" and not "勉強をします?"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

Because it is a compound verb made by adding a noun to the verb します - this is very common in Japanese. 勉強します - to study, そうじ します - to clean, りょうり します - to cook, けんぶつ します - to sightsee or to go sightseeing. を is not used because べんきょう is not the object of the verb - it's part of the verb. Noun + する = compound verb.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/jhol0613

Doesn't the lesson say that the を is optional in these cases? Sometimes Duo seems to accept it


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Some things to think about whether を should be used:

1) Not all nouns can become "suru verbs". If you look on jisho.org, you'll see that "benkyou" is listed as a "suru verb", meaning 勉強 (benkyou) is a noun meaning "study" and 勉強します (benkyou shimasu) is a verb meaning "study". The word "tenisu" is not listed as a "suru" verb, so テニス (tenisu) is a word that means "tennis", but in Japanese you can't just make "tenisu" into a verb, you have to say "do tennis (play tennis)", テニスをします (tenisu o shimasu), where "tenisu" is the object of the verb and needs to be marked by を.

2) You can say 勉強します (benkyou shimasu) or 勉強をします (benkyou o shimasu), but the grammar and nuance is slightly different. 勉強します is a verb meaning "study". 勉強をします has "benkyou" as the object of the verb "shimasu", making the meaning "do studying".

3) People drop particles in speech all the time, even though it is not grammatically correct.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

Just a note that we can say 買い物する (jisho.org is not correct). https://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/jn/37086/meaning/m0u/%E8%B2%B7%E3%81%84%E7%89%A9/

Basically most of the action nouns can be used as [object]+を+[noun]+する or [object]+の+[noun]+をする if it is transtive


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Thank you for pointing that out. I'm a bit confused, though, because I thought kaimono was a suru verb and brought it up in another thread, and another user looked it up in their dictionary and said it wasn't listed as a suru verb.

Weblio says "買い物をする" and Sanseido says it is not a suru verb. Kotobank says it is.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

hmm 買い物する sounds natural enough to me so I am sure the usage is ok. I tried to find out an example where the noun + する is natural to me but the dictionaries say otherwise. An example is デュエル (duel) where I find people say デュエルする (mostly with all sorts of card games). On the other hand for the word テニス (tennis), I feel unnatural to say テニスする (The goo dictionary does not say it can, so it is good). Well I think we can stick to any dictionary but just bear in mind it is more conservative that what people are using.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

My issue is that everything sounds okay to me without を because I'm so used to native speakers dropping particles, so I'm really trying to understand the correct usage. I wonder if 買い物 didn't used to be a する verb but has become one...

Sports are a great example of non-suru nouns, so I'll edit my original post to avoid confusion, thanks for all your help!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Amodeus_R.

Why not 日曜日に?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

When you talk about a habit (something you do every Sunday), it's better to use は, and when you talk about one specific time (this Sunday only) it's better to use に. Either can be correct, though.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kana332264

This is why understanding grammar and connotations is so very important.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/stepanmosh

It told me I am wrong when I typed 日曜日は私の友達と勉強します。I can't understand what's the problem there.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Fap.G

Same problem here. I guess it's just unnatural to say the 私の referring to your own friend, as people will guess you don't learn with THEIR friend although you don't know them. It's more likely to add a (someone)の when you're not talking about your own friends ore stuff.

Anyway, I think Duo should accept it, as it is not grammatically incorrect - and when you're hovering over the "my", it still makes you think that you should add 私の (as the Japanese lessons here are still not developed well enough to differ translation of words in different context, as you can see with the kanji pronunciation).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KrazyTako

really confusing since in another sentence their answer had 私の友達 in it...


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Ameryst

How do you know you will study every Sunday, as opposed to next Sunday only?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

If you were studying every Sunday then nichiyoubi would be modified/preceded by maishuu no - meaning (of) every week. If you were saying next Sunday you would likewise have a qualifier - in this instance raishuu no nichiyoubi - Sunday (of) next week.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/CoreyTappan

Is を Ok here instead of と?It is my understanding that を Represents action


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

を (instead of と) here would be incorrect. を follows the direct object of the verb (ie. in this case it would be what you are studying), however there is no direct object in this sentence - the sentence does not state what you are studying with your friends, just that you study with friends on Sunday. If you were to replace と with を you would make your friends the direct object of the verb and the sentence would mean I study my friend(s) on Sundays. と follows nouns to show whom you are performing an action WITH - in this case, the speaker states that they study WITH friends on Sundays. Please also note my and KeithWong's comments above in response to a query with a similar mistake.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Axe609

So if I'm understanding right. 日よう日は友だちと英語をべんきょうします would be the right way to say "On Sunday I am studying English with my friends" as を makes the idea of studying become about English?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

を makes English (or whatever it follows) the direct object of the verb.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DreVinci

@Axe609 that's correct. In the original answer, if you were to replace と with を, that would change the sentence to mean "I will study my friend on Sunday".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kana332264

To be literal, を indicates direct object of action OR indicates subject of causative expression​ in most common cases. It has quite a few other applications, but those are what you see in most cases.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Lucas462436

is 日曜日友達と勉強しています wrong? i learn that "ています" form can be use to describe routinely actions, since he study with his friend Sundays, looks like a routine.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

I think ok, but it would be better if the English is "I am studying with my friend on Sundays" because I believe English has the similar continuous tense usage.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kana332264

If you want to talk implications "I am studying with my friend on sundays" means that it's a set activity that cannot be changed. "I study with my friend on sundays" would imply that it's a common activity, but it's fine to make other plans.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DustInCompetent

What's wrong about 日よう日友だちとはべんきょうします?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

you don't need that は after the と


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

If you want to put the 友だちと as the subject, normally it should come in front of the sentence. i.e. 友だちとは日曜日に一緒に勉強します


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DustInCompetent

But it's not wrong, is it? Also, I read that は can be omitted after the day. Duolingo didn't accept my translation.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

Duo didn't accept your sentence because they have a specific sentence and specific grammatical constructions/words in mind that they are trying to teach with that sentence in mind. This is very common with Duo - the other day someone asked why instead of changing the ending of a verb so that it meant 'and' and could join two sentences together Duo wouldn't accept joining two sentences together using そして. I responded that likely it is because Duo is trying to teach us that you can change the endings of verbs so that they act like a conjunction and can be used to join sentences together, whereas if Duo wanted to teach how to join sentences together using actually conjunctions then their sentence would be acceptable. Make sense?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/TyrantRC

「日曜日は友達と勉強します」

【にちようびは・ともだちと・べんきょうします】

The と particle here expresses mutuality, it's translated as "with".

also if you want to memorize 日曜日 the first kanji 日 is the one for "sun" and "day", couple with 曜日 "day of the week" is literally Sunday.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

It should be ni, not wa because it's indicating a specific time.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

に is optional for most of the time/date words. は is also optional as it is just marking the topic for discussion.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KansaiBene

日曜日に Implies that it will happen on Sunday, and not on Sundays in general.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/ArielHor

Which part of this sentence is saying that apart from my friend, I am also studying with him/her?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/rayzorblade23

That would be the と particle, meaning with and and as far as I know. It's also implied that the speaker is the subject of the sentence. Corrections on this are welcome.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

No part of the sentence is saying that you are studying with a male or female friend. It just states that the speaker is studying with a friend.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kana332264

I believe 毎週日曜日は友達をべんきょうします should be accepted. The "wo" adds emphasis on "my friend" as opposed to "I study with friend"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

Your sentence translates to English as: "Every week, on Sunday, I study my friend."

So definitely it has a different meaning as "On Sundays, I study with my friend."


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Kana332264

KeithWong is correct and i was wrong.

That being said, it does not accept "every sunday" as an answer even when it is written correctly without wo


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

That's because the original sentence doesn't say EVERY sunday - just on Sundays in general - maybe they miss some Sundays or they only study every other Sunday, so they're not studying every Sunday.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

Agreed KeithWong - I was just about to say that putting を after 友達 makes it the direct object of べんきょうします - which means I study my friend instead of I study WITH my friend. Also I believe there should be a の between 毎週 and 日曜日 - Sunday (of) every week.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Rhodii

Sorry, but what's the "to" (と) for in the sentence?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

と following a noun - specifically a noun that is a living creature - human/animal indicates that you are carrying out a certain action WITH that noun. For example if you were walking with your dog then と would follow dog to indicate that you were walking with your dog - 犬と 散歩します, or if you were talking on the phone with your mum - 毎日母と でんわで 話します - I talk on the phone with my mum every day - here と follows 母 to indicate that 'mum' is the person that you are talking with. Also, scroll up and have a look through all the comments above, と and its function in this sentence has been queried and discussed at length in the above comments.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shadronsoul

Can someone tell me what's the difference between hiragana characters よ and ょ (the last one is a bit smaller). I keep getting failures because I don't have the smaller hiragana yo character in my sentence. I'm so confused. Shouldn't there be just one よcharacter and that's all?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shadronsoul

I forgot to mention that if I just type yo on my Japanese Windows IME it transforms it to the hiragana letter よ. If I want to have the smaller one I need to scroll throught all the suggestions to the bottom to get that smaller one for my sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

Try typing lyo or xyo. If you want べんきょう, then you type "bennkyou"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/shadronsoul

Ok, thanks. Still I can't entirely understand why are there 2 different characters for it but this helps a lot!


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KeithWong9

The small ょ is used to modify the sound of the previous sound, in this case き (ki) + ょ (yo) -> きょ (kyo). The number of time measures becomes 1 for きょ (kyo) instead of 2 as in きよ (kiyo).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vbnzq

Here is "one friend" in question and "tomodati" in correct answer. That confuses me.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Most nouns in Japanese are both singular and plural. 友達 (tomodachi) can mean "one friend" or "friends".


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/HaruhiSuzu6

Why is there a と after 友だち?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

It means with in this instance and it follows 友だち to show that the speaker is performing the action with his/her friend (s).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Marcus171079

I know it hasn't been taught yet. But shouldn't the てform be used if you want to say that it happens every sunday? 日曜日は友だちと勉強しています? Otherwise, doesnt it just say 'i will study with a friend on sunday'?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

-masu form can be the future tense, or it can be the present tense when talking about a habit. The -te form means that you are doing something right now.

勉強します。 (benkyou shimasu)

[future] I will study.

[present] I study (as a regular habit).

勉強しています。(benkyou shite imasu)

[present progressive] I am studying (right now).


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/KallenX

友達とは日曜日に勉強します?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

Time related information, including days, is usually placed at the start of a sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/SeanFogart4

The tile for 達 gets read aloud as とおる in the man's voice. This is a reading for names only (名乗り) which surely is irrelevant . . .


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Contributors aren't able to control the reading that the TTS chooses and have asked us to report problems with audio with the methods described here: https://forum.duolingo.com/comment/32352336


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/MichaelGal160845

I switched study and friends, why doesn't that work?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/AnaLydiate

Basic word in English is subject verb object and while 'with my friends' is not the object here 'I' is the subject and 'study' the verb so 'I study' should come first in the sentence.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Neko9Salad

if i want to make the topic of the sentance a person rather than 日曜日, would it be like this for example? : "彼は日曜日に友達と勉強します"


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

Yes, that's possible.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/DianeTomasi

日曜日は私の友達と勉強します - why is 私の here marked as wrong?


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/IsolaCiao

It probably hasn't been added to the database because most Japanese speakers tend to drop possessive pronouns. If you submitted an error report, it should be added.


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/vitorpdsg

why is it not 勉強をします??


https://www.duolingo.com/profile/Raspymorten

I had to take like a month or two off studying Japanese due to some personal stuff, and boy is it hard to get back in. But I'm gonna keep trying.

Anyway, would like... "On Sundays, My friends and I study together" be the more direct Japanese to English translation here?

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